Is Epic Normal really supposed to be that easy?

[Dunklerlindwurm]

I went into Epic Claw of Vulkoor-Normal to test how the new difficulty will be.

I didnt expect to come very far with my gimp level 21 druid

I played this Druid from scratch so he has no twink gear no raid gear not even tomes..so basicly a very bad charakter.
.
.
.
Then i started the quest and fought Sobrien....i meleed him down with a +5 quarterstaff (dont have anything better) and used 1 Storm of vengeance and had to heal myself only 1 time during that fight....
His damage output is a joke even for a ungeared charakter....his spells werent even noticeable.
At least he had some higher HP...which didnt make him difficult.

Guess dont have to say that the normal fire giants very even easier.

Then i came to the Scorpions....i killed all groups of scorpions with a single firewall...felt like doing shadow crypt...lol
And i dont even have good fire spell items just a 54% potency staff.
Think the scorpions have like 500-750 hp....
Only the scorpion ambushers did some noticeable damage around 30 per hit.

Well i finished this quest killing every single enemy on the way and used only 1 shrine....

Is this really supposed to be that easy??
If a gimp druid can do this that easy..what will a geared charakter do to that quest?

Does this even deserve the name Epic anymore??

[Rizzyn]

Did you get an Epic Chest at the end or nothing at all?

Do you have any Epic Destinies chosen? Did you use any of the Animal Forms or was it straight human throughout? What implements did you have? What enhancements?

Claw of Vulkoor is challenging because one of the core requirements to get an End Chest is to achieve the optional goals. Taken carefully, the mobs can be defeated, particularly if you take out the Healer Scorps first. If you did not get an Epic Chest, I don't think a clean sweep of the dungeon is the way to go with that one. It's always been more of a skill challenger than a conquest one.

[Dunklerlindwurm]

Did you get an Epic Chest at the end or nothing at all?

Do you have any Epic Destinies chosen? Did you use any of the Animal Forms or was it straight human throughout? What implements did you have? What enhancements?

Claw of Vulkoor is challenging because one of the core requirements to get an End Chest is to achieve the optional goals. Taken carefully, the mobs can be defeated, particularly if you take out the Healer Scorps first. If you did not get an Epic Chest, I don't think a clean sweep of the dungeon is the way to go with that one. It's always been more of a skill challenger than a conquest one.

No this has not changed.
Still got the Epic chest you always get at the end (optionals were never required for it)
If you do the optionals on life you get extra normal chests and im sure it will be the same now.

The Epic chest contained 21 fragments. You could still see the token on top of the Chest but it was not clickable.
The Quest gave 18k Xp without any Xp augments.

And no it was not challenging at all.
Didnt use a animal form. All i did was casting firewall 1 time when i had gathered enough scorpions (basicly did it like a heroic quest with gathering enemys and killing them with a single firewall)

I had choosen fury of the wild and i have the hp regeneration from it and +2 Strenght so nothing special really.

My caster item is a (just checked again) a +48 potency implement +9 item
Enhancements are max fire line and life magic line and a littlebit lightning.

[Ew_vastano]

yep well seems with all this "oh epic content is to hard" dumming down

Elite epic is probably gonna be about 50% easier then it is now

[loki_3369]

yep well seems with all this "oh epic content is to hard" dumming down

Elite epic is probably gonna be about 50% easier then it is now

epic eleet to hard plz nerf.

[Venny]

With Scaling... it may be more of a challenge with a party rather than solo

[danotmano1998]

With Scaling... it may be more of a challenge with a party rather than solo

This may indeed be the case. I'd love to hear how a full party compares to a solo'er in terms of difficulty.

[Dunklerlindwurm]

With Scaling... it may be more of a challenge with a party rather than solo

And that exactly is the problem

This is already the problem with heroic levels-no need to group..grouping just makes all quests harder.

Now we have the same with epics.

Honestly even Normal Sins of attrition is harder than Epic claw of vulkoor-normal

[donblas]

And that exactly is the problem

This is already the problem with heroic levels-no need to group..grouping just makes all quests harder.

Now we have the same with epics.

Honestly even Normal Sins of attrition is harder than Epic claw of vulkoor-normal

I do a lot of quests solo or duo and I really think that grouping should be encouraged more. Maybe change the scaling so that it's a little more difficult to short man quests. This is D&D online!

[CarpeNoctu]

I do a lot of quests solo or duo and I really think that grouping should be encouraged more. Maybe change the scaling so that it's a little more difficult to short man quests.

I solo because I got sick of the attitudes I so often had to deal with. I got sick of the elitists, the noobs, the arrogant boasters... I'm here to have fun and those attitudes make that impossible for me.

I'm not saying that my laid back attitude is any less annoying to them, either. I realize that I may be way too laid back and unconcerned for their taste/style, and I have no problem accepting that. But, as I don't have a set time I get on every day or even every week, it's easier for me to solo than to find a static group of like minded people, and I've lost interest in the "box of chocolates" that is the pug.

So, when Turbine comes up with a way to change the players rather than the game, I'll fully support this, but as it is I'm perfectly happy taking my time and knowing it's my own fault when I fail, then working to improve my skill, my tactics and my gear so I can try it again.

This is D&D online!

Very true, but... D&D is a tabletop game that's generally played in a small room with a group of friends... It's not a game that you play in the food court of the mall with random strangers sitting down at random times to join a particular quest. You know the people you play D&D with and you're just as familiar with their attitudes as they are of yours, and that makes things much easier.

[knockcocker]

Very true, but... D&D is a tabletop game that's generally played in a small room with a group of friends... It's not a game that you play in the food court of the mall with random strangers sitting down at random times to join a particular quest. You know the people you play D&D with and you're just as familiar with their attitudes as they are of yours, and that makes things much easier.

Sigh. I wish more people got this.

[garlor]

This is already the problem with heroic levels-no need to group..grouping just makes all quests harder.

no, grouping with bad players makes the quests harder, grouping with good players makes em easier

the OP got 21 token fragments in what, 8-15 minutes?, you can get 1 token every 10 minutes in the challenges, 1 token in like 10-15 mins in lords of dust or etides, and I'd like to see the chance for scroll drops on epic normal

[JOTMON]

With Scaling... it may be more of a challenge with a party rather than solo

^This.


I suspect the new epic content is not as easy as people are boasting them to be.
A uber geared caster soloing a scaled dungeon is not a fair representation.

Dungeon scaling for soloing vs a party is a huge difference.
Even 2 manning becomes an easy button vs a full party run.

To me it appears the dungeon scaling is broken.

I can run elite cannith challenges 2man melee (was running Progenitor crystal.. the protect the kobold with the big crystal) with no issues, mobs are manageable. Was going so well we decided to invite a couple more people to get them through it.

4 man party(no casters -2 protecting the foreman did not wander, the other 2 were at the cat path) as soon as the kobold picked up the crystal we went from no alert to full on red dungeon alert. As melee's we could not run, superslowed and mobbed to death.

Thought it must have been a bad instance tried 2 more times then said screw this and changed to two 2man parties both of which completed several runs without any issues.

I definitely notice a big difference questing wise between running a full party and soloing epic quests.

So when I see braggards boasting about how they solo'ed an epic quest.. it is a meaningless achievement.

Solo It with without Dungeon Scaling (a party of 5 pikers in the quest) and I'll recognize that as epic worthy.

The whole Dungeon Scaling needs to be scrapped.. either run it with a party or be uber enough to short man it.

Red dungeon alert also needs to be scrapped or changed, it doesnt hurt zerging casters they can throw down an AOE and still kill everything around them since spells are not impacted in any way, only melee's who cant move or hit mobs are detrimentally impacted.

At least change this DA by removing the existing effects and change to a blue bar 50% spell damage reduction penalty for Red DA.. that would hurt caster zergs who are saving SP by running past mobs. Center the DA on the offender, the quest wide impact of DA screws the entire party who end up red DA and are nowhere near the active mobs aggroed on a rogue zerger or lost soul running for his life in the wrong direction.

The game is supposed to be geared to party play not catering to soloists who can't solo unscaled content.

[danotmano1998]

^This.
To me it appears the dungeon scaling is broken.

I can run elite cannith challenges 2man <snip>

Yes, but challenges are twice over broken, and admitted to by a dev. (Madfloyd??)
These have 2 kinds of scaling going on in them, which is NOT WAI.

[Thrudh]

Don't think of it as "epic" normal... Think of it as a level 20 quest on normal. Which are usually pretty easy for a good player.

[sirgog]

Don't think of it as "epic" normal... Think of it as a level 20 quest on normal. Which are usually pretty easy for a good player.

This.

Trust me, epic elite is nasty. I've completed epic elite Claw and it was quite a bit tougher than live epic Claw (although just in the 'mobs have higher stats' way rather than a 'you need to use more tricks and skills' way.

[Dunklerlindwurm]

This.

Trust me, epic elite is nasty. I've completed epic elite Claw and it was quite a bit tougher than live epic Claw (although just in the 'mobs have higher stats' way rather than a 'you need to use more tricks and skills' way.

Yea i believe that...i just didnt expect a level 21 quest on normal to be way easier than a level 19 quest like sins of attrition on normal.
It is even easier then inspired quarter on normal..and you know how easy that is

[Dolphious]

Don't think of it as "epic" normal... Think of it as a level 20 quest on normal. Which are usually pretty easy for a good player.

I think the mobs are about as tough as I would expect from a "level 20 quest on normal" but because of the design of many/most of the epic quests, it's actually a lot easier. E.g. if you replaced all the mobs in snitch (one that I did) with orthons from sins of attrition normal, it would probably be even easier than it is now, but overall the quest is probably even easier than normal sins because of the relatively small number of mobs you fight at a time, and the comparative plethora of rest shrines.

That might not be a terrible thing, nothing wrong with having some quick and easy quests "around town" to solo when you don't have a lot of time... but it's quite the shift from they way things are on live to the point of being a bit jarring.

[redspecter23]

I tried an epic normal Von 1 yesterday just to test it out. I was quite happy defensively with my level 20 monk until I realized that the mobs were hitting me quite a bit, but for practically nothing. I went to the first red named minotaur. The one that typically smokes me in 4 hits or less on live and just sat there for a minute. He got plenty of hits in, all for practically nothing. I'm still not entirely sure if I like that or not. It trivializes defense after it's been nerfed making me wonder why I even try at all for AC for epic normal. I could run around with a crafted holy/vampirism weapon and stay at full health the whole time.

[Eladiun]

Dungeon scaling is one of the worst things ever introduced to this game.