Building a DrunkTank

[Joldahks]

So, I was intrigued by the synergy between the Druid and the Monk classes and decided to see what build I could make. I haven't really made any builds before so this is my first real attempt. Any help would be appreciated!

At this point I'm just starting out so the post will mostly be questions, thoughts, theories etc.

0. Vision: A Druid/Monk multiclass build that can tank (as Bear?) with healing support from spells and other support from monk abilities.

1. Are there any character building programs that support druid right now? That would help a lot.

2. Wisdom and Strength seem to be the main stats for this build (aside from Con of course). I'm a little disappointed that the Flame Blades lose the Wisdom to hit/damage while in animal form but waddyagonnado eh? Getting this balance right shouldnt be too hard I guess.

My test build was this:

Human 32 point build
Str: 14
Dex: 10
Con: 16
Int: 10
Wis: 16
Cha: 10

I'm thinking right now of dumping cha and int and putting a bit more into Dex, which at the very least should help Evasion and give some dodge %. What to take at level ups though?


3. Class split. Right now I'm thinking of going Druid 14/ Monk 6. Probably taking the Nature's Warrior PrE and Bear related enhancements. Not sure which Monk PrE to take though. I'm thinking Light Monk for the healing curse. Also possible is Druid 18/Monk2 which wouldn't really be a multiclass build I guess, just a splash.

4. Play Strategy. At the moment I'm just summoning pets, dropping in to Bear form, and ripping stuff up. The regeneration spells are nice for self healing. I imagine this part will evolve as I go.

Any answers/comments/advice? I'm really intrigued by this build and hope I can make it work with some semblance of success. Thanks!

[Joldahks]

OK so the character builder doesn't have druid yet so I'll try to format my build as well as I can. Here is my initial build idea for a Monk/Druid Hybrid that uses Bear form to tank:

Human 32-point Build
Druid 13/ Monk 6/ Fighter 1
Stats:
Str: 16 + 5 Levels + 2 tome + 7 item + 2 Ram's Might +2 Enhancement = 34
Dex: 12 + 6 item + 2 tome - 2 Mountain Stance = 18
Con: 16 + 7 item + 2 tome + 4 Dire Bear + 2 Mountain Stance + 1 Enhancement +2 Insightful Constitution = 30
Int: 8 + 2 tome = 10
Wis: 15 + 7 item + 2 tome + 3 Dr. Enhancement + 2 Monk Enhancement +2 Insightful Wisdom = 30
Cha: 8 + 2 tome = 10

Level 1: Druid 1
Feat: Toughness
Human Feat: Augment Summoning

Level 2: Druid 2
Wild Shape: Bear

Level 3: Druid 3
Feat: Weapon Focus: Bludgeoning


Level 4: Druid 4
Stat: Str

Level 5: Druid 5

Level 6: Druid 6
Feat: Empower Healing Spell
Enhancement: Nature's Warrior I

Level 7: Druid 7

Level 8: Druid 8
Stat: Str
Wild Shape: Dire Bear

Level 9: Druid 9
Feat: Natural Fighting (1)
Druid Poison Resistance

Level 10: Monk 1
Monk Feat: Power Attack
Level 11: Monk 2
Monk Feat: Stunning Fist
Evasion
Monk AC Bonus (1)

Level 12: Druid 10
Feat: Improved Critical: Bludgeoning
Stat: Str

Level 13: Druid 11

Level 14: Druid 12
Enhancement: Nature's Warrior II

Level 15: Druid 13
Feat: Natural Fighting (2)

Level 16: Monk 3
Stat: Str
Path of Inevitable Dominion

Level 17: Monk 4

Level 18: Monk 5
Feat: Natural Fighting

Level 19: Monk 6
Monk Feat: Dodge
Enhancement: Monk Ninja Spy I

Level 20: Fighter 1
Fighter Feat: Toughness
Stat: Str

HP Breakdown:
103 Druid levels
36 Monk levels
10 Fighter Level
20 Heroic Durability
40 Druid Toughness
10 Fighter Toughness
30 Racial Toughness
200 Constitution
46 Toughness (Feat)
20 Toughness (Item)
30 Greater False Life
45 Green Steel HP Item
10 Draconic Vitality
10 Way of the Patient Tortoise II
610 total

AC Breakdown
10 Base
9 Armor
5 Protection
5 Natural Armor
4 Dex Bonus
10 Wis Bonus
3 Centered Bonus
4 Superior Parrying
50 total before % Bonuses
62 after 25% AC Bonus

There.

My main concerns right now are possibly switching level 8 with level 10, to get a new rank of spells before hitting the monk levels. I'll have to see what the spells are before I decide.

The other concern is to drop a level of monk for druid 15. This gives me Heal. Question is, will I be a good enough healer even with Heal to warrant taking the extra druid level? If I do I lose out on Shintao I (which honestly doesn't do much for the build), a toughness feat (which I could swap in for WF or something) and some fast movement.

Comments?

[MeatSheild]

The the 6th lv of monk also provides a 2% dodge. Not that this is a big deal but dmg mitigation should be a concern for any "tank" or solo build.

I have no clue what druid lvs 13 and 14 are giving you, but you might want to weigh them against 2 lv's of fighter just for the hp/feats. I dont know what tomes you are planning on using, but unbound +3's are dropping now (though uncommon). With that the 10 int could lead to a 13 int and yeild CE and you can pick up Imp CE as a twist of fate for some PRR. Not sure what would be good here for epic dest, twists, or epic feats. I didn't see any twf or thf feats (not sure what bears use) nor do I see the dex able to get the twf feats. On a 1st lifer without tomes you might be trying to streach this build a bit to far but then again I don't know druid at all so...

As for the build planners. I think alot of the ppl that make them are waiting for the next update when racial Pre's are said to come out (along with filling out those missing ones) before they do any real work on them. The enh are said to take a new look of tree style and get a complete overhaul as well so I'm not sure if anyone will be updateing/creating anything till this hits live sometime in Aug.

[Joldahks]

I'm not building tomes in from the start simply because I haven't gone that in depth yet, but the CE suggestion is a good one. Thanks!

Level 13 druid gets me 7th level spells, which include Regenerate and Relentless Onslaught (for bear). The Bear one sounds really interesting, and Regenerate, while not as good as Heal by any means, could serve as useable replacement for self healing if I decide not to go Druid 15. Also it opens up the enhancement Wild Healing, which is basically a life shield effect that also gives +20 healing amp when it procs.

If I trade those two druid levels for 2 fighter I gain 4 hp, 1 toughness enhancement (druid already has 4!), haste boost which interests me, and 2 feats. The feats could be useful but not sure which ones I would take. For the moment I think I'm going to try at least 14 druid and see what happens. If I seem to lack a bit of a punch I'll look closer at this.

ED wise: I'm thinking of making either Unyielding Sentinel or Legendary Dreadnought primary, with twists for healing improvements. The healing aspect, heroic or epic, doesn't have to be extraordinary but it would seem silly not to take advantage of it.

The build planners are going to have to wait a while then, because I'm pretty sure Turbine has stated the enhancement update won't be until U16 at the earliest.

[superdupe6934]

Sentinel will definitely give you a huge amount of survivability at the start, so you could afford to give away a little toughness earlier in if you feel the need for more Monk. Factoring in your AC can give you a better determiner of how often you will be hit and whether you feel the extra hp will be necessary or just desired. Loosing evade on the other hand, probably isn't so bad because as a Tank, you're expecting to take hits anyway, your purpose is just to survive while your enemies struggle to kill you and exhaust themselves, leaving the pic-a-nic baskets ripe for snatching

[Joldahks]

So with a little more research I think I'm going to stick with Monk 6, which also opens up Mountain Stance II in addition to everything else mentioned. I have a feeling I'll need every ounce of AC and PRR I can get. Now I'm wondering if I should go dark monk for the incorporeality, but I like the healing curse too. But do I need it since I already have nice healing abilities as Druid? Any thoughts?

Also upon further reflection, 14 druid isn't as useful as 13 druid if not going 15 druid, so I think I'll drop it for a fighter level. This not only gets me a feat and a toughness enhancement, but haste boost too.

Anyway I'm at level 8 now and I'm loving this build. I hope they fix the unarmed damage bug with bear so I can stop doing only 1d6 damage, then I'll really rock!

Superdupe:

You are suggesting swapping monk for fighter? That would probably net a higher AC, and shields do work well with druids but ... I'm hoping at some point the unarmed boosts from monk will work properly with bear and I'll be doing all sorts of DPS. Plus with the various monk AC grants, I think I' can get a reasonable AC going. Having played almost exclusively builds with Evasion, it's usefulness cannot be understated. Completely avoiding damage where most people even on a save might take hundreds, depending on spell? Yes please!

[Custard]

I'm digging this idea. Please keep us up with what you think and change with this build as you level it.

[Joldahks]

So I know I haven't updated this in a while, but my Drunk has been on the shelf until the bearmonk damage gets fixed (if ever). I don't have a lot of thoughts but here they are:

I've pretty much decided on going Ninja Spy. I already have self healing, so the healing curse won't be that essential, and the incorporeality should help me tank with the nake AC I'll have.

I'm strongly considering changing the level order, and going Druid the first 9 levels (and not just so I can restart the character and actually have my normal damage for a while). This gets me the first Natural Fighting feat right at level 9, instead of 15 with the other build. This delays the Monk AC help, but since I can wear armor until then it should balance out. I might actually be able to get all three Natural Fighting feats this way.

I'm leaning more towards Fury of the Wild for ED, but it's a long way off. That Sense Weakness is just so darn appealing, and just so darn hard to twist in.

[superdupe6934]

Well, from what I've looked at here, you've got a pretty solid looking build that will likely take better advantage of your Druid build and give you some very nice magic to help augment your armor (Stoneskin leaps readily to mind). You'll also be able to self heal very well, which will be crucial considering your evasion will be low and thus you will be subject to more attacks and damage. The poison immunity at level 9 will be handy as well.

I can't really say too much about your ED. I have yet to fully tap into the power of my own, but from what I can see, we are a similar beast in that we are most definitely going to be packing amazing hit points. Your damage output looks to skyrocket and your rogue levels should give you a nice edge in that dept. as well. I agree that Sense Weakness is likely to take a good deal of your time to get, but will be well worth the effort. In the meantime, I can see Adrenaline and Injury making for an awesome quicksave/fast kill combo if timed effectively. Keep posting on this, It looks to be the beginning of something phenomenal

[Joldahks]

Yeah im not sure what my stats are going to look like at 20. I need to extrapolate some of them and post em. The hp should be easy but the ac will be tougher as its all percentages stacked on top of each other. Any prr or physical evade i wont have any idea on.

I might try retooling the build to grab epic toughness. I wish i had enough monk levels for vorpal fists, would be awesome to decapitate things as a bear.

So anyway before i go to the trouble of redoing the build, any feedback? The extrapolated stats should help people give better advice. I kinda feel like the thread hasnt gotten much attention though.

Well look for the stats tomorrow, if i can wrap my head around the math.

[Joldahks]

OK I edited the current version of the build into the second post, and put it into a code box.

Main things I did were: Frontloaded 9 druid levels, added fighter 1, reduced druid to 13. Changed some feats around. Added Dodge for some damage avoidance help. Fit in the 3rd Natural Fighting feat.

Added up the HP and AC. Sitting at 610 hp and 62 AC at 20, not bad for a naked build I guess. I have to find a way to get a shield bonus, I guess, and I'd like to have to some more Dex. I'd like to have Combat Expertise, but it would come at the cost of Wis or Dex, at least until I TR once or twice.

As for gear I have a decent idea of what I'm looking at for 20. I'll post it later if I feel this thread is not dead

Epic levels I'll work on later, but if I go Fury of the Wild I'm looking at a nice HP boost. I'm going to need at least 1 TR if I'm going to get 18 con (and 3 tome I guess) to satisfy requirements for epic toughness.

Thoughts?

[Joldahks]

Hey all my devoted followers!

Sorry I have let this thread languish for so long. This character was on the back burner while the unarmed damage was bugged (trying to fight as a dire bear with 1d6 damage was becoming tiring) and I haven't had the chance to pick it up again yet.

I do plan to pick it up again soon. My Big F'n Stick has been taking a lot of my time, but is quickly reaching the ED cap. Once that is accomplished, this character is next on my list to build up.

Just a few things while I'm here:

I plan now to take Unyielding Sentinel as my primary destiny. It just seems logical with the focus on tanking to go with a (the) tanking destiny. Some of the things look very tasty. Although sometimes, it feels like I'm using the Druid/Monk/Fighter/US combo just to make a souped up Paladin (but hairier). Eh.

[goodoldxelos]

Cool, never saw this one. Mine is based upon the wolf form and goes for high damage. How well do you hold aggro?

My druid/monk/fighter wolf build...
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=393251

I'm probably going to go with grandmaster for damage increases

there are some errors with your build how do you take Fighter Feat: Toughness?
Why weapon focus blud?
Why empower healing? I use maximize.

you may want to take my build and substitute out wolf forms for bear forms and some feats

[Joldahks]

Cool, never saw this one. Mine is based upon the wolf form and goes for high damage. How well do you hold aggro?

My druid/monk/fighter wolf build...
http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=393251

I'm probably going to go with grandmaster for damage increases

there are some errors with your build how do you take Fighter Feat: Toughness?
Why weapon focus blud?
Why empower healing? I use maximize.

you may want to take my build and substitute out wolf forms for bear forms and some feats

The fighter feat toughness is a mistake; that's why feedback is valuable Thanks!

WF:Blud is a holdover from when you needed Focus for Overwhelming Critical, I expect.

As for Empower Heal vs. Maximize, that's probably just my inexperience with divines. Is maximize a better heal booster then?

[Joldahks]

All right so fixing the fighter feat error and replacing WF, along with altering the level order now that I have an extra feat to work with, this is what the build looks like in a nutshell (thanks to goodoldxelos for the use of his level order):

1: Monk 1- Power Attack (Gen), Stunning Fist(MB), Cleave (HB)
2: Druid 1
3: Druid 2 - Toughness
4: Druid 3
5: Druid 4
6: Druid 5 - Empower Healing / Maximize
7: Druid 6
8: Druid 7
9: Druid 8 - Great Cleave
10: Druid 9
11: Monk 2 - Dodge
12: Fighter 1 - Natural Fighting 1 (Gen), Imp. Crit. Bludgeoning (FB)
13: Monk 3
14: Monk 4
15: Monk 5 - Natural Fighting 2
16: Monk 6 - Toughness (MB)
17: Druid 10
18: Druid 11 - Natural Fighting 3
19: Druid 12
20: Druid 13

Oh I also took out Augment Summoning. It was a luxury that just isn't worth it with only 13 druid levels.

[goodoldxelos]

Let me know how the similarlity of the build goes with bear form instead.

As for maximize vs empower vs empower healing there is a trade off. Maximize is great for burst healing (which is what i want) empowered healing is probably more SP efficient.

Greater vigor & cure crit wounds with maximize gets me through most situations.
Use vampirism handwraps with cleave and great cleave and you'll rarely die especially with all your extra hps from bear form.

I will be taking out monk level 10 for a 2nd fighter level (going to try to fit in quicken possibly).

[Joldahks]

Bleh. This was a mistake post. I mixed up my Drogue build with my Drunk build. Too many druids!

[MoreIdiotThanSavant]

The doublestrike from the Shield Mastery feats does work in Wolf form, however, using a shield will uncenter you as a monk.

[Joldahks]

Yeah, I think I mixed this character up with my Drogue. Sigh. Too many druid hybrids :/