Paladin HP Tank

[Fishcatch22]

Hey, all. After leveling an AC tank Paladin to cap, I've become very frustrated with grinding gear. In light of this fact, I've decided it'd be best to TR him into a Paladin that focuses on HP rather than AC. I thought about Barbarian, but the class just doesn't fit my style; Paladin is the only real fighting class that appeals to me. Although I am fairly experienced and can figure out base stats easily on my own, I still have some questions, the main ones being:

What feats should I take? And more specifically, do I need multiple toughnesses? I can figure out basics like THF chain and regular toughness pretty easily.

Should I still do DoS (The threat stance will still be beneficial), or switch to KotC?

Race choices. I was thinking of doing Helf with Barb dilly for access to healing amp+DR, as I know Angelskin becomes fairly useless towards endgame as its DR is frequently bypassed.

[voxson5]

Why not just have the best of both worlds

You will still need gear for hp, but obviously it's not as much of a grind as ac gear.

Do a forum search for "splatsplat", the build post has all the information you will need.

[noinfo]

Hey, all. After leveling an AC tank Paladin to cap, I've become very frustrated with grinding gear. In light of this fact, I've decided it'd be best to TR him into a Paladin that focuses on HP rather than AC. I thought about Barbarian, but the class just doesn't fit my style; Paladin is the only real fighting class that appeals to me. Although I am fairly experienced and can figure out base stats easily on my own, I still have some questions, the main ones being:

What feats should I take? And more specifically, do I need multiple toughnesses? I can figure out basics like THF chain and regular toughness pretty easily.

Should I still do DoS (The threat stance will still be beneficial), or switch to KotC?

Race choices. I was thinking of doing Helf with Barb dilly for access to healing amp+DR, as I know Angelskin becomes fairly useless towards endgame as its DR is frequently bypassed.

If you want to tank rather than dps vs very specific mob types then DOS is really the only viable option.
KoTC do not have the feats to burn to get the hp high enough really and vs non evil outsiders you are likely to have better dps with stance in DOS anyway.

DOS, and shield masterys for when you are in a tankiing situation are the next best thing to AC in content that matters, just make sure you have a heap of healing amp.

[Fishcatch22]

Splatsplat seems like more of an AC build; as I said, I want to focus on HP.

As I understand, Shield Mastery has changed, making it viable. Does that mean I'll be using a shield, even as an HP Tank? I haven't played DDO for a year, so I'm a bit behind on the changes. Also, my toughness question still stands.

So due to the importance of healing amp, does that mean Monk dilly/going human is better than doing Barb dilly?

[noinfo]

Splatsplat seems like more of an AC build; as I said, I want to focus on HP.

As I understand, Shield Mastery has changed, making it viable. Does that mean I'll be using a shield, even as an HP Tank? I haven't played DDO for a year, so I'm a bit behind on the changes. Also, my toughness question still stands.

So due to the importance of healing amp, does that mean Monk dilly/going human is better than doing Barb dilly?

The goal of any tank is to focus agro on yourself and minimise incoming damage. As DOS your hate gen is basically best in game and you get boost for using a shield.

I am not sure how people fit all the feats into a pure pally so I went 18/2 dos/fighter

Tower Shield + shield mastery and imp shield mastery if you can fit it in.
All 2 handed feats if you can fit in BSword then do it as your 1 handed damage will benefit from the 2 handed feats.

Shield mastery gives a % damage reduction based on shield type. Imp sheild mastery gives +5% on top of it. So even as a HP tank yes that makes a huge difference. Also good if you can take improved sheild bash and max out your intim. Times when you can turtle up and bash away for extra DR is nice.

[noinfo]

So due to the importance of healing amp, does that mean Monk dilly/going human is better than doing Barb dilly?

Either human or helf are good choices, human has 1 extra feat so that helps alot and helf with monk dilly slightly more amp.

I would not go barb for DR but instead if you don't already have one grind out a set of cav plate level 20 to tier 3 (one of the best armours in game particulary for this type of tank) even though you are not after AC you will benefit from sup false life + 5 DR + the lifeshielding proc and not waste your dilly on barb.

[noinfo]

Also, my toughness question still stands.

Unless you are really going to splash heavily you are not going to be able to fit in too many toughnesses on a Pally.

You only have 7 feats for a pure pally 8 if human or 9/10 for a 2 fighter splash

3 2 handed feats
1 toughness
1 imp crit
1 pa

and up to 3 for shield master/imp shield mastery/bash

and maybe BSword

[Fishcatch22]

The goal of any tank is to focus agro on yourself and minimise incoming damage. As DOS your hate gen is basically best in game and you get boost for using a shield.

I am not sure how people fit all the feats into a pure pally so I went 18/2 dos/fighter

Tower Shield + shield mastery and imp shield mastery if you can fit it in.
All 2 handed feats if you can fit in BSword then do it as your 1 handed damage will benefit from the 2 handed feats.

Shield mastery gives a % damage reduction based on shield type. Imp sheild mastery gives +5% on top of it. So even as a HP tank yes that makes a huge difference. Also good if you can take improved sheild bash and max out your intim. Times when you can turtle up and bash away for extra DR is nice.

I see... seems like dwarf might be an option then; save the feat for Bswords and just use Daxes.

So feat setup would go THF feats, IC:S, toughness, PA, Shield mastery, maybe Imp shield mastery... maybe try to fit in Tower shield prof if I decide to stay pure. I'd prefer to stay pure pally, but I can understand the advantages of splashing fighter. I'd be maxing intim either way.

[noinfo]

I see... seems like dwarf might be an option then; save the feat for Bswords and just use Daxes.

So feat setup would go THF feats, IC:S, toughness, PA, Shield mastery, maybe Imp shield mastery... maybe try to fit in Tower shield prof if I decide to stay pure. I'd prefer to stay pure pally, but I can understand the advantages of splashing fighter. I'd be maxing intim either way.

Depends on your preference, Dwarf will have better saves (not always an issue) but I would go human over it and while dwarfs get the axe free, humans have the extra feat. Dwarfs have higher hp, humans better healing amp.

The other advantage to human is the damage boost part of HV. You can combine it with haste boost to grab agro faster at the start.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Human for healing amp and Epic Chimera's Fang.

You're totally doing it in reverse order, I'd generally suggest to someone starting a tank to do first life as a DR/amp tank and to give you time to get AC gear together and then TR into an AC tank.

Once you're level 20 there isn't much to do besides having fun raiding/questing putting gear together, you may as well stick with it, you can still DR/hamp tank as an AC build but it doesn't work the other way.

Stick with the AC thing, post your current build and what direction you want to head in. Cove Armour/Shield is a decent place to start with AC, plenty of other stuff available.

[Fishcatch22]

Human for healing amp and Epic Chimera's Fang.

You're totally doing it in reverse order, I'd generally suggest to someone starting a tank to do first life as a DR/amp tank and to give you time to get AC gear together and then TR into an AC tank.

Once you're level 20 there isn't much to do besides having fun raiding/questing putting gear together, you may as well stick with it, you can still DR/hamp tank as an AC build but it doesn't work the other way.

Stick with the AC thing, post your current build and what direction you want to head in. Cove Armour/Shield is a decent place to start with AC, plenty of other stuff available.

I haven't played my pally for a year, so I have no idea honestly. I think he's in fully specc'd DT armor with assorted randomly generated loot, Chaosgarde and chattering ring. IIRC I was working on DoS set and That really good tower shiled+ Bracers combo who's name escapes me. He's on my old server Cannith, so if I wanted to TR him I'd have to move him to Orien.

Just note I don't stay for endgame long. I really hate gear grind; I really doubt I'd ever bother grinding for ECF or epic anything really.

[noinfo]

I haven't played my pally for a year, so I have no idea honestly. I think he's in fully specc'd DT armor with assorted randomly generated loot, Chaosgarde and chattering ring. IIRC I was working on DoS set and That really good tower shiled+ Bracers combo who's name escapes me. He's on my old server Cannith, so if I wanted to TR him I'd have to move him to Orien.

Just note I don't stay for endgame long. I really hate gear grind; I really doubt I'd ever bother grinding for ECF or epic anything really.

Getting an Epic Fang is easier than fitting it into a pally build TBH

[voxson5]

Splatsplat seems like more of an AC build; as I said, I want to focus on hp

She gets close to 900 hp while retaining dps; far more dps than using a shield.

The build even breaks down a full dps gear setup for you.

[noinfo]

She gets close to 900 hp while retaining dps; far more dps than using a shield.

The build even breaks down a full dps gear setup for you.

The build does do reasonable damage but its tanking capacity comes from high Ac and without that it has very limited damage mitigation.

And Splat is not short on gear

[voxson5]

Haha, that's true.

[Fishcatch22]

Yeah, as I said, I'll be going for a low-end gear build that isn't focused on endgame; I'm a dedicated TRer and like the experience from 1-20. I may do some endgame, but I probabyl won;t be doing much in the way of epics or endgame raids.

I'm thinking of a dwarf right now; either pure pally with Toughness>SM>Tower shield Prof>PA>IC:S>Extend>THF, or Pally/fighter 18/2 split with the same (excluding tower shield prof obviously) plus the rest of the THF series+Imp shield mastery.

Also, if I ever did bother to putter around at endgame, what are the power items these days for a tank spec of this type?

[noinfo]

Yeah, as I said, I'll be going for a low-end gear build that isn't focused on endgame; I'm a dedicated TRer and like the experience from 1-20. I may do some endgame, but I probabyl won;t be doing much in the way of epics or endgame raids.

I'm thinking of a dwarf right now; either pure pally with Toughness>SM>Tower shield Prof>PA>IC:S>Extend>THF, or Pally/fighter 18/2 split with the same (excluding tower shield prof obviously) plus the rest of the THF series+Imp shield mastery.

Also, if I ever did bother to putter around at endgame, what are the power items these days for a tank spec of this type?

Strangely enough there is a lot of overlap with an AC version.

Epic Claw Set-> for the damage but the heal amp and intim of the gloves is the key.
Epic Abashai set for extra damage and slots (though you can probably live without)
Epic Brawnspirit for +20 intim.
Cav plate fully upgraded for the DR sup false life and lifehield proc, before that DT with heal amp
TOD ring with Healing Amp
There are a number of decent shields out there, crafted ones are very nice but require crafting levels ie lifesheilding or fire/elec absorb. The hound shield is good too as is the new epic sheild for the extra bonus resists.
Weapons you have a variety of choices though DAxes does mean mostly crafted rather than epic.
Elemental GA of fire is nice for DPS mode and is easy to get.

Just a note, up to Gianthold etc AC can be managed without a massive amount of work and before that its even easier so I would not drop AC till around that time.

[Fishcatch22]

Strangely enough there is a lot of overlap with an AC version.

Epic Claw Set-> for the damage but the heal amp and intim of the gloves is the key.
Epic Abashai set for extra damage and slots (though you can probably live without)
Epic Brawnspirit for +20 intim.
Cav plate fully upgraded for the DR sup false life and lifehield proc, before that DT with heal amp
TOD ring with Healing Amp
There are a number of decent shields out there, crafted ones are very nice but require crafting levels ie lifesheilding or fire/elec absorb. The hound shield is good too as is the new epic sheild for the extra bonus resists.
Weapons you have a variety of choices though DAxes does mean mostly crafted rather than epic.
Elemental GA of fire is nice for DPS mode and is easy to get.

Just a note, up to Gianthold etc AC can be managed without a massive amount of work and before that its even easier so I would not drop AC till around that time.

Ah, so its only about half the same- I knew about GotC and Abashai.

So GS Isn't all that anymore due to crafting?

[noinfo]

Ah, so its only about half the same- I knew about GotC and Abashai.

So GS Isn't all that anymore due to crafting?

GS is still good for weapons and for your build hp item will always be good but TBH I often have trouble fiting any GS on end game toons now but they are still very good for leveling anyway and a L2 weapon is as good as any. I would not make a min 2 weapon unless you were a specialist AC tank and needed to slot insight onto a tanking weapon.

Crafting allows to to create custom gear for all levels. When you can craft a +1 Mithril FP of invulnerablitliy with master craft at level 1, making an AC based toon for leveling is not particulary hard.

Also take a look at the gear from cannith challenges. Its not hard to get and gives some good damage. For your dwarf the level 16 or 20 elemental great axe would be a very nice item.