Crystal Cove Improvements

[varusso]

We go through this every time CC opens, and this seems to fall mostly on deaf ears, but here goes anyway:


* Extend this new lockout timer to 18 minutes. DISCUSSED HERE.

* Change the "wilderness" area to a private instance. Keep the boat, wharf, and tavern as a common area/public instance with NO mobs.
** Removes the stupid mechanic where a lvl 5 can get stomped by AOEs from lvl 20+ mobs just because they were standing next to a high lvl player and didnt know it.
** Eliminates all forms of kill-stealing.
** Stops the griefing where some dink thinks its cute to drag aggro onto the boat to get ppl killed while they are puttering around in the box.

* Add a bank to the Cove. This should be self-explanatory.

* Add an Airship Port to the Cove (only accessible during the event). I realize its probably just a pipe dream and not gonna happen, but...

* Give us a use for Gold Coins. I always have a ridiculous amount of gold compared to copper and silver -- and end up just destroying it. And no, I dont mean just add gold cost onto existing items.
** Allow us to buy Requisition Forms for 10K gold each. I realize you want people to buy them from the store when they run out, but i am NEVER going to buy one, and I have yet to run into a player who is willing to do so.
** Bundle of Torches: 5K, Exclusive, Only usable inside the quest, grants 5 torches, drops upon exit (the torches, not the bundle). This is a potential for up to 30 torches from the entire party, which is more than enough to acquire in this manner. Also, Healing torches could be purchased in the same way, 1K each, limit one per person.
** Distilled Pirate's Port: 10K, Exclusive, Usable only in the quest, gives 5 Pirate's Ports, BTC, drops upon exit (the 5 ports, not the distilled version). Again, I will never buy this in the store, and have yet to meet the person who does.
** Various buffs for the Kobolds These special items would be BTC, exclusive, usable only in the quest, cost 5-10K each, and last for the duration of the quest. When used, they would have "global" effects on all kobolds in the instance. They could include things such as:
*** More HP
*** More AC
*** Faster run speed
*** 10% blur effect
*** Small regen (1 pt per 30 secs or so, might allow to stack up to 3 times)
*** +1 Barrel to all kobolds (not stackable with other barrel buffs, but stacks with the reqs and normal barrels, up to the max)
*** Elemental resistance: 5 (not stackable with any other buffs, overridden by "real" buffs)

* Reward players who cap early. Standing around doing nothing but beating on hobbo's for 7+ minutes is getting very old. If my group manages to get quota *and* 200 crystals early, we should get some benefit from it. I realize it is set up to limit the number of crystals attainable in a given amount of time, but really -- one of the biggest complaints I hear (constantly) about CC is the fact you cant get anything better for doing a great job. Add some optionals: Complete within 5/10/15 minutes, get an additional 15/10/5% bonus to XP and shards -- only one bonus (the highest) applies per run.

* Put the named mobs on an optionals list, so you can see when they have spawned and been killed. When running multiple times, all the runs tend to blur together -- not to mention it is often easy to miss when you are in the middle of a pitched battle. Perhaps even give some XP for their deaths as well -- proportionate to the quest of course, say 1-5% of the base XP.

* Give some optional bonus goodies (lets say 5% XP/shards) for keeping all kobolds alive. Perhaps then we wont just say "screw those 'bolds" and go hide behind the shrines when we cap in 10 mins. A rezzed kobold does not count as meeting the requirement -- if a single kobold dies, you dont get he bonus, period.

* Pop-up warning (similar to explorer areas) that tells you someone over the level of the quest has entered the zone. I cant tell you how many times the party leader has done this, either through ignorance or lack of common courtesy, and no one realized it until the shards were rewarded -- with a penalty. We shouldnt have to vet every player that joins the LFM. It would also serve to "educate" the PLs who just dont know any better. (This would actually be a nice feature for ALL quests, but I will settle for CC for now).

I am one of the die-hard fans of the Cove, but even I am getting tired of some of the stuff in there. I would like to see some improvements/changes to the quest to make it more appealing -- not only to me, but to others as well. many of the above suggestions are taken from actual groups I have been in over the course of the event.

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EDIT: Additional suggestions:

* Give us the ability to turn in MORE THAN ONE FREAKING MAP PIECE AT A TIME. Aside from the tedious, BORING spam-clicking (which is a problem with ALL of the barter interfaces), I have osteoarthritis, and there are days where playing DDO is quite painful -- literally. Having to click that stupid box 400+ times only makes it worse. The end result is that I simply dont go hunt the maps, which means the doors open slower. This is an extremely common complaint among all players I have talked to. Many end up not hunting maps, because they dont want to sit there clicking the button over and over. Let us turn them in in lots of 20, 50, 100. If this ends up with too many being turned in at the same time as the doors are about to open, let them spill over into the next batch.

[ssgcmwatson]

Lots of good ideas +1

[Dawnsfire]

Here is to hoping! /agree

[arminius]

I am in a grumpy mood and greedily opened this thread hoping to have something juicy to disagree with.

Can't.

[Ancient]

I like most of these suggestions... I would add that map piece turn in's should get a dragonshard, or a chance at a dragonshard (If they need to balance it so map hunting is better than the cove itself).

[rayworks]

/signed

[Kindrson]

as a use for gold doubloons how about a coin changer... break them down to 5 silver and/or 10 copper...or revalue at a much reduced rate the dowsing rods and make them vendorable again just at not such an explioty price

[varusso]

as a use for gold doubloons how about a coin changer... break them down to 5 silver and/or 10 copper...

I thought about that, but frankly, I dont want yet another set of clicks and conversions. We get plenty of coins overall, especially if we convert gems. I would rather just have some cool ways to spend the gold directly, rather than spam-click it into other coins to then spend on other things..

or revalue at a much reduced rate the dowsing rods and make them vendorable again just at not such an explioty price

This has been suggested before, and it wont really work. If the value of the rods are too low, they arent worth it as a means of using up the gold coins. If the value is too high, they will be exploited. Basically, if you make the rods worth sinking gold coins into for cash, they will be exploitable -- it will just take longer than the ridiculously broken prices they were originally. And they have too few charges to really be worth stockpiling for actual use.

[varusso]

Updated OP to add more suggestions.

[Esserbe]

x5, x10, x25 Map/Gem-to-doubloon turn-in options. Separate box, like the hat box is to the items?

Raise crystal cap to x/10 000 like in the challenges; OR allow good groups who finish early, to be booted out and rewarded early.

[Karbofos]

Why stick to three non-changeable types of coins? Seems like if dubloons were just one type (gold, as they should be), nothing will change (even a bit) in event's general mechanics. So what's the point?

Besides, the idea of "copper dubloon" is just plain oxymoronic! Sort of "toilet-paper armor", "recycled cardboard sword" or "cold fire shield"... oops...

"Yarr, Jack Sparrow, we have here a chest full of gold dubloons, still we need a couple of copper ones... you know, prophecy can't go without coppers... and fire water."

[EbbOnFire]

Excellent ideas.

The only one I'd take issue with is the private instancing of the wilderness. I for one like the chaos that comes from having characters of wildly different levels all running around in the same place. As a low level character I think it's fun to sneak around while the big boys do their stuff and try to pick off bugbears and drow. I'll admit it would probably get tiresome after a while, but it does give the Cove event a very distinctive feel (well, except for Mabar).

I think the two worst things about the Cove are two that you mentioned: The asinine one-at-a-time map piece turn-in, which ought to be a simple interface change. Use the pop-up box that's used for multiple purchasing. Or have different entries for 20 at a time, or 100 at a time.

The second is the dead time that results at the end of a successful run. I understand the reasoning - you don't want people to do 3, 4 or 5 runs during one opening, and I guess it's hard to block that in any other way. But instead of just giving a reward and still waiting around for minutes, I'd suggest introducing something fun to do during that dead time. You can already hunt mobs -- how about adding a few more unique monsters that pop up only when the work is done? Or a Devil's Assault type invasion. Break down a wall in the south chamber and have duergar tunnel through in waves. Or a treasure hunt -- random supply chests popping up throughout the maze, with a race among the players to find them. Just something to relieve the monotony after you've exhausted the entertainment potential of putting the torches into nifty configurations.

[BruceTheHoon]

I support all of these ideas except the timer removal. Extend it - yes, but removal - no. Since there is no late entry penalty here, this is a crude equivalent to fend off the most shameless leeches.

One other change I would make is also, that keeping kobolds alive does not provide a bonus, but leaving them dead provides a penalty ( == kobold union funeral service expenses).

[MRMechMan]

Less clicking.


Having 2000 emeralds and diamonds and wanting to convert that into air elemental gems is ~44 minutes of clicking. Constantly. Without a break. Once. A. Second.

[varusso]

Excellent ideas.

The only one I'd take issue with is the private instancing of the wilderness. I for one like the chaos that comes from having characters of wildly different levels all running around in the same place. As a low level character I think it's fun to sneak around while the big boys do their stuff and try to pick off bugbears and drow. I'll admit it would probably get tiresome after a while, but it does give the Cove event a very distinctive feel (well, except for Mabar).

You can still have that. The instances would still be raid instances, and you can put whatever levels you want in the group. The difference is you would not be competing with ppl NOT in your group over the same kills. Or you can do what most ppl actually want to do, and have ppl all your lvl range in the same instance. The majority of players do NOT run in the wilderness area, because of the way it works. They hunt just enough to get the coins for a compass (or get lucky and snag a compass as a drop), then run cove for gems, get more coins, buy grogs, and go farm quests instead. The wilderness area is largely wasted on most players after the first couple of runs. You dont get treasure maps (the ones for chests) this way, but -- meh.

Also, the instanced dungeon is one of the biggest benefits of the way DDO is designed. Anyone who has played in non-instanced games, where everyone shares the same zone, knows how quickly it leads to griefing. Anyone who has been standing on the boat while some ****** tries to drag the mobs onto it has had a small sampling of how bad it can get.

I support all of these ideas except the timer removal. Extend it - yes, but removal - no. Since there is no late entry penalty here, this is a crude equivalent to fend off the most shameless leeches.

One other change I would make is also, that keeping kobolds alive does not provide a bonus, but leaving them dead provides a penalty ( == kobold union funeral service expenses).

Thats why the proposal is to extend the timer to 18 mins, not remove it. It also retains the benefit of still nixing the exploit mentioned in the linked thread.

I dont like the idea of a penalty. Sometimes kobolds die, and theres just nothing you can do about it. Many players would object to the mechanic being forced on them (myself included). Make it a bonus, and its optional instead of mandatory; less negative impact, like the bonuses in regular quests. (And yes I know some people treat those as mandatory as well, but thats their choice of playstyle, not game mechanics).

[danotmano1998]

/Signed on every point in the OP above.

Especially the completing early thing. Ideas:

1. Award some sort of reward for time left after completion? 1 min = X% ingredients extra?
...or...
2. If the quest is completed, and there's time left, just complete the quest. End the timer, reward the goods, and kick everyone out, just like if you had waited it out. Why everyone has to go stand around at the shrine and /afk for several minutes is beyond me.

Oh, and /Signed like a madman on turning in more than one map piece at a time.

How about just changing that button to "Turn in ALL map pieces" in one click?

[Cauthey]

While the OP does make some very good suggestions, I still must disagree with much of the easy button/convenience related suggestions.

The Crystal Cove event, on the whole, is terrific. I would be nervous if Turbine were influenced to tweak the event any further.

Extend this new lockout timer to 18 minutes: No. The lockout timer was added deliberately, and is working as intended. Plus, it is not so terrible that you cannot plan for it and get all of your party into the instance as long as care is taken and you communicate properly.

On the request for a bank: No bank. Smuggler's Rest is a pirate retreat. There is not likely going to be anyone from House Kundarak willing to set up shop here. I understand that it is convenient for those that are packing alts with twink gear and Air Elemental Gems. But, convenience is not really the goal or focus for this event. *shrug* Sorry.

On the request for an airship spire: No airship spire. Again, Smuggler's Rest is not going to be the thoroughfare of activity, trade, and transport that the Stormreach Marketplace is. Heck, Euphonia won't even take you on a boat ride without a bunch of pieces of map. Just pop your House P clickie, and make a run for it like everyone else. Or, make use of Guildship Becons that are available in the DDO Store if you don't want to run.

On the kobold buffs: Bring an arcane. The kobolds are targettable, and do benefit from friendly buffs.

On Requisition Forms: They are fine the way they are. I'm a minimalist anyway, and can easily clear the total 300 dragonshards with no need of torch, worker, or barrel requistions (I only care about teleporter requisitions cause one of these saves me 5 dragonshards). Even if you require these, they ARE available for your convenience through the DDO Store. There's nothing wrong with Turbine wanting to make a little bit of scratch off of their labors.

Give us a use for Gold Coins: Yes. This would not be a bad thing, but would need to be balanced carefully. Requisitions for 8000 gold doubloons? I certainly wouldn't mind this terribly.

Reward players who cap early: Maybe. I see kobolds hauling in piles of purples after the quota is complete, dodging mobs and running for their lives now that their primary job is done and their honor guard is gone. I would be okay with this, so long as, once again, it would be balanced carefully.

Improve barter box UI for multiple maps/gems turn in and bulk purchases: A resounding YES. This would be a welcome tweak.

[FranOhmsford]

I like all the OPs suggestions:

I do feel however that 18 mins is a bit too much - 12 mins should suffice here.

I'd also ask for a Mail Box to be put in with the Bank and Airship Portal.

Further Suggestions:

Bring Cove out for 72 Hrs Once per month - Open throughout with no map piece requirement once limit to open first time is hit.

Add Smuggler's Rest to 3 Barrel Cove year round as an open area {PvPers may enjoy this} with level limits of 1-4, 5-8, 9-12 etc. per instance.

Add Map Pieces and Copper and Silver Doubloons to 3 Barrel Cove {Very low drop rate} and these may catch up with all those extra Golds.

Add a ranged weapon to Barter Box.

Fix the descriptions on Cunning and Stalwart Trinkets so newbies realise these actually give 50sps and 10 hps rather than 30 and 5.

And for goodness sake make all spells usable in the Rest {and Delera's Graveyard during Mabar} Why can't I cast Blade Barrier or Firewall?

[FranOhmsford]

On the request for a bank: No bank. Smuggler's Rest is a pirate retreat. There is not likely going to be anyone from House Kundarak willing to set up shop here. I understand that it is convenient for those that are packing alts with twink gear and Air Elemental Gems. But, convenience is not really the goal or focus for this event. *shrug* Sorry.

On the request for an airship spire: No airship spire. Again, Smuggler's Rest is not going to be the thoroughfare of activity, trade, and transport that the Stormreach Marketplace is. Heck, Euphonia won't even take you on a boat ride without a bunch of pieces of map. Just pop your House P clickie, and make a run for it like everyone else. Or, make use of Guildship Becons that are available in the DDO Store if you don't want to run.

We have House K Banks in a number of places in game already where they don't really make sense - Gianthold for example.
Also Pirates have to store their ill gotten gains somewhere and where better than in the bank.

An Airship Spire is a convenience nothing more - Give us something like Reaver's where we have to parachute in if a spire seems wrong.

[Falco_Easts]

Automatically remove LFM's after the instance is locked.
Be unable to set a LFM from a locked instance.
(I see no need to change the lockout timer)

Allow multiple turn ins. Last day of CC and I almost got RSI converting left over gems for doubloons to turn into Air Ele's.

Make the outdoor instances level set. i.e instances 1-3 are for levels 1-5.

/signed for the idea of dragonshards given for map turn ins.