Devs - once the Ocean Stance bug is fixed . . .

[Ape_Man]

Will you remove that silly cap on dodge?

I'm going to assume it was an ad-hoc mechanism thrown in there while you had time to fix the ocean stance bug. Am I wrong?

[Vargouille]

The limit for dodge is intended to stay. We may add abilities that allow you to increase this limit for certain character builds.

[Trillea]

I must have missed it, what is the dodge % cap?

[TPICKRELL]

i must have missed it, what is the dodge % cap?

25%

[Stanley_Nicholas]

The limit for dodge is intended to stay. We may add abilities that allow you to increase this limit for certain character builds.

Something really needs to be done for unarmored monk-splashed builds. It's not very fair that they should have to devote most of their gear slots, feats, and destiny/twists just to get half the damage avoidance of a generic fighter with a nice set of fullplate and shield, and little if any damage mitigation.

[sebastianosmith]

We may add abilities that allow you to increase this limit for certain character builds.

[sephiroth1084]

The limit for dodge is intended to stay. We may add abilities that allow you to increase this limit for certain character builds.

I have to ask, "Why?"

It's fairly difficult to get to the cap as it is, and getting beyond the cap requires a fairly significant devotion via feats, enhancements, class and destiny choices, and items, which makes it difficult to also achieve a high AC or PRR. That light- and no-armor wearers have had their AC potential reduced further emphasizes, to my mind, the unnecessary implementation of a Dodge cap.

[Tyrande]

I have to ask, "Why?"

[...]

My guess is that they don't want people to come up with builds of punks with > 25% (50%?) dodge; in combo with AC that can only be hit half of the time and put on displacement/blurry/ghostly items to make them almost cannot be hit by monsters.

hit chance in that scenario would be = 0.5 * 0.5 * 0.5 * 0.9 ~= 11%

[riexau]

Tell ya what, keep the dodge cap but let me dodge spells and effects and we'll call it even

*Drow sorcerer casts finger of death*

DODGE!

[Ape_Man]

The limit for dodge is intended to stay. We may add abilities that allow you to increase this limit for certain character builds.

Fair enough . . . would it be too much to ask that certain buffs . . . say a bard's Inspire Heroics (which is woefully weak right now) not be subject to that cap?

[TPICKRELL]

Don't suppose PRR is getting capped at 50 (25.67% mititgation) to make this fair for cloth armor...

Didn't think so.

[TPICKRELL]

In all seriousness, for me its not an issue. Because IMO dodge comes in such little amounts that its not worth investing feats or item slots. After you factor a 4% dodge item down by the AC/Incorporal/Shadow Fade/PRR./blur/displacement, the contribution to overall damage mitigation is not worth spending a slot/feat/twist on it.

Yes 25% dodge looks like a good number, and it would be if it came from two items that are also solid on their own like PRR does. At a cost of appproximately 3 feats and 3 or 4 equipment slots it is just to expensive. Moar DPS or improved crowd control from each of those feats or slots is likely to mitigate more damage than even a 4% dodge effect.

[whomhead]

My guess is that they don't want people to come up with builds of punks with > 25% (50%?) dodge; in combo with AC that can only be hit half of the time and put on displacement/blurry/ghostly items to make them almost cannot be hit by monsters.

hit chance in that scenario would be = 0.5 * 0.5 * 0.5 * 0.9 ~= 11%

Which is still more than double what the theoretical minimum hit chance was before the update - which was 5%. Also, how is 11% almost unhittable? That's still more than 1 hit out of every 10 attempts. Or 11 hits out of every 100. Or 110 hits out of every 1000!!!

[Feralthyrtiaq]

25% Dodge as a BUG

Which will be fixed...

MUCH MUCH sooner than Broken Monk Die Step Increases.

[orakio]

Don't suppose PRR is getting capped at 50 (25.67% mititgation) to make this fair for cloth armor...

Didn't think so.

Considering the dodge cap for cloth armor is higher than all heavy armor builds have access to your suggestion is a bit unreasonable. In addition most heavy armor wearers(i.e. dps that dont having fighter/dwarven armor mastery + mobility + SD max dex boosts) will be capped around approximately 1/4(1-7% vs. 25%) of the dodge that cloth armor builds can have.

Cloth wearing monk based builds can get well more than the 25.67% mitigation from PRR that you are requesting with a PRR of 50 using current items/enhancements/etc. I did a number breakdown on the beta forums that shows that DARK PATH TANK MONKS have almost exactly the same mitigation as full sd3 heavy armor + tower shield builds from dodge+PRR+PrE features. The ability to get PRR is there, some people are just unwilling to make any effort and feel that monks should somehow exceed the defenses of other classes in a dps build.

If you feel like going through the post, its a long one, you can find it here.
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...6&postcount=93

Total breakdown of available PRR for anyone that wants to whine that monks are somehow shortchanged in overall mitigation. Nobody has been able to refute the numbers there, nor show afterwards how monks are in any way shortchanged by the dex cap.

Now if you don't want to build that way its your choice, but it seems odd to complain that the options aren't there for monks when they clearly are.

[Riggs]

The limit for dodge is intended to stay. We may add abilities that allow you to increase this limit for certain character builds.

That right there pretty much sums up a lot of reasons I doubt I will be coming back to the game or ever paying again.

I have a pretty healthy chunk of light armor builds, along with my favorite monk dex/wis build. "Wear heavy armor, or else take a lot more damage than before"

I have rebuilt too many characters over the years, and I am done with it. 6 years of watching game mechanics getting broken for no good reason and then the inevitable, and predictable, problems, power creeps, and various 'halo' effects of doing things wrong and taking years to barely fix them have finally left a bad taste in the mouth.

[dredre9987]

25% Dodge as a BUG

Which will be fixed...

MUCH MUCH sooner than Broken Monk Die Step Increases.

Die steps aren't broken. They were fixed to work with the new [W]

[elg582]

The limit for dodge is intended to stay. We may add abilities that allow you to increase this limit for certain character builds.

Right! All we have to do is splash barbarian!

Let us do that and we'll call it even

[Riggs]

....

Now if you don't want to build that way its your choice, but it seems odd to complain that the options aren't there for monks when they clearly are.

That post is not a monk - it shows a 12 ftr/ with monk splash, and a couple very specific dark/earth paths that in no way do a single thing for the class as a whole, or anyone else in light armor who is not a ftr/darkmonk/earth stance build.

In other words - completely meaningless for the argument in question.

[TPICKRELL]

Considering the dodge cap for cloth armor is higher than all heavy armor builds have access to your suggestion is a bit unreasonable. In addition most heavy armor wearers(i.e. dps that dont having fighter/dwarven armor mastery + mobility + SD max dex boosts) will be around approximately 1/4 of the dodge that cloth armor builds have.

Cloth wearing monk based builds can get well more than the 25.67% mitigation from PRR that you are requesting with a PRR of 50 using current items/enhancements/etc. I did a number breakdown on the beta forums that shows that DARK PATH TANK MONKS have almost exactly the same mitigation as full sd3 heavy armor + tower shield builds from dodge+PRR+PrE features. The ability to get PRR is there, some people are just unwilling to make any effort and feel that monks should somehow exceed the defenses of other classes in a dps build.

If you feel like going through the post, its a long one, you can find it here.
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...6&postcount=93

Total breakdown of available PRR for anyone that wants to whine that monks are somehow shortchanged in overall mitigation. Nobody has been able to refute the numbers there, nor show afterwards how monks are in any way shortchanged by the dex cap.

Now if you don't want to build that way its your choice, but it seems odd to complain that the options aren't there for monks when they clearly are.

I wasn't really making a suggestion, just making a point that PRR and Dodge are not equivalent and given a choice for my cloth armor types I consider PRR to be vastly superior.

I'm not asking for or suggesting a nerf to PRR, just making a point.

I read you article when you first posted it and I agree with you that a TANK build monk can achieve close enough damage mitigation to be competitive with a TANK build FIGHTER.

My problem with dodge is not for a tank, but rather for your general purpose DPS/mitigation monk where Dodge is not very effective.