Would You Put Off TR'ing For A Torc?

[Morlen]

Another thought is are you going into your final life or are you going to be TRing a few more times? If this is your final TR then just get it done! You already have your ETorc. But if you are going to be doing 2-4+ lives afterwords as well, then just bite the bullet and finish your completions now so you have your base Torc for leveling.

[themoonbreaker]

LOL. You must have a Torc before you TR so you can complain about how easy the game is and how bored you are.

Play the game. Ready to reincarnate? Do it!

Or get every possible item first so you have every advantage.

[Asmodeus451]

allow me to reiterate:


it is ALWAYS a good idea to wait till AFTER an Update (or other major change to the game) to TR, LR, or GR

[nix_vali]

Heck no! Noxious embers is much more powerful anyway for leveling-- torc is for soloing epics and raids, not zerging through 0-9 minute quests!

^This

If you are going to join some fast paced zerging TR groups (knowing you that is what ur probably going to do ) then u wont have a use for torq really .

[Sarzor]

I'd vote not to wait for the torc alone. If you're a few completions away from a few raids (ie Reaver's, shroud and DQ) then wait, but waiting for one piece of gear is just insanely frustrating. And it'll be even more frustrating when it doesn't appear.

On a semi-related note, when is the update coming out? I'm considering TRing myself, and want to figure out if I want to get it in before, or after, the update.

[Keybreaker]

Tymm, if you can Torq up SP while leveling, you're not running the quests fast enough!
For leveling, I much prefer the Noxious Embers (either the old version, or upgraded new version):



Potentially huge boost to DPS (and Death Aura/Recon) while freeing up weapon slot and significant SP savings if you are mindful enough to use the Lesser Maximize clickies (it's 20sec each click, not 4sec... something's wrong with the description text).

But it depends on your style of leveling... Flower-sniffer? Go Torq... Zerger? Go with Embers.

[Phidius]

I waited, and it took ~43 completions. Totally worth it, as I tend to take my time TRing.

I was in a group with some known TR junkies at wiz king and i forgot to use my dw clicky and got insta killed, i said im sorry i dont have deathblock and 1 of them linked me the silver flame necklace and i linked him my torc to say him that the slot is taken. Surprisingly they both started saying that torc is useless at leveling and a waste of slot...

Greater Spell Pen VI at level 11 is awesome on a caster... the ability to skip shrines completely is nice too. WizIII isn't the bomb, but having 75 spell points that doesn't disappear when I un-equip my WizVI item is pretty sweet too.

While I unequip my torc in favor of the silver flame amulet in the presence of mobs that spam Dispel Magic and Slay Living, I think it's quite a stretch to take the leap to "the torc is useless at leveling". Sounds like uber-leet-posing-trash-talk to me.

[MattiG]

First of all, Wow... I'm really impressed with and appreciative of all the feedback here. It's very balanced and thought-provoking... Thanks again!

re: embers.. yes, have original, love it, use it, always. Have it hot-keyed to "back button" on mouse with torc on "fwd button" so 20 sec clickies are basically instant any time I'm going to be nuking.

re: abbot shroud.. have that as well, and this would be a PM life (perhaps starting at lvl 12). thinking of going human this time just in case I don't have time to TR again soon. otherwise, WF for leveling, AM 1-12 or 1-18, then PM.

re: need to be moving too fast to use, and of course I hear ya Key, Nix, et. al... goal is always zergy zergy, but as PNellesen points out, the problem is that I have to solo a lot because I don't play enough to keep up with TR trains any more, and not to be elitest swine or anything, but there are only certain folks that I'd party with while leveling, so I'm left either to solo, or hope train of friends has a spot.

I am sort of leaning toward pulling the trigger on the TR, going WF again (despite my intense desire to know what abbot robes feel like at 14 with skyvault and shield mastery, concopp, and demon consort, I think the latter 2 alone + quickened recons is still tasty)

As some have suggested, I'd probably just rather spend the mnem pots if needed so that I can get another TR in before MOTU, adding another +2 spell pen. (that addresses the "don't TR before expansion crowd" I think, in the sense that I don't see +2 spell pen as being something I would NOT want to add before MOTU. I think tymn'll be fairly close to all-the-way-through epic Drow SR at that point. If I was sitting on 3 fvs lives and more than 1 wizzy PL, it'd be a different story).

Bottom line, I see this as "is the cost of a few mnem pots here and there worth another +2 spell pen before MOTU?" Answer is probably yes, unless there's a +4 INT tome on my 20th ToD list. With only 8 completions needed on DQ and like 7 on ToD, I may wait and just farm the **** out of tokens and make sure all my gearz are laid out according to Ying's laws of TR'ing efficiency.

Whatever the case, this feedback has been fantastic, and I really appreciate it! Many great thoughts on both sides of the question. Thanks!

[Cardoor]

Which option would be more fun for you? I like to open presents so it is fun for me to have a shiny new torc as long as I am having fun along the way to getting it...

[Cauthey]

Wait to TR. Wait for your new, mundane-style Torc.

Especially if you are on a blue-bar life right now. Cause if your next life ISN'T blue-bar, you will be hassled heavily if you get one to fall in your name, and you end up looting it.

Torc is worth the wait.

[porq]

You have the epic torc, I don't see why you would need the base item for TRing. Like others have said, torcing isn't really needed for xp zerging. It's a nice item to have on hand, but isn't really necessary if you have the epic version waiting in your bank for when you reach 20 again.

sp clickies and the occasional non-major sp pot are enough for leveling

Personally I wouldn't wait, but you may as well aim for a 20th list if you're close.

[Carpone]

Quick poll really... like a nub, I epic'd my torc and kinda sorta wanted another base before TR'ing Tymn again.

I'm starting to think waiting is dumb. TR'ing in en vogue these days and mostly for good reason IMO, and Tymn is under-TR'd. Have concop, RoSS, 1 pair of viles, archivists, talisman, VPIS, etc... so I'm kinda sorta thinkin' maybe it won't be as annoying as I fear, but I've only ever TR'd a blue bar with a Torc before.

a quick flame-retardant caveat: of course I realize that no one NEEDS a torc to TR and that with Bravery, +20 learning, +30 pots I don't mind buying and SP pots I don't mind buying/using judiciously, that 3rd+ life TR's are much less annoying than they used to be, but play time is limited, and I'm just interested in some feedback from folks that have an opinion on the extent to which their torcs (or absence thereof) better allow their precious time to be leveraged in game.

I've delayed TRing to get 20th completions before. However I wouldn't wait to get a Torc before TRing. Here's why:

• If you've got a Noxious Embers, you'll use that way more often while leveling than a Torc.

• Shield blocking to "Torc up" mana is a really slow process -- not one you need to use for heroic content. Even if you don't shield block, at best you'll get a couple of procs a quest as you zerg through.

• I wear a Silver Flame necklace more often than not. There are plenty of quests where mobs cast Slay Living, Phasntasmal Killer or Destruction (in additional to Dispel Magic). My Greensteel SP item is my goggle slot, so swapping out to use Visor of the Flesh Render for Death Ward is suboptimal.

I have a Torc on both of my casters, and I never use it while leveling.

[tygara]

Lol, the Torc, such a funny thing of a seriously over rated item imo
I have done in total multiple caster lifes and caster TRs, and we are speaking definately over 20 lifes in total, going from wizard, sorc, cleric, fvs, bard and artificer. Never even once did I have the torc equiped while leveling. Its in my opinion a useless waste of an item in a rather valuable slot which while leveling is an item that absolutely has no use. Even at level 20, I dont really see any reason to have this item always equiped, its an item that provides a nice amount of extra spell points, but fact is that you have to get hit enough to really benefit from it. Being a caster, you normally shouldnt get hit too much in the first place anyway.

Carpone has btw pointed out which I think is the ultimate TR item for the neckslot to use. The Noxious Embers is the way to go. Once ya use that thing and you see what it does in a TR, you will NEVER go without it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The other necklace which is far more important is obviously the Silver Flame Pendant. When I TR into caster lifeforms, it one or the other.

All I can see that the torc is good for is for in a situation where you have a lot of archers pelting there 1-3 dmg arrows at you (thinking of for example orthons in Sins or offcourse Weapon Shipment) In 99% of the content of ddo, its a total waste of an item, I feel

Does this mean that I feel that a caster doesnt need it, absolutely not, I think every caster needs one and should have one. But I still feel that people use it way too much and could have potentionally a way better item slotten then the torc in most quests in the game. To hold off from TRing is your personal choise. I personally dont hold off at all from TRing for any item in the game, except if I have like already somewhere 17-18 completions. If I still need like 5+ completions, I will absolutely not hold off from TRing, ill just go and press that button.

All in short, its your choise, just dont fixate yourself an item on itself that you think is a must have pice of gear to TR. If you wanne TR, go for it, If you want the item, go for it. Items come and go anyway in this game and even without specific items, you can still easy go without it anyway as there are so many other possibilities of gear choises in the game (although the torc is a unique item obviously)

[PNellesen]

Its in my opinion a useless waste of an item in a rather valuable slot which while leveling is an item that absolutely has no use. Even at level 20, I dont really see any reason to have this item always equiped, its an item that provides a nice amount of extra spell points, but fact is that you have to get hit enough to really benefit from it. Being a caster, you normally shouldnt get hit too much in the first place anyway.

Carpone has btw pointed out which I think is the ultimate TR item for the neckslot to use. The Noxious Embers is the way to go. Once ya use that thing and you see what it does in a TR, you will NEVER go without it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The other necklace which is far more important is obviously the Silver Flame Pendant. When I TR into caster lifeforms, it one or the other.

"Useless" is a little strong, I think, but it does depend on class/build. My Horc Battle-Cleric finds it quite useful for soloing - I tend to take it slow, and while Blade Barrier is his primary means of dishing out the pain, that doesn't work for all fights or mobs, and starting a big fight with 1/2 SP and finishing it almost full is pretty nice - the only thing you need a shrine for is to recharge your clickies

That said, I HAVE found that it's usefulness is limited when in a group, and will usually swap it out for the Silver Flame Pendant or some other necklace instead (don't have Noxious Embers yet, will have to try for that). Bottom line, though, is that all my characters will run at least 20 ADQs in the hopes of getting one, just to have it in the bank if I ever want to TR them into some kind of caster. (And if it drops for them in the chest, they'll be looting it, regardless of what their current class is...)

[Kokanee]

I must have to agree that torc isn't as useful for TR as it is for long quests/raids, but its very nice to have if you can wait for only 9 completions.

I end up having silver flame trinket equipped 90% of the time when going fleshy or noxious as some mentioned.

Anyway, if you have only 9 completions I would wait just because your grind for torc its more than half way done (maybe faster if you get a lucky pull/roll).

[brickwall]

Would not wait for anything the time frame is so small anymore to get back to the right level to run anything theirs always next life.

[Kokanee]

Would not wait for anything the time frame is so small anymore to get back to the right level to run anything theirs always next life.

This, if you don't plan on multi back to back tr's.