Updated Raid Feedback: Caught in the Web

[GotSomeQuestions]

First part of Weap Ship. Last part of Rit Sac. Stopping the Shauhagrin even? Trying to think of others in game.

As mentioned Coyle (Escort the Expedition and Hold for Reinforcements, almost entire the latter), and Acute Delirium are the most challenging of the protection quests (although The Bookbinder Rescue can be tough for certain builds). You meant Redemption, not Stopping the Sahuagin. And Sirgog brought up Waterworks already. Here are some others, in roughly ascending order by quest level:

Stand Your Ground (Sharn Syndicate), The Bookbinder Rescue (Sharn Syndicate), A Small Problem (Phiarlan Carnival), Guard Duty (Three-Barrel Cove), Gladewatch Outpost Defense (Marketplace), The Rescue (Threnal West 2), The Last Stand (Red Fens), Let Sleeping Dust Lie (Vale of Twilight, protect the Queen), Dream Conspiracy (Inspired Quarter), The Shipwrecked Spy (Inspired Quarter), and Wrath of the Flame (Amrath) all have "friendly" NPCs that you must protect.

Faithful Departed (House Phiarlan), Slavers of the Shrieking Mines (Restless Isles), Let Sleeping Dust Lie (Vale of Twilight, don't kill the other spiders), and Prey on the Hunter (Reaver's Refuge) have "unfriendly" NPCs that must survive.

The Cannith Crystal (Korthos), Protect Baudry's Interests (Harbor), Desert Caravan (House Phiarlan/Zawabi's Refuge), From Beyond the Grave (Delera's Graveyard), Finding the Path (Inspired Quarter) and the Mabar Summoning Chamber (Mabar event) all have objects that you must protect.

I think that's everything, but I might have missed one or two.

[jkm]

As mentioned Coyle (Escort the Expedition and Hold for Reinforcements, almost entire the latter), and Acute Delirium are the most challenging of the protection quests (although The Bookbinder Rescue can be tough for certain builds). You meant Redemption, not Stopping the Sahuagin. And Sirgog brought up Waterworks already. Here are some others, in roughly ascending order by quest level:

Stand Your Ground (Sharn Syndicate), The Bookbinder Rescue (Sharn Syndicate), A Small Problem (Phiarlan Carnival), Guard Duty (Three-Barrel Cove), Gladewatch Outpost Defense (Marketplace), The Rescue (Threnal West 2), The Last Stand (Red Fens), Let Sleeping Dust Lie (Vale of Twilight, protect the Queen), Dream Conspiracy (Inspired Quarter), The Shipwrecked Spy (Inspired Quarter), and Wrath of the Flame (Amrath) all have "friendly" NPCs that you must protect.

Faithful Departed (House Phiarlan), Slavers of the Shrieking Mines (Restless Isles), Let Sleeping Dust Lie (Vale of Twilight, don't kill the other spiders), and Prey on the Hunter (Reaver's Refuge) have "unfriendly" NPCs that must survive.

The Cannith Crystal (Korthos), Protect Baudry's Interests (Harbor), Desert Caravan (House Phiarlan/Zawabi's Refuge), From Beyond the Grave (Delera's Graveyard), Finding the Path (Inspired Quarter) and the Mabar Summoning Chamber (Mabar event) all have objects that you must protect.

I think that's everything, but I might have missed one or two.

I often wonder how many people actually get out of korthos to the harbor.

Korthos has 3 of the most annoying quests in DDO with Redemption (protect Heyton), Cannith Crystal (protect the crystal), and Misery's Peak (Gather the Party). The last one is a source of constant griefing in pugs. I'd say 50% of the pugs I've been in have had someone intentionally/unintentionally go afk and keep the quest from completing.

[XbaileyX]

For all those who havent been in the raid, the having blocked messages while hiding isnt a issue. They made the rocks u hide behind so u can heal, or pop out and attack, and regroup without much of a issue. The people complaining about it might as well have a sign that says I havent walked in the raid.

Epic Elite was bring your A game or go home. Will be intense and a marathon for sure.

No Random loot please. If you would like to make them vary(which is awesome), please consider base items as they currently are with 2 empty slots that we can crunch spell power effects in. Items drops and orb of radiance, orb of impulse or orb of whatever drops. Let us farm for our individual spell powers and not the perfect combination to magically spawn.

[Ape_Man]

No Random loot please. If you would like to make them vary(which is awesome), please consider base items as they currently are with 2 empty slots that we can crunch spell power effects in. Items drops and orb of radiance, orb of impulse or orb of whatever drops. Let us farm for our individual spell powers and not the perfect combination to magically spawn.

Hire this guy! Very good idea.

[goblean]

I do not want SP damage in a raid, I do not want here today, I do not want it in anyway.

I would remove it if I could, they can redo it and they should, I do not like SP damage FlimseyFirewood.

[ainmosni]

*skims thread*

Too much noise.

Not enough violence.

[XbaileyX]

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New raid is up on Llama. 6 chest, one piece of raid loot.

[Anthios888]

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New raid is up on Llama. 6 chest, one piece of raid loot.

This is frustrating with the old threads gone, but didn't a dev post that the staves would be upgraded to have spell power in two different schools on them? This looks the same as a staff screenshot I remember seeing before.

[xTethx]

This is frustrating with the old threads gone, but didn't a dev post that the staves would be upgraded to have spell power in two different schools on them? This looks the same as a staff screenshot I remember seeing before.

Thats because it is The 1 piece of raid loot that dropped would be the bow. (my guess)

[MeliCat]

Thats because it is The 1 piece of raid loot that dropped would be the bow. (my guess)

Yes I asked about that. Apparently the staff is something that a dev dropped some time back. I am not that excited about that bow but maybe I'm missing something? What do people who play bow things think?

I think FoS posted about that staff though though...

http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...0&postcount=87

Hey everyone,

Thanks for the feedback! We've been looking this over, and I have to say, I agree. It wouldn't be very fun to see a raid item in your name but with a Spell Power type you didn't want, when you know it could have had one you would have liked better.

Taking this into consideration, we're changing the one raid item that has any randomized properties (the Spell Power type on the caster staff) and are changing it to Force Spell Power.

So now you can maybe extrapolate what's going to be on it maybe?

[Qezuzu]

Excellent, we have a My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic reference on a piece of raid loot. Congratulations, Turbine devs, you're the first group in history to successfully finish developing an MMORPG.

[davidolson22]

That bow is somewhere between junk and uber junk IMHO

[redspecter23]

That bow is somewhere between junk and uber junk IMHO

Unless I'm missing something, I'd have to agree. It looks to have an expanded natural crit range, but not much else going for it. Seeker 10 is available elsewhere or even on loot gen. Shrieking is ok, but on it's own can't save the weapon. I'm not a bow user so perhaps a ranged toon can chime in and let me know if that expanded crit range is really all that amazing in this case.

[Feather_of_Sun]

Unless I'm missing something, I'd have to agree. It looks to have an expanded natural crit range, but not much else going for it.

Not all of the mechanisms we use when designing items are immediately apparent at a first glance. It can sometimes take a close look at an item's stat block to gauge it's true worth.

In this case, it's not just the critical range. Take a look also at the damage die size, and the number of dice it rolls per attack.
[2.50]2d6 means that it deals 5d6 base physical damage per shot. Then on top of that, yes, the critical range is also doubled. It would be 17-20 if you have Improved Critical.

[Lifespawn]

Not all of the mechanisms we use when designing items are immediately apparent at a first glance. It can sometimes take a close look at an item's stat block to gauge it's true worth.

In this case, it's not just the critical range. Take a look also at the damage die size, and the number of dice it rolls per attack.
[2.50]2d6 means that it deals 5d6 base physical damage per shot. Then on top of that, yes, the critical range is also doubled. It would be 17-20 if you have Improved Critical.

it states 2.5[2d6] so that means 2.5 is multiplying the 2d6? if so thats very nice but first glance didn't tell me that i might not be up to par with the new combat lingo tho 5d6 would seem to be the simple way to say that???

I'm guessing it's like that to minimize the effect of +W ?

[jejeba86]

Not all of the mechanisms we use when designing items are immediately apparent at a first glance. It can sometimes take a close look at an item's stat block to gauge it's true worth.

In this case, it's not just the critical range. Take a look also at the damage die size, and the number of dice it rolls per attack.
[2.50]2d6 means that it deals 5d6 base physical damage per shot. Then on top of that, yes, the critical range is also doubled. It would be 17-20 if you have Improved Critical.

I think it's a nice bow, but I'm not a bow user.
Anyway, as some pointed out, seeker +10 is now pretty common. So why don't you raise this cap, after all, it's the new top end game raid loot.
You did it with the 20% ranged alacrity, which made it pretty good in that.
I think an on crit effect would be nice too, in addition. could be something related to sonic.

[Ape_Man]

Not all of the mechanisms we use when designing items are immediately apparent at a first glance. It can sometimes take a close look at an item's stat block to gauge it's true worth.

In this case, it's not just the critical range. Take a look also at the damage die size, and the number of dice it rolls per attack.
[2.50]2d6 means that it deals 5d6 base physical damage per shot. Then on top of that, yes, the critical range is also doubled. It would be 17-20 if you have Improved Critical.

Like a Thornlord on Steroids . . . I like.

[Schmoe]

Not all of the mechanisms we use when designing items are immediately apparent at a first glance. It can sometimes take a close look at an item's stat block to gauge it's true worth.

In this case, it's not just the critical range. Take a look also at the damage die size, and the number of dice it rolls per attack.
[2.50]2d6 means that it deals 5d6 base physical damage per shot. Then on top of that, yes, the critical range is also doubled. It would be 17-20 if you have Improved Critical.

I haven't run any numbers yet, but I have a hunch that this will turn out to be a very nice bow. The base stats are very solid. As for the seeker, just because some people have seeker +10 somewhere else doesn't mean that everyone will. This allows slot consolidation. The screaming is a nice bonus, too.

[bbqzor]

Not all of the mechanisms we use when designing items are immediately apparent at a first glance. It can sometimes take a close look at an item's stat block to gauge it's true worth.

In this case, it's not just the critical profile. Take a look also at the damage die size, and the number of dice it rolls per attack.
[2.50]2d6 means that it deals 5d6 base physical damage per shot. Then on top of that, yes, the critical range is also doubled. It would be 17-20 if you have Improved Critical.

This and EThornlord have the same crit range, thus the same effect for things like +str, +dmg, etc. Its easy to compare them with just the base hit (modified by PBS).

3(1d8+2)+8 vs 3.5(2d6)+7; or 27.5 vs 31.5. Even without considering the seeker (potentially a wash) or the sonic (potentially resisted), Pinion wins in raw damage. And that also ignores the alacrity component, which as mentioned is minor at best but is still an improvement. It also ignores that EThornlord has 1 better attack, which again is minor at best, but I think virtually anyone in DDO at this level would take more haste over more attack any day of the week and twice on raid nights.

However, as you say Feather, not everything is apparent at first glance... Without any augment slot, and zero tags for bypassing DR, it isn't all that exciting against anything with even DR 5. EThornlord can be aug'd with good, then combined with arrows, to eliminate DR concerns.

So, Pinion is a winner... against trash mobs. Or if you perma group with an Arty. According to other threads, it may be possible to make this bow a Set Item with the new trinkets, potentially making it a combined improvement over say, EThornlord + Litany + Quiver of Alacrity once you factor a set bonus in... but again since you have to remove it anytime you're facing anything with a dual DR I'm not sure if I'd bother.

Bottom line, its a step in the right direction since, unlike many named items, its actually in the ballpark. But raid loot should be useful in raids: consider giving this thing either some DR tags, or maybe a self only click 1/shrine which gives it 5 minutes of good like the arty spell if you don't want it breaking DR full time. Even though its better raw damage against trash, one of the best possible uses of archery against trash is landing cc effects, meaning this may not be used even then.

And before anyone goes into bringing up twisting in alignment tags off a destiny to help on DR, you have to remember if you go down that road the comparison becomes Pinion plus alignment destiny vs EThornlord vs another destiny... and with the plethora of very solid dps options, I hesitate to call that a solution. A workaround perhaps, but I suspect (without going through every possible destiny combo etc) that EThornlord plus other twists would gain more than Pinion plus dr twists.

As it stands, the only real reason to grind this out is.... its less of a grind than EThornlord. Likely by a large margin. Maybe as DDO moves forward you are not intending to use mobs with dual DR types anymore, which lessens the concern, but coming off 6 years of raid bosses with dual types, I'm simply raising the point now, while theres a feedback thread on the subject. Thanks, cheers.