Untie Fanatacism, Bane and Purify from stances

[sephiroth1084]

Unyielding Sentinel feels rather oddly constructed--we get three, mutually exclusive stances, each with a different situational use, which is fine, but then we have a bunch of enhancements that are tied to those stances, but aren't necessarily in line with the situations for which we'd want to use each stance.

Right now, we have Bane of Undeath (attacks are Undead Bane) tied to Vigor of Battle, Fanaticism (attacks are True Law or True Chaos) tied to Unbreakable, and Purify Weapon and Anoint Weapon tied to Stand Against the Tide, but which sort of removes the versatility to be had from the option of the three different stances.

On top of that, US is sorely lacking in twistable features: if you aren't a paladin, you probably aren't going to touch any of the enhancements that deal with Smite Evil or Lay On Hands, and if you aren't a paladin or cleric, you won't be interested in the Turn Undead enhancement line. If you don't use a shield, that cuts out another chunk of possibilities, then Bane, Fanaticism and Purify are all tied to being in a stance that you can only use if you're in Unyielding Sentinel.

While leveling through this destiny, what I find is that I'm tending to shy away from those enhancements, because I don't want to feel tied to any one stance, and because they don't let me plan my gear around having those effects available. A capstone paladin can make certain gear choices around their ability to have all of their weapons bypass DR/Good, but a US will only be able to do so in certain stances. Then it becomes a question of whether you want Stand Against the Tide for the damage/DR breaking, or the HP and healing amp, or DR and PRR from Unbreakable. In some fights, it won't be too tough a decision, but if the enemy you're fighting is moving around a lot, or if you're fighting a number of enemies, Tide just isn't very appealing otherwise.

And the carrier enhancements don't really fit thematically with the stances they're tied to very well. Also note that Fury of the Wild has a twistable enhancement that grants Cold Iron and Chaotic Outsider Bane to all of your weapons, regardless of stance, and without alignment prerequisites.

My suggestion:

Bane of Undeath - Enhancement grants Undead Bane on your attacks, and if you're in Vigor stance, you gain Negative Energy Absorption 20% (or immunity to level drain, or a chance to ignore or get rid of negative levels; or the Lightbringer effect for a damage-less Disruption effect).

Fanaticism- Enhancement grants either True Law or Absolute Chaos on your attacks, and if you're in Unbreakable stance, you gain DR 10/Law or DR 10/Chaos. This provides you with DR 10/ epic and lawful/chaotic, for some extra protection. Conversely, it could grant additional PRR against opposite-aligned opponents, or...something else.

Purify/Anoint Weapon - Enhancement grants Pure Good/Holy on your attacks, and if you're in Tide stance, you gain Good Burst/Good Blast; as an alternative your attacks could bypass 10%/15% Fortification.

[RadioactivePiranha]

If they weren't tied to stances, you could get holy, pure good, true law, and undead bane on all your weapons. That is a lot. I agree with you though on not liking the stance dependence.

Perhaps a better way would be to have some multiple enhancement selectors, not stance dependent. You could pick one bane (undead, evil outsider, maybe aberration?) and one alignment (holy, axiomatic, anarchic) not counter to your own. Although if that was done there would probably be one obvious choice.

[sephiroth1084]

If they weren't tied to stances, you could get holy, pure good, true law, and undead bane on all your weapons. That is a lot. I agree with you though on not liking the stance dependence.

Perhaps a better way would be to have some multiple enhancement selectors, not stance dependent. You could pick one bane (undead, evil outsider, maybe aberration?) and one alignment (holy, axiomatic, anarchic) not counter to your own. Although if that was done there would probably be one obvious choice.

I honestly don't believe that having all of that would be overpowered, given what some other characters get, but if it were, then there are ways to ensure that doesn't come up...maybe they each exist as a stance as well where you can have only one alignment or bane active? Or one alignment and one bane?

Really, though, +4d6 damage per swing, where 1d6 doesn't work on anything Lawful, and 2d6 doesn't work on anything non-evil isn't game-breaking. Adding +2d6+2 to that vs. undead shouldn't make it too strong, either. Given how little offensive Unyielding Sentinel has overall, particularly when compared to the other destinies, this doesn't seem too bad. And as far as twisting goes, you can't get Holy (tier V), and spending three twists on a tier IV, a tier III and a tier I ability costs a lot, both in regards to time/effort and the opportunity cost of not getting other twists.

[DarkForte]

If they weren't tied to stances, you could get holy, pure good, true law, and undead bane on all your weapons. That is a lot. I agree with you though on not liking the stance dependence.

6d6 damage on swing is hardly game-breaking considering how little US has in the way of DPS when compared to fury or dreadnought. Remember, if you want to hold aggro, you need DPS too!

[SilkofDrasnia]

Unyielding Sentinel feels rather oddly constructed--we get three, mutually exclusive stances, each with a different situational use, which is fine, but then we have a bunch of enhancements that are tied to those stances, but aren't necessarily in line with the situations for which we'd want to use each stance.

Right now, we have Bane of Undeath (attacks are Undead Bane) tied to Vigor of Battle, Fanaticism (attacks are True Law or True Chaos) tied to Unbreakable, and Purify Weapon and Anoint Weapon tied to Stand Against the Tide, but which sort of removes the versatility to be had from the option of the three different stances.

On top of that, US is sorely lacking in twistable features: if you aren't a paladin, you probably aren't going to touch any of the enhancements that deal with Smite Evil or Lay On Hands, and if you aren't a paladin or cleric, you won't be interested in the Turn Undead enhancement line. If you don't use a shield, that cuts out another chunk of possibilities, then Bane, Fanaticism and Purify are all tied to being in a stance that you can only use if you're in Unyielding Sentinel.

While leveling through this destiny, what I find is that I'm tending to shy away from those enhancements, because I don't want to feel tied to any one stance, and because they don't let me plan my gear around having those effects available. A capstone paladin can make certain gear choices around their ability to have all of their weapons bypass DR/Good, but a US will only be able to do so in certain stances. Then it becomes a question of whether you want Stand Against the Tide for the damage/DR breaking, or the HP and healing amp, or DR and PRR from Unbreakable. In some fights, it won't be too tough a decision, but if the enemy you're fighting is moving around a lot, or if you're fighting a number of enemies, Tide just isn't very appealing otherwise.

And the carrier enhancements don't really fit thematically with the stances they're tied to very well. Also note that Fury of the Wild has a twistable enhancement that grants Cold Iron and Chaotic Outsider Bane to all of your weapons, regardless of stance, and without alignment prerequisites.

My suggestion:

Bane of Undeath - Enhancement grants Undead Bane on your attacks, and if you're in Vigor stance, you gain Negative Energy Absorption 20% (or immunity to level drain, or a chance to ignore or get rid of negative levels; or the Lightbringer effect for a damage-less Disruption effect).

Fanaticism- Enhancement grants either True Law or Absolute Chaos on your attacks, and if you're in Unbreakable stance, you gain DR 10/Law or DR 10/Chaos. This provides you with DR 10/ epic and lawful/chaotic, for some extra protection. Conversely, it could grant additional PRR against opposite-aligned opponents, or...something else.

Purify/Anoint Weapon - Enhancement grants Pure Good/Holy on your attacks, and if you're in Tide stance, you gain Good Burst/Good Blast; as an alternative your attacks could bypass 10%/15% Fortification.

Agreed !