Suggestion to cap Wail/Circle and get rid of the "Hard to kill" ward

[Tid12]

The main concern of this ward is that it doesn't affect only wizards.

It affects rogues, monks, divine casters, sorcerers.

While I think the proposal of this ward is good (: Stopping the Necro wizards from being the kings), the ward itself isn't THE BEST suggestion.

My suggestion is:

• Cap Wail of the Banshee/Circle of Death to 3-4 MAX mobs (like Implosion). Increase both their CD of about 15 seconds.

This way, they won't spam wail in every counter we did. Even if they did so, since many encounters have more than 4 mobs, there will be mobs left for the melees, rogues, monks and everyone else.


If you don't like this suggestion, then you should give the ability to rogues and monks to bypass this ward. Rogues can assassinate MAX 2 mobs per assassinate, Monks 1. Their abilities isn't game breaking like Wail.

[Rizzia]

IIRC circle is capped at 4 mobs (i know undead to death is).

[Scraap]

IIRC circle is capped at 4 mobs (i know undead to death is).

It is. That'd put the effective difference as:

circle = ranged aoe with a lead time from cast to application, so you sneak or lock em down, vs
wail = aoe while they're in your face, with wail being the higher level one.

I've heard worse notions, though I still favor either a second pair of saves, or a total HD vs DC so there's still some progression, or upping the casting time on wail so you're getting wailed on.

Course, I'd also favor fleshing out the rest of the necro-specific PREs ancillary utilities (yes, both of them) so there's a point in doing more than speccing necro on a sorc and going to town.

[Fecerak]

Personally I'd like seeing hard to kill only effect aoe instakill spells (as in circle, wail and possibly implode) while single-target instakills are unaffected. Thus wail would function as before in epic normal but would not be as effective (but still useful) in epic hard and elite.

[Rizzia]

Personally I'd like seeing hard to kill only effect aoe instakill spells (as in circle, wail and possibly implode) while single-target instakills are unaffected. Thus wail would function as before in epic normal but would not be as effective (but still useful) in epic hard and elite.

This is probably the best comprimise (yeah typo and far far too tired to try and fix it). Allows those that spec for instakill to still help out the party with timely single target insta's but also limits wail (I honestly dont see what all the fuss about circle of death is tho, mobs get 2 saves and it only hits 4 mobs)

[Tid12]

This is probably the best comprimise (yeah typo and far far too tired to try and fix it). Allows those that spec for instakill to still help out the party with timely single target insta's but also limits wail (I honestly dont see what all the fuss about circle of death is tho, mobs get 2 saves and it only hits 4 mobs)

Usually the ref saves are lower than their fort. That means: they will either die or take neg levels. If you are heavy specced, you have right here basically 2 wails, 1 with uncapped mobs and the other with capped one.

My suggestion decrease the value of aoe necro spells but does nothing to the single target ones.

[Udalric]

The main concern of this ward is that it doesn't affect only wizards.

It affects rogues, monks, divine casters, sorcerers.

While I think the proposal of this ward is good (: Stopping the Necro wizards from being the kings), the ward itself isn't THE BEST suggestion.

My suggestion is:

• Cap Wail of the Banshee/Circle of Death to 3-4 MAX mobs (like Implosion). Increase both their CD of about 15 seconds.

This way, they won't spam wail in every counter we did. Even if they did so, since many encounters have more than 4 mobs, there will be mobs left for the melees, rogues, monks and everyone else.


If you don't like this suggestion, then you should give the ability to rogues and monks to bypass this ward. Rogues can assassinate MAX 2 mobs per assassinate, Monks 1. Their abilities isn't game breaking like Wail.

/Signed