Arcane Archers, 10k stars Vs. Pure Vs. 12fighter/6ranger/2monk

[conanj77]

Title implies what this thread is about.

Arcane Archers, which are the best?

A 10k stars?

A Pure Ranger?

Or

A 12Fighter/6ranger/2monk(Longbow Kensei II)
Okay so first thing is first, Remember to be an Arcane Archer (with slayer arrows) you need 2 things:
#1. 18 levels of ranger, or 20 levels as an Elf or Half elf, so no 10kstars Warforged, the slayer arrows are what arcane archers exist for.
#2. A spell point bar, no SP=no AA, hence why most builds have 6ranger(spells and manyshot )

Post arguments, builds or even complements, just keep it forum friendly.

Remember, the question is

What is the best Arcane Archer? 10k stars? Pure ranger??? Helven/Elven Kensei II/manyshot/monk splash(ranger6/fighter12/monk2)?????

CJ Out!

[Samiusbot]

12monk 6 ranger 2 figher...aka bowonk there is a thread or two. Search foo on.

[karl_k0ch]

Largely depends on your playstyle.

10k Stars is the best over all ranged damage, needs you to keep your KI up, and supports an active combat due to monk abilities.
Pure ranger offers a decent melee package, but lacks against non-FEs.
Kensai-based is similar to the pure ranger, has better non-situational ranged damage, but less melee damage.

[Kawai]

Largely depends on your playstyle.

10k Stars is the best over all ranged damage, needs you to keep your KI up, and supports an active combat due to monk abilities.
Pure ranger offers a decent melee package, but lacks against non-FEs.
Kensai-based is similar to the pure ranger, has better non-situational ranged damage, but less melee damage.

Yellow = +1
I'm currently on me third life with the Kensai II. Should call it fourth as i went all the way to 20 on first life as a pure Ranger and then used multiple hearts of wood (expensive, yea ) top get the build "just right".
In addition to what you've already stated, i mainly did it to access all the other ranged feats that a fighter has access to, along with more HP.
~ps: too much rep given out laST 24, -soon as its off timer you will get it.

[Thrudh]

A wisdom-based 10k stars build lets you shoot more arrows per second than any other build, doesn't it?

Also monk speed and abundant step (and ranger sprint boost) are very useful for a character that wants to keep his distance from his targets.

I have 12/6/2 monk/ranger/fighter (I actually built this build BEFORE 10k stars came out)...

but I'm looking at 12/6/2 monk/ranger/artificer as an interesting variation that might be even better for the UMD, free rapid reload feat, and maybe even traps. (although you lose a feat)

[Moltier]

If you use your bow all the time, then a monk splash version wins.
If you like to melee too, then the 12fighter/6ranger/2monk helf will do the most dps.
At least untill update. Then you can have mana bar without caster class, so i guess things will change.

[sephiroth1084]

At least untill update. Then you can have mana bar without caster class, so i guess things will change.

How?

[Diyon]

How?

Epic destinies. Or maybe just having a spell point item on.

[sephiroth1084]

Epic destinies. Or maybe just having a spell point item on.

I doubt having an SP item will allow you to get AA, since no other items count for qualifying for anything (feats, enhancements, PrEs, etc...).

As for the epic destinies, that's a long time to wait to pick up AA. Do we know that they will definitely allow you to get the PrE? Do you have to respec your enhancements if you swap to a destiny that doesn't grant SP? Do any of the relevant archery destinies grant SP? I didn't think they did (Shiradi, Shadowdancer, Grandmaster)...that's a pretty big investment to be able to go pure non-Ranger AA (or just not bother with a blue-bar dip).

Doesn't seem worth it to me, even if it does work. Now, if the sorcerer PL finally would count, that would be a different story. Does anyone know if this is working as desired?

[FuzzyDuck81]

If you use your bow all the time, then a monk splash version wins.
If you like to melee too, then the 12fighter/6ranger/2monk helf will do the most dps.
At least untill update. Then you can have mana bar without caster class, so i guess things will change.

You'll have a mana bar, but iirc thats more to allow use of some of the epic destiny abiities... you still wont qualify for AA since you need to have the enhancement or mental toughness feat, unless some prereqs are changed considerably.

i've had the pure ranger which i TRed into the 12monk/6ranger/2fighter build (not tried the kensai one), and i prefer the monk-based one - though it is a little annoying having to periodically switch to melee to charge ki for 10k stars, but it has plenty of feats & extra durability vs. the pure ranger one, however self healing is a little trickier since i need to switch out for heal scrolls (yay cleric dilly) instead of being able to fire off a CSW.

I think the assessment above sounds about right though - kensai will have better base damage vs. all enemies but be a lot more single-role focussed, whereas the monk one will be a more well-rounded character with the added advantages of better healing amp, improved evasion & better saves

[krackythehoodedone]

Their are others

Ok i'm not straying off topic in an attempt to hi jack the thread. Their are other viable ranged builds the OP hasnt mentioned, probably because he wasnt aware of them.

Firstly the top Ranged DPS build is a 18/1/1 FB3 Bowbarian. I have seen screenies of this build doing 1k dam with a single arrow. Against one opponent for 20 seconds nothing comes close. Downside is terribly feat starved and cant even afford IPS so for me its not really a ''Ranged'' build but it deserves a mention.

Old Crit Rage Bowbarb. Crits on 13 with E Thorn, has all ranged feats and as long as mobs arent immune to Crits is very difficult to beat especially if weapon is proccing on Crit. Reason i mention this build now is because as most of you know Crit Rage is not an option as we speak even though some old timers still have it. However one option for the reworking of Feats which apparently is coming after new expansion is to bring back this line of feats which will once again make it accessible to all and as such also deserves a mention.

Out of the other builds i think top for DPS on Khyber is a tweaked version of a Helves Angel with a 2 Barb splash. ( I cant remember toons name buts its one of the Revenants). I like the Helves Angel over the Monkcher even though i am aware the Zen Archery builds fire more shots.

If you are really serious about a top ranged build it will require lots of work. IE 3 Ranger PL and Monk as well and a Pal PL on Helves Angel for maximum ranged DPS

[Kawai]

...Firstly the top Ranged DPS build is a 18/1/1 FB3 Bowbarian.

Kudos... the Barbs can make great Archers as well...
~I think anyone building should first consider thier own playstyle and the vision of what they want thier toons to accomplish and how they compliment each other respectively.

As for the naysayers... meh... take them to PvP and make them cry*.
*at least once every few months to keep your sanity and confidence.

[conanj77]

*facepalm*

I forgot lots of builds like Kracky said...

I can't believe i even forgot to mention Bardchers... Stupid CJ!

but yes, there are other builds, I was actually just trying to get feedback on those 3 types because those are the main 3 i was considering.

I was also wondering, could i make a 12fighter/6ranger/2artificer build and use manyshot bursts and then use runearm and repeater when on timer? kensei II heavy repeater or longbow... but no evasion :/ just an idea, think i saw it somewhere.

/Signed

CJ out!

[karl_k0ch]

I doubt having an SP item will allow you to get AA, since no other items count for qualifying for anything (feats, enhancements, PrEs, etc...).

Currently, the Sorcerer Past Life qualifies you as AA, but you will not have SP to actually cast your Arrow Imbues, thus making the benefits of AA moot.
If you get SP, you will actually be able to use them.

So you are right, you will still need an Enhancement or a Feat (MT or PL) to qualify for AA.

[ice584]

First life for my Ranger was 12-Rgr / 6-Ftr / 2-Mnk (Tempest/Kensai). Lots of fun, decent DPS. I played mostly TWF but had some decent ranged.

Second life is currently 11-Rgr / 9-Mnk (AA) H-elf Dilly Cleric. WIS/STR-based. She has stupid good survivability; when leveling I was frequently the last one alive, saving a wipe in PUGs. It's not top ranged or melee DPS I'm sure, but the tri-fecta of using wraps, longsword/kama, or ranged give some crazy fun versatility.

It's hard to choose, but I'd say she was my most enjoyable character to level to date. Even only mildly well geared atm she's a ton of fun to play in Epics.

For straight-up DPS, I'd say I'm about a tie with a guildie's pure Ranger. He does more damage per hit, but my 10k stars helps make up for that. And when he's dead and I'm still standing I do way more DPS.

Just my 2 cp.

[Kawai]

Also... beware.....

This is how we see ourselves....


and this is how the mighty Casters and Melee see us....


So screw'm... Just PvP them, or give a hearty
lecture to the hand, baby.

/sarcasm OFF (don't neg me bro!)

[ShadowFlash]

Yellow = +1
I'm currently on me third life with the Kensai II. Should call it fourth as i went all the way to 20 on first life as a pure Ranger and then used multiple hearts of wood (expensive, yea ) top get the build "just right".
In addition to what you've already stated, i mainly did it to access all the other ranged feats that a fighter has access to, along with more HP.
~ps: too much rep given out laST 24, -soon as its off timer you will get it.

I got him for ya

ShadowFlash

[Kawai]

I got him for ya

ShadowFlash

• cheerz, Luv... back atcha

[Thrudh]

Currently, the Sorcerer Past Life qualifies you as AA, but you will not have SP to actually cast your Arrow Imbues, thus making the benefits of AA moot.
If you get SP, you will actually be able to use them.

And there's a epic destiny that gives you SP, even if you're a pure fighter, so with that and the Sorc PL, you can actually be pure fighter AA...

But not until you get to level 20+

[sephiroth1084]

Their are others

Ok i'm not straying off topic in an attempt to hi jack the thread. Their are other viable ranged builds the OP hasnt mentioned, probably because he wasnt aware of them.

Firstly the top Ranged DPS build is a 18/1/1 FB3 Bowbarian. I have seen screenies of this build doing 1k dam with a single arrow. Against one opponent for 20 seconds nothing comes close. Downside is terribly feat starved and cant even afford IPS so for me its not really a ''Ranged'' build but it deserves a mention.

Old Crit Rage Bowbarb. Crits on 13 with E Thorn, has all ranged feats and as long as mobs arent immune to Crits is very difficult to beat especially if weapon is proccing on Crit. Reason i mention this build now is because as most of you know Crit Rage is not an option as we speak even though some old timers still have it. However one option for the reworking of Feats which apparently is coming after new expansion is to bring back this line of feats which will once again make it accessible to all and as such also deserves a mention.

Out of the other builds i think top for DPS on Khyber is a tweaked version of a Helves Angel with a 2 Barb splash. ( I cant remember toons name buts its one of the Revenants). I like the Helves Angel over the Monkcher even though i am aware the Zen Archery builds fire more shots.

If you are really serious about a top ranged build it will require lots of work. IE 3 Ranger PL and Monk as well and a Pal PL on Helves Angel for maximum ranged DPS

Eh. 18 barb is 7 feats, 1 ranger (Bow Strength) and 1 wizard (Mental Toughness), gets you Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Weapon Focus, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Improved Critical, and Improved Precise Shot...except you need Power Attack and Cleave to qualify for Frenzied Berserker. Even with large damage per shot, you're going to be way behind any melees for DPS with your slow attack speed, and won't have IPS (as you pointed out) to make up for that.

Currently, the Sorcerer Past Life qualifies you as AA, but you will not have SP to actually cast your Arrow Imbues, thus making the benefits of AA moot.
If you get SP, you will actually be able to use them.

So you are right, you will still need an Enhancement or a Feat (MT or PL) to qualify for AA.

Again, that's a long time to wait on getting into AA. If you don't mind paying a different sort of character until you hit 20, then that's attractive...