Dragon Scale Armor questions

[geoffhanna]

The release notes state:

"The artisans in Gianthold who craft Dragonscale Armor have refined their craft. New versions of the Blue, Black, and White Dragonscale items are now available here.

Dragonscale Armors from Gianthold have been increased in power to be more appropriate to their rarity and prestige. Although their minimum level to equip remains at 14, they now may be useful for characters up to level 20."

White Armor has been clearly enhanced with the upgrade to Heavy Fort. The extra +4 in shield AC is an upgrade over a one-use Shield clickie. Hopefully that stacks with actual shield usage AC but it is an add either way. [Edit] it does not stack

Some of the Black Armor has been enhanced but some has not. It used to be that black dragonhide leather was uniquely rogue armor, providing skill pluses and ranged alacrity. In the new version the black leather has identical features as all the other black dragon armor. The skill pluses are entirely gone.

Blue Armor is entirely unchanged. Potency VII is now just "Potency" and adds 48 to ultimate spell power. But this is not really a change at all since all of the potency-type abilities have been reworked into spell power adds.

1. Is it WAI that rogues (and artificers) are now shut out?
2. Can I keep my existing black dragonhide armor or is it going to be automatically upgraded to the new version like it or not?
3. What is the change to blue armor? Am I just missing it?
4. Does the Shield AC bonus possessed by white armor stack with a shield? [edit] nevermind, test this, does not stack

[Nysrock]

The release notes state:

"The artisans in Gianthold who craft Dragonscale Armor have refined their craft. New versions of the Blue, Black, and White Dragonscale items are now available here.

Dragonscale Armors from Gianthold have been increased in power to be more appropriate to their rarity and prestige. Although their minimum level to equip remains at 14, they now may be useful for characters up to level 20."

White Armor has been clearly enhanced with the upgrade to Heavy Fort and the extra +4 in shield AC. Hopefully that stacks with actual shield usage AC but it is an add either way.

Some of the Black Armor has been enhanced but some has not. It used to be that black dragonhide leather was uniquely rogue armor, providing skill pluses and ranged alacrity. In the new version the black leather has identical features as all the other black dragon armor. The skill pluses are entirely gone.

Blue Armor is entirely unchanged. Potency VII is now just "Potency" and adds 48 to ultimate spell power. But this is not really a change at all since all of the potency-type abilities have been reworked into spell power adds.

1. Is it WAI that rogues (and artificers) are now shut out?
2. Can I keep my existing black dragonhide armor or is it going to be automatically upgraded to the new version like it or not?
3. What is the change to blue armor? Am I just missing it?
4. Does the Shield AC bonus possessed by white armor stack with a shield?

From what I understand from what has been posted, current dragonscale armor will NOT auto upgrade. So those who wish to keep the old armor can and those who want the new armor need to farm the scales.

[Rogann]

1. Is it WAI that rogues (and artificers) are now shut out?

What are you talking about? The new black armor is amazing rogue armor! Ill be swaping from redscale to blackscale against fire immune mobs. 10% fort pen + dmg buff + haste guard=win

[geoffhanna]

What are you talking about? The new black armor is amazing rogue armor! Ill be swaping from redscale to blackscale against fire immune mobs. 10% fort pen + dmg buff + haste guard=win

I should maybe amend that to say "rogues and artificers who enjoyed getting two skill boosts from the armor slot are shut out".

And ranged alacrity never worked right anyway did it? Or maybe it just didn't stack with Haste? Not popular, I remember that, although don't remember exactly why.

[-Zephyr-]

And ranged alacrity never worked right anyway did it? Or maybe it just didn't stack with Haste? Not popular, I remember that, although don't remember exactly why.

Doesn't stack with haste indeed.

[Maelwyn]

I examined my wizard's blue scale robe (the old version) and compared it to the new UI listing. The new blue scale is much better. The old version had Greater Arcane Lore, +4 AC, Spell Pen 7, and Potency 7. The new version has Greater Arcane Lore, +8 AC (much better), Spell Pen 7, and Spell Power +52 (much better--it's Superior Potency 7, basically).

Deconstructing/Trading-in your old blue scale will grant about 13 dragon scales (blue for blue). At least, that's what it gave me in the UI exchange. I ran GH Tor on normal with one other player, and we each got a dragon scale in every chest. IIRC, the drop rate for scales in Tor are now 100% bonus for normal, 300% bonus for hard, and 500% bonus for elite. Didn't Fernando say this was the year of the Dragon? I'm personally hoping for a Truthful One quest pack/raid, Dracolich scale armor (if that is even possible), and why not even create some Spectral Dragon armor (increasing Spectral Dragon scale drop rates while decreasing the Mabar lag--again, IF even possible) LOL. Oh, and there are green dragons now, right? Hmmm.

To respond to your list of questions:

1. It is probably WAI that trap skills are not on the black armor. Black armor is DPS armor from the looks of it (Haste Guard, Armor Piercing, Relentless Fury). I don't feel this is shutting out any class, as the new armors seem to be set-up in distinct categories now--black = DPS, blue = caster, white = tank. Yes, it might hurt to not see anymore trap skills on the black armor, but there are a ton of options for rogue gear in the game currently.

2. Your old armor will not change, from the looks of it. So, no worries.

3. Answered above.

4. Shield bonuses do not stack with other shield bonuses, as far as I know. For example, if I use a shield wand on my AC tank, and then equip a Madstone shield, the Madstone bonus (being higher) will be applied. If I unequip the shield, then my +4 shield wand bonus is applied. Therefore, a +4 constant shield bonus, should be just that, a +4 bonus until you can equip something that grants a higher shield bonus. I will miss the magic missile absorption part of the shield bonus though, as it is no longer a shield spell type clicky but an actual shield bonus to AC, instead (on the armor that is). I'll still be carrying around my level 10 shield wands, though.

[Angelus_dead]

Some of the Black Armor has been enhanced but some has not. It used to be that black dragonhide leather was uniquely rogue armor, providing skill pluses and ranged alacrity. In the new version the black leather has identical features as all the other black dragon armor. The skill pluses are entirely gone.

To have trap features on an armor never made sense. It'd be illogical for a person to put up with the switching delay to get into an armor before doing a trap, or to walk around in terrible armor just to be ready for traps.

[Rellos]

did the red scale armors change at all?

[MRMechMan]

[*]Is it WAI that rogues (and artificers) are now shut out?
[*]Does the Shield AC bonus possessed by white armor stack with a shield? [edit] nevermind, test this, does not stack

Putting skill bonuses on an armor is silly anyway. If by "shut out" you mean "has to use a hotswap that takes 2seconds" then yes, rogues/artis have been shut out.

Shield spell doesn't stack with actual shields.

[Missing_Minds]

I should maybe amend that to say "rogues and artificers who enjoyed getting two skill boosts from the armor slot are shut out".

And ranged alacrity never worked right anyway did it? Or maybe it just didn't stack with Haste? Not popular, I remember that, although don't remember exactly why.

Correct, the skills are gone, so you have to get a set pre expansion to get skills.

Ranged alacrity does work, but you have to remember, Turbine has NEVER stated what the hell the % is based on. it sure isn't shots per 60 seconds. I suspect it is 10% faster animation speed. And no, it did not stack with haste.

It is replaced with.. 10% armor piercing, like the Envenomed (short) swords, and a buff that IF you get the killing shot, you get a buff for... 30 seconds was it? That increases your physical damage by 5%. (note, just physical damage)
It also has haste guard.

As to the poo hooers, some people actually LIKE having the utility of not having to swap. We used to have a choice on how to play, that has been removed. I thought this game was supposed to be good about choices.

did the red scale armors change at all?

Per feather, the only change was the AC value based on the armor, like all other armors.

[sirgog]

Live black scale armor is rubbish on rogues. +13 skills are dicey on the nastier traps, and the better +15 skill items are readily obtained for less than the cost of one black dragon scale.

The one skill you actually might want always-on, Spot, isn't on the black armor either.

OTOH the MOTU black scale armor is clear best-in-slot pre level 20 armor for rogues (fortification bypass on the class that benefits most from fortification bypass...), instead of being an item that's too expensive for any casual player to realistically make and too weak for any powergamer to consider using.

The black dragonscale armors look amazing - I for one am glad the expansion un-gimps them so more people will actually equip this awesome looking piece.

[stoerm]

Awesome change!

[Maelwyn]

I ran a Tor on Beta the other day, but didn't find any blue, black, or white helmets in the chest. My question: has anyone seen if there are newer versions of the blue, black and white helmets now?

[WruntJunior]

I'm really liking the new black scale, myself...I'll probably make a set for my rogue and for Wruntblender.

As for the skills on the old black scale...there's a rather easy-to-make epic item that's many times better than that (and also easier to make than scale armor): Epic Utility Vest. As for search, if you're using only +13 at high levels, you may be having a bit of trouble with traps (as you're at least 7 below where you could be).

[Sarisa]

I examined my wizard's blue scale robe (the old version) and compared it to the new UI listing. The new blue scale is much better. The old version had Greater Arcane Lore, +4 AC, Spell Pen 7, and Potency 7. The new version has Greater Arcane Lore, +8 AC (much better), Spell Pen 7, and Spell Power +52 (much better--it's Superior Potency 7, basically).

It's a grand total of 4 spell power. Old robe converts to 48 spell power. New robe is 52 spell power.

The 4 AC is not significant enough to make a huge difference in damage mitigation, and can actually be a detriment if you want to proc Torc/Conc Opp when you're close to the mob's to-hits.

[Missing_Minds]

I ran a Tor on Beta the other day, but didn't find any blue, black, or white helmets in the chest. My question: has anyone seen if there are newer versions of the blue, black and white helmets now?

There was no reports of new helmets in closed beta, and still no set bonus to be applied.

Also they wouldn't change the graphics of the helms, and the black helm "black" clashes with the "black" of the dragon scale.

[Ryiah]

As to the poo hooers, some people actually LIKE having the utility of not having to swap.

I think you're mistaking "utility" for where you clearly mean "laziness". Not that there is anything wrong with being too lazy to swap gear. But if you're going to gimp yourself by wearing your trapping gear all the time you might as well pick gear that is closer to end game. The +13 competence bonus to each of the skills is 7 points short of what current end game gear provides.

[voodoogroves]

To have trap features on an armor never made sense. It'd be illogical for a person to put up with the switching delay to get into an armor before doing a trap, or to walk around in terrible armor just to be ready for traps.

I know. Hate it. I end up wearing my utility vest more than I should because it's such a pain to change.

Live black scale armor is rubbish on rogues. +13 skills are dicey on the nastier traps, and the better +15 skill items are readily obtained for less than the cost of one black dragon scale.

The one skill you actually might want always-on, Spot, isn't on the black armor either.

OTOH the MOTU black scale armor is clear best-in-slot pre level 20 armor for rogues (fortification bypass on the class that benefits most from fortification bypass...), instead of being an item that's too expensive for any casual player to realistically make and too weak for any powergamer to consider using.

I'm personally excited about it.

The black dragonscale armors look amazing - I for one am glad the expansion un-gimps them so more people will actually equip this awesome looking piece.

Best reason right here.

[Missing_Minds]

I think you're mistaking "utility" for where you clearly mean "laziness". Not that there is anything wrong with being too lazy to swap gear. But if you're going to gimp yourself by wearing your trapping gear all the time you might as well pick gear that is closer to end game. The +13 competence bonus to each of the skills is 7 points short of what current end game gear provides.

Funny how so many assume that non lvl 20 characters can wear ML 20 gear. So because I'm unable to wear lvl 20 gear I'm SOOOOOOOOOO lazy. *rolls eyes*

Also for that level range, I can think of only 1 or 2 regions where 2 points could actually make a difference. And NONE AT ALL where it means quest completion or not.

And FYI, I already have epic utility vest waiting for when I hit 20.

[geoffhanna]

Thread has kind of wandered. But I do have my answers

• Is it WAI that rogues (and artificers) are now shut out?

People are arguing that DPS is up with the new armors and therefore no one is shut out. Okay. I guess. I would have rather had the black dragonhide get Spot and +15 to skills instead of +13.

• Can I keep my existing black dragonhide armor or is it going to be automatically upgraded to the new version like it or not?

Apparently I can. Which I suspect will get weird over time for Turbine as this means that I can also keep my original bluescale armors with Improved Potency VII which no longer even exists?

• What is the change to blue armor? Am I just missing it?

More armor remains the only significant change apparently.

• Does the Shield AC bonus possessed by white armor stack with a shield? [edit] nevermind, test this, does not stack

Nevermind, already tested this