Rouge AA build for your purview.

[SSFWEl]

Thinking about TRing my pure ranger. As my main toon is a rogue and I love rogues, I put this together after discussing it with another player whom gave me the main idea.
This would be endgame, as leveling this up would be a pain, so I would go classic 2 weapon stuff and then LR at the end.

Disadvantages:
Ranged SA is short range.
Would need to switch to melee weps for the assassinate.

Advantages:
Should be very nice ranged damage.

I know monkcher with 10k stars is the FOTM for AA, but I like going off the beaten path.
Skill points would be in the classic rogue stuff so I would have traps covered of course.

So is this viable?
EDIT:
Took into account some comments.

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.12.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Neutral Good Elf Male
(18 Rogue \ 1 Ranger \ 1 Wizard) 
Hit Points: 242
Spell Points: 325 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 11
Reflex: 22
Will: 9

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(34 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             15                 18                   18
Dexterity            16                 24                   28
Constitution         13                 16                   16
Intelligence         16                 19                   19
Wisdom                9                 12                   12
Charisma              9                 12                   12

Tomes Used
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Constitution used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11




Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead


Level 3 (Wizard)
Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Mental Toughness
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 4 (Rogue)


Level 5 (Rogue)


Level 6 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 7 (Rogue)


Level 8 (Rogue)


Level 9 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot


Level 10 (Rogue)


Level 11 (Rogue)


Level 12 (Rogue)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Improved Evasion
Feat: (Selected) Manyshot


Level 13 (Rogue)


Level 14 (Rogue)


Level 15 (Rogue)
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Defensive Roll
Feat: (Selected) Precise Shot


Level 16 (Rogue)


Level 17 (Rogue)


Level 18 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
Feat: (Rogue Bonus) Skill Mastery


Level 19 (Rogue)


Level 20 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcanum I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack I
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Attack II
Enhancement: Elven Ranged Damage I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing I
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing II
Enhancement: Rogue Subtle Backstabbing III
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin I
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin II
Enhancement: Rogue Assassin III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Accuracy IV
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training III
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training IV
Enhancement: Improved Hide I
Enhancement: Improved Hide II
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently I
Enhancement: Improved Move Silently II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II

[Clayness]

Looks fairly solid, extremely similar to a build I've been toying around with. I only went for str-based instead of dex-based for more damage, and opted for elf instead of half-elf (since the two juiciest dillies, cleric and rogue, don't really work on a good UMD rogue, and elf gives bow enhancements). I'm not entirely sure what you need all that dexterity for though.

One thing I can't figure out though is how it let you take manyshot, it should have rapid shot as a prerequisite (and you only get that for free if you take 2 levels of ranger, and you only have 1), so you are missing a feat to fulfill the prerequisites for manyshot. I had a problem with that when making the build (had same level split), I couldn't fit in both improved precise shot and manyshot.

[karl_k0ch]

Consider bard instead of Wizard. This will cost you Mental Toughness, but at the expense of 1 AP (Bard Energy of Music) this offers a situational buff (tier 1 inspire courage), a nice short term buff (focusing chant), and Perform as a class skill, which allows you to have a Fascinate as a CC device. Granted, the number of songs is quite low (1-2), but there are some items (Spell Singer ToD set) which add to the number of songs, if you want to prepare for it (eg when you know you want to sing 3-4 songs on some islands floating in the plane of night which are populated by Ice Flensers, Air Mephits and Fire Elementals).
Also, the bard-related, and yet undisclosed Fatesinger epic destiny might provide some additional synergies to that.

Epic Levels will address the issue of feat-starvedness. When in doubt, I'd pick Manyshot over IPS since IPS favors a tactical play style which might involve mobs not being in point blank range and consequently not getting SA damage anyway.

Re: That build: Do you really think that kind of high int is needed?
I'd stick to Improved Evasion, Oppurtunist and Skill Mastery as Rogue Feats.

[SSFWEl]

One thing I can't figure out though is how it let you take manyshot, it should have rapid shot as a prerequisite (and you only get that for free if you take 2 levels of ranger, and you only have 1), so you are missing a feat to fulfill the prerequisites for manyshot. I had a problem with that when making the build (had same level split), I couldn't fit in both improved precise shot and manyshot.

I can't figure that out either lol. Thx for pointing that out. I made a new build from scratch, and indeed it did not let me take manyshot without rapid. So I got rid of IPS and took rapid shot earleir.

Consider bard instead of Wizard. This will cost you Mental Toughness, but at the expense of 1 AP (Bard Energy of Music) this offers a situational buff (tier 1 inspire courage), a nice short term buff (focusing chant), and Perform as a class skill, which allows you to have a Fascinate as a CC device.
Re: That build: Do you really think that kind of high int is needed?
I'd stick to Improved Evasion, Oppurtunist and Skill Mastery as Rogue Feats.

Bard does seem cool, but I simply need the feat. Maybe later I can always GR.
Don't need opportunist - it's melee only. I intend this to be a purely ranged, except when I am assassinating - hence the high int.
Hmm. Unless I forgo assassinate altogether. Then I can lower int (still need some for traps etc) and beef up str.
Thx!

[karl_k0ch]

Bard does seem cool, but I simply need the feat. Maybe later I can always GR.

Why do you need the feat? You can always qualify for AA using the SP enhancement. This also works when you want to spend your Wizard Feat for a real metamagics feat.

Don't need opportunist - it's melee only. I intend this to be a purely ranged, except when I am assassinating - hence the high int.

I never tried it - how does ranged assasination work?

Does the -10% fort only apply for to melee attacks as well?

I was actually assuming that you'd want to use some kind of melee weapon every now and then, but not meleeing at all dimishes the opportunists benefit indeed. Still, I consider (another) skill mastery to be more valuable than Slippery Mind or Defensive Roll.

[ShadowFlash]

Consider bard instead of Wizard. This will cost you Mental Toughness, but at the expense of 1 AP (Bard Energy of Music) this offers a situational buff (tier 1 inspire courage), a nice short term buff (focusing chant), and Perform as a class skill, which allows you to have a Fascinate as a CC device. Granted, the number of songs is quite low (1-2), but there are some items (Spell Singer ToD set) which add to the number of songs, if you want to prepare for it (eg when you know you want to sing 3-4 songs on some islands floating in the plane of night which are populated by Ice Flensers, Air Mephits and Fire Elementals).
Also, the bard-related, and yet undisclosed Fatesinger epic destiny might provide some additional synergies to that.

Epic Levels will address the issue of feat-starvedness. When in doubt, I'd pick Manyshot over IPS since IPS favors a tactical play style which might involve mobs not being in point blank range and consequently not getting SA damage anyway.

Re: That build: Do you really think that kind of high int is needed?
I'd stick to Improved Evasion, Oppurtunist and Skill Mastery as Rogue Feats.

1 level Bard splash gaining fascinate CC as a bonus might sound good, but...your facsinate duration is based on bard levels 24s +6s/lvl....so 30 seconds...not a heck of a lot of time to put it to good use. It still may be nice for the "Oh *explicative*" moments as a "get outa dodge" safety buffer. The sorcerer "electrician" build uses a single bard level for this purpose, but has additional synergies such as UMD and double-dipping SP.

Additionaly, a heroism pot is better in all aspects to a lvl 1 inspire courage other than +1dmg. Even factoring in focusing chant, a simple pot beats or equals anything other than +1dmg. Of course 4 minute duration on the song, and 42s duration chant does add some convienience and saves plat.

My current leveling build took 1 bard to start....and I'm working my way through 12 fighter before taking the last 7 bard, so ATM I'm essentially running a 1 bard splash. When my 2 baby-songs are gone...I use a simple bless clickie...and heroism pot if I'm in the mood. Again though, I have extra synergies unlocking UMD and early cure critical wand use. 1 level ranger already grants you cure serious wands...rogue grants UMD...and wizard would give you full arcane wand...stoneskin being the most obvious perk.

It's not that I'm against the bard 1AP vs Wizard +100SP (mental toughness) choice...just don't overstate bard as a choice to splash

ShadowFlash

[SSFWEl]

Why do you need the feat? You can always qualify for AA using the SP enhancement. This also works when you want to spend your Wizard Feat for a real metamagics feat.

I never tried it - how does ranged assasination work?

Does the -10% fort only apply for to melee attacks as well?
.

Oh did not realize that.

I am rethinking this now.
I any case, just wanted to clarify, cant assassinate ranged of course. Need to equip melee weps to assassinate.

[Rogann]

Never really thought about this. Might even be viable endgame with the right gear. After expansion it may be easier via racial pre. (slayers + vorpal hands + SA dmg + manyshot = win?)

[karl_k0ch]

Thinking a bit deeper on this. What do you do when Manyshot is on cooldown? Your choice of Melee feats (none) suggest that you will continue to use your bow. Is this really viable compared to the melee damage potential of a build along the lines of 13 rogue/6 ranger/1whatever ?

Essentially, you lose 3d6 SA damage + 5 (average from vorpal) per hit, but you gain 3 (ram's might) + 6 (against 2 favored enemies) damage per hit, and have the room for the full twf line (rapid shot, manyshot, twf and itwf for free allows 2 free feats in your build), and actually with a fighter level, you can even fit PS and IPS, if I am not mistaken.

This comparison depends how much more damage a TWF attack deals in comparison with a non-MS ranged attack, and how willing you are to use a melee option.

[unbongwah]

Is this really viable compared to the melee damage potential of a build along the lines of 13 rogue/6 ranger/1whatever ?

That's pretty much the thinking behind Triple A. Though that was before monkchers came along and redefined people's expectations for AAs.

[wax_on_wax_off]

10k Stars Rogue AA build in my sig, I'm working towards it at the moment and am more excited about it than most of the other builds (as I think this one has the greatest potential to exceed my expectations). I'm just hoping that the expansion doesn't ruin it.

Highlights:

• 10k stars to use when manyshot is on timer (so lacking melee feats isn't a big deal)
• Acrobat quarterstaff attack speed for when 10k stars and manyshot is on timer (to build Ki, only 1/4 to 1/3 use)
• Improved Precise Shot (to put that 7d6+12 SA to use)
• Super fast movement speed for awesome kiting
• Acrobat/monk AC to AC tank most content (expansion will hurt this but oh well)

The biggest issue is only having access to Ranger Dilettante instead of strength shot but being a wisdom based build this won't be a big deal as strength won't go much past 26 anyway except with unsustainable buffs (especially in water stance). At worst this loses 2-3 points of damage.

[destiny4405]

Rouges are an essential component of a balanced party's makeup, but they are way overpowdered.
I've seen one rouge mascara a whole kobold village.
In my experience, rouges paint the battlefield red.

also, go pure and wait for xpack.