Feedback: Magister

[Faent]

Does anyone know if the Necrotic Touch/Bolt/Blast SLAs from Pale Master count as "offensive necromancy spells" for Necromancy Augmentation (chance at -5 to Fort saves)?

I don't know the answer to this question. They should, of course. But if they do, I'm not seeing much benefit here. That's a really awful way to try to drop saves, IMO. You can only get up to a 15% chance for this save drop, I think. Standing around tossing this stuff hoping for a save drop sounds like a bad time to me. (Do you get any indication when the save drop occurs, BTW? I have this ability, but so far haven't noticed any special indication that that save drop occurred.)

[PopeJual]

I haven't seen any effect from Variable Resistance. I have two levels of it and I'm still taking elemental damage - even in a quest where I'm only taking damage of one element type.

2 levels times 3 stacks of 10 resistance added to my Resist Elements of 30 is a total of 90 resistance against any one element. Why am I still taking elemental damage?

Am I using the Variable Resistance wrong? Do I have to "turn it on" or something?

I was really excited about getting that ability. Now I'm just sad.

[sephiroth1084]

The way the tiers are set-up for many of the abilities makes it very difficult to take desired enhancements in the tree. Having to spend 3 AP on the ability to impose a -5 penalty to Fort saves with my offensive Necro spells in order to get a cooldown reduction on them is pretty steep. Having to spend 3 ranks on the cooldown, in addition to the Fort debuffer, in order to get +3 Spell Pen with the school (+1 CL/rank) is ridiculous.

Why does it seem like everything in the tree is dependent on ranks from their prerequisites? Do any other destinies work like this?

[Vargouille]

Why does it seem like everything in the tree is dependent on ranks from their prerequisites? Do any other destinies work like this?

All Epic Destinies work this way. If a prerequisite for ability RawrKill has 3 ranks, you must take all three in order to get to 3 ranks of RawrKill.

[Havok.cry]

Is it intentional that arcane tempest does not benefit from maximise, empower or sorc faster casting?

Should the epic summons from magister be epic or should they be the CR 12-15 weaklings they currently are?

[chrisdinus7]

Is it intentional that arcane tempest does not benefit from maximise, empower or sorc faster casting?

Should the epic summons from magister be epic or should they be the CR 12-15 weaklings they currently are?

I believe it is. A dev somewhere in the beta said that those types of abilities wouldn't benefit from metas. The draconic ones don't either. Really, the only power in the destinies that I know of that does is avenging light in the exalted angel tree. But, arcane tempest and the draconic nukes make up for it with their high damage dice, often several d6 per level verses a more typical one per level for spells.

That said, arcane tempest is kind of weak, given duration verses cooldown. If you want that kind of nuke, the draconic ones win hands down. For magister, I'd go all DCs and spell pen (if needed). For nuking, I'd switch to draconic.

Haven't tested the summon, I just assumed they'd be weak, :P

[Scraap]

Should the epic summons from magister be epic or should they be the CR 12-15 weaklings they currently are?

Judging by the CR 8 summon 8s in epic content, betting no.

[sephiroth1084]

All Epic Destinies work this way. If a prerequisite for ability RawrKill has 3 ranks, you must take all three in order to get to 3 ranks of RawrKill.

My point was that half of the destiny is tied up with these trees. If I want the top enhancements for the Spell School line, I need to sink a bunch of AP into stuff I don't want. Add to that the AP I have to spend in tier I on junk, and half the AP in Magister gets locked up with qualifying for the stuff I actually want. From what I've seen, this is not the case anywhere else, where most of the destines features stand-alone enhancements with a few that are tied into trees, and I haven't seen any with a 4-tier tree.

[oberon131313]

to repeat what I said in bug discussion:

there is a flaw in the implementation of Nullmagic Strike with regards to the Nullmagic Aura counter.

Nullmagic Strike will only increment the Nullmagic Aura counter if it is able to successfully prevent the mob from casting spells (regardless of if they have the ability to cast spells or not).

What this means is that Nullmagic Strike will never count when fighting a Red-or-Purple named. This means that Nullmagic Strike can only increment the counter when fighting trash.

Ignoring any concerns about how difficult Nullmagic Aura may or may not be to stack, or duration, or any other concerns, this prevents this ability from being used in anything other than trivial encounters.

Currently, Nullmagic Guard has the correct procedure: the counter increments when it procs, regardless of who (or if) it hits. Please change Nullmagic Strike to increment on proc.

[Faent]

My point was that half of the destiny is tied up with these trees. If I want the top enhancements for the Spell School line, I need to sink a bunch of AP into stuff I don't want. Add to that the AP I have to spend in tier I on junk, and half the AP in Magister gets locked up with qualifying for the stuff I actually want. From what I've seen, this is not the case anywhere else, where most of the destines features stand-alone enhancements with a few that are tied into trees, and I haven't seen any with a 4-tier tree.

So the DEV's are claiming that if I want three tiers of Necromancy Mastery, I first need to acquire:

3 Tiers of Useful Necromancy Specialist (3 Points), and
3 Tiers of Garbage Necromancy Augmentation (3 Points), and
3 Tiers of Garbage Necromancy Familiarity (3 Points)

Then I could purchase the 3 Tiers of Necromancy Mastery (3 Points)? If so, this is a total joke. And it appears to be how the system is designed. To pick up 3 Tiers of Necromancy Mastery, you must expend 12/24 AP's, 6 of which are totally wasted on garbage. At this point, you've basically blown so many AP you're cut out of 3 INT Enhancements. And you blew all that to pick up, basically, a whopping +3 to your Spell Penetration. This stinks to high heaven.

Edit: It looks like you can fit 2 Tiers of Necromancy Mastery as things currently stand. All INT. 3 Unearthly Reactions. Arcane Adept. And the rest burned in that ugly four tier tree.

[MelkiorPeasantbane]

Should the epic summons from magister be epic or should they be the CR 12-15 weaklings they currently are?

Epic lich when summoned in a heroic quest is CR 20. From what I have seen, summons CRs of all types currently fluctuate in all epic content, depending on difficulty. Summons even get epic ward on epic elite.

WAI? I doubt it but I'd love to hear about it. I've bug reported it.

[oberon131313]

So the DEV's are claiming that if I want three tiers of Necromancy Mastery, I first need to acquire:

3 Tiers of Useful Necromancy Specialist (3 Points), and
3 Tiers of Garbage Necromancy Augmentation (3 Points), and
3 Tiers of Garbage Necromancy Familiarity (3 Points)

Then I could purchase the 3 Tiers of Necromancy Mastery (3 Points)? If so, this is a total joke. And it appears to be how the system is designed. To pick up 3 Tiers of Necromancy Mastery, you must expend 12/24 AP's, 6 of which are totally wasted on garbage. At this point, you've basically blown so many AP you're cut out of 3 INT Enhancements. And you blew all that to pick up, basically, a whopping +3 to your Spell Penetration. This stinks to high heaven.

Edit: It looks like you can fit 2 Tiers of Necromancy Mastery as things currently stand. All INT. 3 Unearthly Reactions. Arcane Adept. And the rest burned in that ugly four tier tree.

Yes, the same as a Shiradi that wants to acquire "Double Rainbow" must first acquire "Prism" and then "Rainbow."

[MelkiorPeasantbane]

Does anyone know if the Necrotic Touch/Bolt/Blast SLAs from Pale Master count as "offensive necromancy spells" for Necromancy Augmentation (chance at -5 to Fort saves)?

Yes, it does. I don't have a screen shot but I noticed the blue aura, got a inspect on the mob, tool tiped the new icon and saw the debuff. Was pleasantly surprised.

[Faent]

Yes, the same as a Shiradi that wants to acquire "Double Rainbow" must first acquire "Prism" and then "Rainbow."

Which is a whopping 4 points of pre-reqs. To get to Master of Necromancy, you have 9 points of pre-reqs (three of which are very useful---the rest are junk).

[oberon131313]

Which is a whopping 4 points of pre-reqs. To get to Master of Necromancy, you have 9 points of pre-reqs (three of which are very useful---the rest are junk).

To you. They are very helpful to my Evo Arti.

[sephiroth1084]

To you. They are very helpful to my Evo Arti.

That's the thing. These need to be useful for 7 schools of magic (really more like 4), and making them requirements for advancement kind of sucks for some of those characters.

If you were required to take one rank in each to advance and get what you wanted, then it might not be terrible (only 2-3 wasted AP probably), but having to spend 3 ranks in each tier you don't want? Bleh!

Similarly, I'm not all that thrilled with the Sigils, but a lot of the cool abilities I would like require leveling those, too.

[oberon131313]

That's the thing. These need to be useful for 7 schools of magic (really more like 4), and making them requirements for advancement kind of sucks for some of those characters.

If you were required to take one rank in each to advance and get what you wanted, then it might not be terrible (only 2-3 wasted AP probably), but having to spend 3 ranks in each tier you don't want? Bleh!

Similarly, I'm not all that thrilled with the Sigils, but a lot of the cool abilities I would like require leveling those, too.

Not saying I wouldn't support them breaking up that chain so that it's 2->3 4->5 instead of 2->3->4->5, but to say that all of the tiers are a waste is disingenuous.

Necromancy in particular benefits from the cooldown reduction (wail, circle of death, symbol of death).

The -10 to saves is huge for mopping up.

[Faent]

To you. They are very helpful to my Evo Arti.

Fair point. For Blade Barrier, I presume?

That's the thing. These need to be useful for 7 schools of magic (really more like 4), and making them requirements for advancement kind of sucks for some of those characters.

Excellent point. How about bundling Spell School Augmentation with Familiarity to reduce the length of the tree. Spell School Familiarity is pretty darn meh anyway.

Spell School Specialist --> Spell School Augmentation / Familiarity --> Master of School

Here, the second tier of the tree would allow you to pick either Augmentation or Familiarity. Let's say you'd need 3 AP's spent on the second tier (however distributed) to get 3 ranks of Master of School. But you could all 6 ranks of the second tier if you wanted to max both Augmentation and Familiarity. Alternatively, just pull Familiarity out of the tree entirely and make it its own thing. Or again, and alternatively, have Augmentation lead directly to both Familiarity and Master of School.

[oberon131313]

Fair point. For Blade Barrier, I presume?

and Tactical Det. And Prismatic Strike to a lesser extent. The added DCs and the ability for any of them to have a chance to reduce the saves for the next is, for lack of a better term, tasty.

[Faent]

Not saying I wouldn't support them breaking up that chain so that it's 2->3 4->5 instead of 2->3->4->5, but to say that all of the tiers are a waste is disingenuous.

Necromancy in particular benefits from the cooldown reduction (wail, circle of death, symbol of death).

The -10 to saves is huge for mopping up.

A whopping 9 AP's into the tree you can hit a 15% cooldown reduction. This saves 12 (of 80) seconds on Symbol of Death, 4.5 (of 30) seconds on Circle of Death, and 9 (of 60) seconds on Wail of the Banshee. Frankly, this is not that great. And I certainly don't want to have to dump 9 AP's for it. I can wait a few extra seconds, and I certainly don't need to spam Symbol of Death. On Wail, it's alright, but hardly worth the AP's (which will cut you out of better stuff). Going this route would cut you out of maxing INT (I assume you'll be taking Arcane Adept) and you'd have 1 AP left over. So not worth it. You'd have 2x Unearthly Reactions, 5 tiers of INT, Arcane Adept, and your tree maxed up to to 3 ranks in Spell School Familiarity with 1 remaining AP to spend. Nobody is going to do this.

Not sure how the small chance at save reduction plays on a PM. On an AM, it's basically worthless. I suppose we're supposed to take the Chill Touch SLA and spam it over and over hoping for the save reduction? It's on a 6 second cooldown, so no good there.