Divine and solar phoenix post motu

[MaxwellEdison]

My favorite healing amp build is 18/2 monk with a monk splash.

[Funny_looking_mole]

I have a Solar phoenix variant (12/7/1 Pally/Monk/Arti) of my own design. And I am often surprised how much DPS I can put out, I am often topping the kill counts even with undying sentinel tree. However that is mostly because I have pretty much every item I want for my toon (at least before the expansion). And I know that I have taken DPS hits to increase my survivability (using Epic Jidz instead of the Epic bracers of the claw for example). But I have found that my DPS at every gear level was respectable (not max dps barb level, but better than my Lord of Blades FvS build with similar gear levels).

However I think the main strength of the build isn't in it's DPS but it's adaptability and self sufficiency. I have a lot of experiences where I am the last man standing and was able to pull a win out, such as when I came back from LD at the end of old epic fathom and everyone was dead, solo'd the last 5 sahuagin, rezzed the last person still in the group, put up a new LFM and completed. Or being able to tank the Spinner of Shadows in epic SoS with no outside healing. My build is also able to do traps, scroll heal, rez the dead etc.

[Jaid314]

sure, i'm not questioning that the build can solo extremely well, that it can survive almost anything (especially with some of the epic destiny options to not even fail saves on a 1), that it can be an incredible benefit to a party, or anything like that. but i'd bet with a similar amount of gear farming, you'd find your DPS on other characters would be much, much greater.

now, you don't always need to have massive DPS. in fact, most of the time your DPS doesn't make the difference between success or failure, but rather simply decides how fast you succeed (though that isn't to say that it *never* has an affect, either).

however, DPS is simply not a strong point for the build. you can get adequate DPS. certainly, you can replace the typical pug melee which as far as i can tell are generally not all that great. and the other stuff the build offers can definitely make a huge difference.

but... compared to a high DPS build, played well, with similar gear, your DPS is very, very bad. a well-equipped, well-played phoenix will certainly outDPS the average PuG member, even if that PuG member is a potentially high DPS build like a rogue assassin or a barbarian, or a fighter, or even a nuking sorcerer. but then, the same can be said of almost anything else too... badly-played classes with little to no thought put into the design (or ones that simply start with the wrong design goals) are not a valid comparison point. i've grouped with mechanic rogues that used throwing knives as their only weapon, and thought their contribution in disarming traps was more than enough. if i was to use them as a comparison point, i suspect even my spellsinger bard with 14 base strength, very little strength/DPS gear, and no melee feats even starts to look pretty good as a DPS when i start swinging a rahl's might. that doesn't mean my bard is good DPS or even decent DPS. it just means there's worse out there.

also, i'll say it again: if you solo even semi-regularly (that is, if you split off with the rest of the group going one way while you go another), you will get a higher kill count. this likely accounts for a sizeable portion of your kill-count dominance on a phoenix build; the fact that you can just go off on your own killing stuff leads to you getting a surprising amount of kills.

[boredman]

A while ago i made a variation of Divine phoenix Paladin 15/monk 3/rogue 2 (i took rogue 2 instead monk 4 for rogue scroll mastery 1 and a bit more skill points but can take monk 4 too if want) (i use the three prestiges but using DoS most of the time now)

If i remember the leveling was something like this:

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.14.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Punisherdone Bateman
Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(15 Paladin \ 3 Monk \ 2 Rogue) 
Hit Points: 343
Spell Points: 345 
BAB: 18\18\23\28\28
Fortitude: 21
Reflex: 21
Will: 19

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(36 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             16                 23                   24
Dexterity            15                 17                   18
Constitution         13                 16                   16
Intelligence          9                 12                   12
Wisdom               15                 19                   21
Charisma             12                 15                   16

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               6                    15
Bluff                 1                     3
Concentration         3                    19
Diplomacy             1                     3
Disable Device       n/a                    n/a
Haggle                5                     7
Heal                  2                     5
Hide                  2                     4
Intimidate            5                    26
Jump                  7                    11
Listen                2                     5
Move Silently         2                     4
Open Lock             6                    11
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair               -1                     1
Search               -1                     1
Spot                  2                     5
Swim                  5                     9
Tumble                4                     6
Use Magic Device      5                    26

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Haggle (+4)
Skill: Intimidate (+4)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Swim (+2)
Skill: Tumble (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Paladin
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Paladin
Feat: (Human Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Monk)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist


Level 3 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Sunder


Level 4 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 5 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 6 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery


Level 7 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 8 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: WIS
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 9 (Monk)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 10 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 11 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 12 (Paladin)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Intimidate (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons


Level 13 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 14 (Paladin)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 15 (Paladin)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 16 (Monk)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+2)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light


Level 17 (Paladin)
Skill: Intimidate (+2)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 18 (Paladin)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Cleave


Level 19 (Paladin)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)


Level 20 (Rogue)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Balance (+5)
Skill: Intimidate (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+3)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
Enhancement: Paladin Armor Class Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Wisdom I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery III
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Way of the Patient Tortoise I
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Paladin Courage of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Bulwark of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Focus of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good I
Enhancement: Paladin Resistance of Good II
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Righteousness I
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Sacrifice I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Lay on Hands II
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil I
Enhancement: Paladin Extra Smite Evil II
Enhancement: Paladin Defender of Siberys I
Enhancement: Paladin Defender of Siberys II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion I
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion II
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion III
Enhancement: Paladin Devotion IV
Enhancement: Paladin Energy of the Templar I
Enhancement: Paladin Energy of the Templar II
Enhancement: Paladin Charisma I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness I
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness II
Enhancement: Paladin Toughness III
Enhancement: Paladin Divine Might I
Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery I

The purpose of this variation was to be more stunning fist focused, dropping some cha for wis (only have dm I, but better stunning fist dc with improve sunder too, to help).

Now that im capped at level 25 and i have full Gmof, US, LD and almost done Fotw, i can say that im having a lot of fun with this build and with all of that epic destinies, for example on Gmof and twists i can raise my stunning fist to 61 dc (38-40 wis) (38-40 str), use of ein and the knockdown enhancement, can raise my double strike to 24.5% with +6 % item; On US destiny i use stand against the tide enhancement with purify weap and my stunning fist is 53-54 dc, but if i want to do some tanking i swich to my paladin gear and a min2 rapier or oathblade or kronzecks that already have keen); on Fotw i have found many good dps boost, even if not using too much of adrenaline i can find sense of weakness, tunnel vision, primal scream (i can use that turning off my defensive stance while activating primal scream and then turn on Dos stance), and im close to try the enhancemet that heals you and boost your wis for more sf dc; and on LD what can i say, Haste boost, damage boost plus improved power attack and master blitz when soloing!.

As for the gear im using atm:

Weapons: Grave wrappings, banishing, metalline of smiting, mabar, coruscacing of hemorrating (still farming the Ivvy wraps and Antipode), epic souleatter, oathblade, Min2 rapier, Crafted boss beater scimitars and wraps, epic Kronzecks
Armor: Main is Spider spun caparison (Insight +3 wis), hide of the goristro, embrance of spider queen or purple dragon
Gloves: Main is Claw, purple dragon, fabricators
Bracers: Main is Claw, Convalescense of superior parrying, fabricators
Rings: Kyosho with holyburst, another tod with shocking burst, seal avithout (wis +7, +13 sa dmg), epic ring of bucaneer, ring of the ravager set
Belt: Main is Epic Spare hand (tier 1 atm), Gs of Cha +3 skills prot +5 heavy fort and 150 sp, belt of the ravager set
Boots: Cannith boots of propulsion, health +8 boots
Head: Main is Epic mask of comedy, terazas perfect sight, crystal cove bandana with natural armor +5 and +15 intim, purple dragon helmet
Necklace: Shintao cord
Cloak: Cloak of night lvl 24, drow pitfauri
Googles: Gs smoke displascement clickie, +35 hp, drow smoke googles
trinklet: Shard of power (meele alacrity+ devotion), planar focus sub (+8 wis, sa), shimmering arrowhead (seeker +4, attack +2)

Very fun to play, mostly on handwraps but able to switch to paladin gear with around (not remember well) 115ac, 100 prr +40% fortif, saves in the middle 55s to 60 on Us destiny. I use overwhelming critical and great cleave too as epic features. My hitponts are between 805-1080 hp depending on the destiny im using on dos stance, standing str between 38-46, wisdom between 28-40, charisma 22-24, umd of 45 self buffed (scrolls heal me for around 350 hp on dos prestige i think, but almost dont need to use heal scrolls, i use displascemet ones too sometimes), a 8sp csw heal me between 170-250 hp on Dos prestige, 250-320 on hotd if i remember.

And finally, for dps what can i say, i normally beat or im close on kills with other meeles like decent fighters or barbs or monks, have played sometimes with Esos tr'ed barbs and fighters with full Ld or Fotw destinies and not too far of them (about half of the kills of them, 40 kills vs 80 if i remember correctly, on a Citw raid, but anyway im not very familiar with that raid yet), and against another tr paladins i normally beat them, once i was tied with a half orc Esos tred paladin 18/monk 2, but i normally dont care much and dont remember the kills i get, since i feel the mobs die very quick on epic hard (sometimes i have outpassed instakiller wizards on quests that i know well on e-hard) and the few times i have played epic elite we have succeed without much problems. ( I soloed EE imposible demands with a hire the first time i tried it, but of course is a short quest if you know it, but i havent tried any other quest on ee for soloing because it can be very long and intense and i dont have much patience )

Remembering this build on the planner i realized that i could pick Kotc1 prestige, even when already Dos II picked, is that posible to do now? (picking diferent prestige enhancements at ther same time or was the planner wrong? (anyway ill try that later when i log on my toon)

[canisll]

Any feedback on how these builds are working post u14? I've got a monk that needs a paly life.

I did one life as a Divine Phoenix for a Pally PL and it went well. Crazy saves, later immune the level drain, built in restoration and versatility due to UMD, decent CHA skills in case you need it in quests (with skill buffing gear I hit all the benchmarks).
Having gear and consumables makes your life a lot easier, if you always take time to manage buffs you will be hard to kill, only high hitters will be challenging (Ogres I'm looking at you).
I ran into some problems with high self-healing in SOME mobs. Bendix, Hazadill and Ghaele are the only I remember at the moment though. With Bendix I used a GS Greatsword instead of Wraps, the Ghaele are susceptible to Banishing, so there was always a way around it.
Other than that it went well, even though as others commented the DPS isn't great. With gear I would say it's not terrible either though (But I haven't taken the build into epics at all).

For gear I used the Sora Kell set, with Jidz-Tetka (In Fire Stance, Heal Amp still rocks), the Garments of Equilibrium (3 of them to swap them in when they broke) and filled the rest of the slots with everything I needed. GS HP item in Goggles slot.
DR breaking wraps, Vampiric Stonedust Wraps and Banishers/Disruptors/Smiters should take care of most of your weapon needs. I found myself swapping regularly to attack the mobs with the most favorable weapon.
I experimented with Bracers of Air for permanent blur, but ditched them in favor for Heal Amp. and got blur wands (Level 10s when I could).

All in all it was solid. I just swapped one of the Toughness feats for Stunning Fist which still helped a LOT even though I dumped my WIS.

The next 2 lives I experimented with 10/9/1 Pally/Monk/Arti Human. HoTD 1, Ninja Spy 1.
Similarly built to a Dark Monk, with SF: UMD for Scrolls healing. Trap Skills built in. Very versatile.
Only difference in gear are Tharne's as goggles, and swap in for Trapper gear.
This build will profit from Self Buffs like Blur,... and Shadow Fade and TOD for burst damage. All in all a lot better, although Bendix still was a problem. The Arti for a small buff to scroll UMD and the dog as lever puller also served very well. Since I dumped CHA this time, I didn't get all the benchmarks for CHA skill checks in quests.
Also, trap skills kept my concentration low, so TOD didn't help a lot in the beginning but once I hit 12 for the Garments (+13 concentration) that took care of my problems.

This is also what I would recommend for a quick PL really.