Guild recruiting difficulties

[dirtphillips]

I have made several attempts to recruit into what will eventually become my guild (I’m still the successor at this point). At one point I thought about leaving my current guild and joining a higher end guild. But my wife just bought our current guild the level 55 airship, so I’d hate to waste that money on a guild I’m leaving.

So far, all of my recruiting attempts have been utterly unsuccessful. Based on that, I thought I would get some feedback from the forums to improve my success rate. Please look at what I am asking through the eyes of a new-ish players. My guild is certainly not for the level of awesome-sauce that generally hangs out on the forums.

I have previously put up lfm’s when I’m on between about 8-11 (GMT -10) saying that a level 55 guild is recruiting. When people inquire/join, I explain that our guild is small and that it is important that new guildies mesh well with us. So, I asked them if they would be willing to run a few missions over a couple of evenings to see how we fit together. I also explain that being available to play during our hours at least a couple of times a week is necessary. Out of the 30 or so interests, I got two people that seemed to be cool, but both lived on the east coast and so would rarely be on when we were. The rest were generally “invite me now or I leave”. I invited them to take their 2nd option.

Now, I should explain that I would like to keep our guild small-ish and that we do not raid much at this time. If I could get enough members, I suppose we could start to raid and fill out with PUG-ers. Due to the hours we’re on and our experience level, we generally only run the PUG raids (Shroud, Reaver’s, a few TOD, HOX, VOD).

I am interested in finding players that have the same concerns that we do:

- Have a family, playing time is occasionally interrupted.
- Play during our time frame.
- Just want to have a good time, not as interested in XP/minute as the end all.
-
Since most existing players that have this mindset are generally already in a good guild, how have you all been able to identify new players that are promising? Should I just frequent Korthos more often, run with PUG’s and see who I like? Any suggestions are appreciated.

[Wickednisse]

It sounds to me like you're doing it right You are going for quality over quantity, and while it may take longer to fill - it will be worth it in the long run. Good luck to you!!

[eclipse668]

Now, I should explain that I would like to keep our guild small-ish and that we do not raid much at this time. If I could get enough members, I suppose we could start to raid and fill out with PUG-ers. Due to the hours we’re on and our experience level, we generally only run the PUG raids (Shroud, Reaver’s, a few TOD, HOX, VOD).

I'm with Wickednisse - your aproach is the right one in the long run. getting a community together on that level takes time (months if you'd ask me but that is just an estimate).
you could try to draft from your guild runs, but you will have to establish something that makes you stand out as a guild/raiding/questing group to get ppl interested and distinguish yourselves from beeing 'yet another guild looking for players'.
this post stating your members are 'handpicked' and have some sort of social empathy and ability might very well get some readers interested.

all the best...

[karl_k0ch]

Chiming in with the two.

Pug a lot, put people you like to run with in your friends list. Get to know people you like to run with. Then, ask these if they are interested to join.

Also, regarding the investment for the ship: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_costs

[wax_on_wax_off]

I read in your OP that your demanding a lot from potential candidates but you aren't actually offering anything except "being in a level 55 guild".

Some ideas:

• Be less stringent with play times, over in Khyber in Crimson Eagles we are generally an Australian East Coast play time guild but if we restricted it as such we would be very small. In the end we've ended up a "medium" sized guild with players from Australia, South East Asia, a token European or two and a few Americans; this is quite good as it means that there's someone on all the time rather than in just the very narrow window.
• Offer play experience, if your recruiting then concurrently schedule raids, its a great way for guild members to get to know one another and it brings the guild together. Chronoscope is level 6, Tempest Spine is level 12 and there are plenty of other raids at higher levels, really no reason not to do some of these formal guild activities.
• As long as you don't have a guild chest then consider giving potential candidates "probation invites" if that's what they want and just be strong enough to dismiss them from the guild if it doesn't work out. This negatively affects renown but no need to exclude potential guild members. That said, from the sound of it most of your candidates wouldn't have worked out anyway so you probably made the right decision there.
• Finding better recruitment strategies is important, post a recruitment thread on the forums, pug a lot and ask your officers and guild members to keep an eye out for candidates in pugs too, when you do guild raids make sure you post a big LFM for at least 30 minutes prior to the raid so that the server knows that your guild is running a raid, its ok if you pug out some or even most of the spots, its publicity.

All that said, it sounds like you have a great attitude and have what it takes to make your guild great, good luck

[Loromir]

I have made several attempts to recruit into what will eventually become my guild (I’m still the successor at this point). At one point I thought about leaving my current guild and joining a higher end guild. But my wife just bought our current guild the level 55 airship, so I’d hate to waste that money on a guild I’m leaving.

So far, all of my recruiting attempts have been utterly unsuccessful. Based on that, I thought I would get some feedback from the forums to improve my success rate. Please look at what I am asking through the eyes of a new-ish players. My guild is certainly not for the level of awesome-sauce that generally hangs out on the forums.

I have previously put up lfm’s when I’m on between about 8-11 (GMT -10) saying that a level 55 guild is recruiting. When people inquire/join, I explain that our guild is small and that it is important that new guildies mesh well with us. So, I asked them if they would be willing to run a few missions over a couple of evenings to see how we fit together. I also explain that being available to play during our hours at least a couple of times a week is necessary. Out of the 30 or so interests, I got two people that seemed to be cool, but both lived on the east coast and so would rarely be on when we were. The rest were generally “invite me now or I leave”. I invited them to take their 2nd option.

Now, I should explain that I would like to keep our guild small-ish and that we do not raid much at this time. If I could get enough members, I suppose we could start to raid and fill out with PUG-ers. Due to the hours we’re on and our experience level, we generally only run the PUG raids (Shroud, Reaver’s, a few TOD, HOX, VOD).

I am interested in finding players that have the same concerns that we do:

- Have a family, playing time is occasionally interrupted.
- Play during our time frame.
- Just want to have a good time, not as interested in XP/minute as the end all.
-
Since most existing players that have this mindset are generally already in a good guild, how have you all been able to identify new players that are promising? Should I just frequent Korthos more often, run with PUG’s and see who I like? Any suggestions are appreciated.

I am the leader of a lvl 63 guild. We have about 35 active players. I try to join PUGS from time to time and look for good players in those pugs who are in guilds that are lower levels than ours. I add them to my friends list and try to quest with them as often as I can for the next several days or so. I try to build up a rappor with that person, and if I like them and they seem to be decent and active players, I try to recruit them into my guild. Sometimes it might take some time to convince them to join, and you might not always be successful.

I find this a better route to recruiting than posting LFM's or spamming general chat. This way you know you are getting good quality players. Also, use your guild ship as a recruiting asset. Those people in lower level guilds will love getting the buffs from your higher level ship.

When you say smallish guild, how small do you mean? My guild of 35 players has players from all over the US and even some international. We seem to all way have at least 3 or so players and in the evenings and weekends it is usually 5-10 players on at a time. We have a standing guild raid night on Friday nights, and even the international players make time to be on at that time. We have one guy from France who will be on until around 8:00 AM in the morning on Saturday Morning just so he can join our raids.

You might want to consider expanding the size that you want your guild to be by a little bit. I would say shoot for 25-40 players. You will still get medium guild bonuses at that level.

Good Luck

[Uska]

word of warning its against the rules to put a lfm just to gain members for your guild you need to have a lfm up for an actual quest. You can get in minor trouble for violating the rule unless your a repeat offender

[redspecter23]

Bad players will join any guild that's high enough. Good players need a reason to join. Give them a reason. Create a forum thread here and list what your guild is all about. You've started by stating the "negatives" or requirements from a new potential guildmate, but, as mentioned above, you haven't offered any incentive outside of a medium sized ship.

People looking for a guild are looking for like minded players to run with. Personally, I'd prefer a guild to have an active endgame with raids run every night and 6 man epics scattered in. Good players with a good ethical code that matches mine. Top tier players looking to do elite and end game content and are capable of doing so.

From what I read here, you seem to be a decent individual, but that's the only thing I'm seeing from what I read. I wouldn't be so set about play times. You may play from 8-11 but a recruit might play from 6-9. If the majority of your group plays 8-11 then 6-8 is a dead zone. That recruit will grow bored and leave after a while. Keep an open mind about play times as others will be looking for groups at different times. I guess it depends on how large you want your guild to be, but more people give more options for grouping.

Be willing to give way more than you get from a guild. It seems you really want it to work so you probably already do this, but be proactive. Schedule guild events like raids in the message of the day so people can plan ahead. Run loot runs for undergeared guildies to get them to the level they can help more. Silver flame and yugoloth favor aren't the easiest to solo, but provide amazing rewards. Offer crafting services to guildies if you are into that sort of thing.

You have the right attitude to the recruiting process. You just have to give those notable players a reason to give you a shot, not the other way around. Once you're big enough, players will then be coming to you.

[lordpummel1-1]

yeah basically its just be who you are and recruit people you run with that seem like you would want to run again with them and them with you. Its better to go slow and build up, I think the reason you are having a hard time when you post a lfm people dont take it seriously as a guild, they think its a just wanna lvl guild that recruits anyone. Id write a guild recruitment post as back up and just have fun and bring in the people you like. When you find a couple you can trust to recruit under your guide lines make them officer and have them invite there friends too. Good luck! ~Starlissa

[Sarzor]

Depending on what you want to be known for, it is worth throwing up some raids. Doesn't have to be epic LoB, but could be Reaver's, ADQ, etc. There's invariably some people who will be unguilded, and you might like, and you can (politely) extend an invite to them after running with them a few times. Probably put something in your profile of a "Looking for a guild? We're looking for members! Let us party!" since some people (or well, just me maybe) read other people's profiles while we wait for people to get to the quest.

Another way would be to be helping people. If you TR, PUG a bit, and see what sort of people you run across. Skills can be taught, personality can't.

From my experience, there's often people looking for a change, and as someone earlier suggested, see who you enjoy running with, and see if they want to run with you more often.

[dirtphillips]

I didn't realize the first post came off negative in some ways, I will be sure to check for that appearance in future posts. The intent was to get across that I wanted mature players who get along and can deal with the occasional AFK. I know the forums don't represent the game population necessarily, but I am disinterested in running with the intent to maximize XP/minute. DDO is about the journey as well as the destination. My wife would often ask why I played PnP way back when. I told her it was an excuse for several guys to get together and BS and the game happened to be what brought us together.

Also, i was trying to make clear that this guild would be a home for those who simply do not have the time commitment or desire for serious end game content. That role is filled well by the well known guilds already. There has to be a populace of persons who dont need every piece of gear on the toon have a colorless slot but want to have decent gear and a good time above all.

I almost exclusively PUG, but since I'm TR-ing, i generally elite streak. If I have already run a quest, I'll join a group and try to help out. I enjoy PUG groups that either know what they're doing or are willing to ask questions. I try to helpfully suggest that the 66 hp sorc not draw so much aggro in elite last stand, but I dont belabor the point (it was entertaining watching him die repeatedly, though). I have made a few friends (including that one that lives in Hawaii also). But, they all belong to guilds at the moment, so I feel it would be inappropriate to poach from someone else's ranks.

[Izdaari]

Just some feedback as requested:

I like how your describe your guild and style of play, and would be potentially be interested. The biggest obstacle would probably be matching play times. I'm west coast US, so GMT -8, but on at odd hours. I work mostly weekends and have most week days off. I tend to be an unpredictable night owl. I started on Orien, but still have mostly lowbies there. I have one capped toon on another server. I like end game content well enough, but I'm not especially focused on it.

[Micki]

Bad players will join any guild that's high enough. Good players need a reason to join

lol. I joined Legends of Orien because they stated that they were casual and newbie friendly. I'm not really guild active, but I've stayed because of ship buffs and the fact that people are really nice and helpful (at least the officers). I actually like to pug (getting to know new people), so I wouldn't want to just run with the/a guild.

[playa_eric]

something i like to do at least 1 time a week is grab a lowbie and spoil them a bit...while doing this it opens up the window to figure out their goals and their motivation level towards the game...if they are interresting, ill friend them and invest more time into them...as they hit 20, ill guide them and lead raids on the side for them giving them tips which they will recieve better from me because of the help they have been getting over the levels...if they improve quickly and aren't willful little turds, they make good prospects . hope this helps!!!

-Ell

[Vengeance777]

I have made several attempts to recruit into what will eventually become my guild (I’m still the successor at this point). At one point I thought about leaving my current guild and joining a higher end guild. But my wife just bought our current guild the level 55 airship, so I’d hate to waste that money on a guild I’m leaving.

So far, all of my recruiting attempts have been utterly unsuccessful. Based on that, I thought I would get some feedback from the forums to improve my success rate. Please look at what I am asking through the eyes of a new-ish players. My guild is certainly not for the level of awesome-sauce that generally hangs out on the forums.

I have previously put up lfm’s when I’m on between about 8-11 (GMT -10) saying that a level 55 guild is recruiting. When people inquire/join, I explain that our guild is small and that it is important that new guildies mesh well with us. So, I asked them if they would be willing to run a few missions over a couple of evenings to see how we fit together. I also explain that being available to play during our hours at least a couple of times a week is necessary. Out of the 30 or so interests, I got two people that seemed to be cool, but both lived on the east coast and so would rarely be on when we were. The rest were generally “invite me now or I leave”. I invited them to take their 2nd option.

Now, I should explain that I would like to keep our guild small-ish and that we do not raid much at this time. If I could get enough members, I suppose we could start to raid and fill out with PUG-ers. Due to the hours we’re on and our experience level, we generally only run the PUG raids (Shroud, Reaver’s, a few TOD, HOX, VOD).

I am interested in finding players that have the same concerns that we do:

- Have a family, playing time is occasionally interrupted.
- Play during our time frame.
- Just want to have a good time, not as interested in XP/minute as the end all.
-
Since most existing players that have this mindset are generally already in a good guild, how have you all been able to identify new players that are promising? Should I just frequent Korthos more often, run with PUG’s and see who I like? Any suggestions are appreciated.

Its very hard to recruit players in the game. Your best bet is to advertise and to try to get some achievements to get exposure for your guild name so people will be drawn to it.

For advertising make a thread in the Orien guild section. List your guilds playstyle and goals. Also advertise occasionally in Harbor, Market, and Korthos chats listing the type of play style your looking for and your ship's level. I've noticed a lot of new players are drawn to ships for buffs so you can draw some players that way.

Do NOT spam the chats though. One quick post about it every few hours is more than enough. Spamming recruitment messages will actually drive people away.

Another great way to get recruits is to PUG and lead pugs. Start LFMs for low level content and take pugs. One thing you can do is make a Vet I level 4 toon, twink gear it out, and leave it at level 4 permanently. Then what you do is hold daily waterworks pugs and invite them to your ship for buffs before going in. New players struggle in this chain. Its also the most run chain for new players. Leading a daily pug will get your guild a lot of exposure to new players and you can pick up a lot of players for your guild by helping them run it. You'll also build a reputation for helping players and gain exposure for the guild as well.

You can also make a Vet II toon level it to 8 twink it out and run the Pit daily. Running daily pugs of the Pit teaching it is where I made a lot of my friends before I moved to Orien. Players are very scared of this quest. Teaching it is a great way to recruit new players. Its also an extremely fun quest when learned and a great test to see if a players playstyle fits what you are looking for with your guild.

Another great recruiting place is Tempest Spine. This is the only free to play raid in the game and is a great test of a players abilities and willingness to learn. Leading pugs of it should help you find a lot of potential recruits.

Finally, get your guild some achievements. Run something shortman, try a speed run, do anything that you can post on the achievements forum for your guild. Even if you fail to set a new speed record or fail the shortman post about it and how much fun your guild had doing it. Anytime you have fun running something take some screenshots and post about it. Getting your guild name out there and that its a guild thats having fun will draw players to you.

If players see your having fun the guilds name will stick in their mind. When they start looking for a guild they'll remember yours.

I wish you the best of luck and hopefully your guild grows the way you wish it to.

[Keybreaker]

if they improve quickly and aren't willful little turds, they make good prospects

lulz

[dirtphillips]

I like the level 4/8/11 parked toons idea. I have some in that range, so I can use existing toons in that role. I need to run the Pit more. Either I'll become numb to it or start to like it, because I do not like it at the moment.

The achievements idea does not appeal to me. I guess I am lazy with respect to DDO, but I'm not terribly interested in being the fastest, 2nd fastest, etc. I dislike the idea of competing with other players. I suppose that's why I don't like PvP. In PnP, it was the party vs. the DM's storyline. A storyline that you have to work to figure out was interesting. Since most of us know the quests very well, we can either entertain ourselves by beating the clock/kill count/etc. or by having a fun discussion while playing well. If the run is fun, then I have met my goal.

However, the underlying idea of being competent at leading quests is entirely sensible. I'll try to do more of that, even though I despise the star. Maybe I need to re-evaluate whether I really want to even lead a guild if I'm not willing to put in the level of effort described here. Me and my wife are leveling the guild just fine, maybe I should just keep it that way.

Karl, thanks for the sunk cost explanation. However, my cost/benefit analysis differs a bit in that my wife provided the ship as a gift to me. To essentially throw a wife's gift away would incur physical/financial/emotional/metaphysical costs beyond what I am willing to bear.