Rogue hirelings can't even find traps

[Chette]

Just spent TP on a level 9 rogue hireling so I could run Xorian Cypher on elite and not die in the traps. GHed him and everything, and he can't find the traps.

This is disgusting. People buy rogue hirelings for one reason alone, to find traps.

I kind of want my 40 tp back.

[DrunkenBuddha]

This is probably the single greatest problem with hirelings that I have - a failure to participate in what most players would say is a primary purpose to their class. Divines that fail to heal and rogues that cannot find, well, anything. I think manually making my divine hireling heal themselves, whilst they complain that they are in dire need of assistance, makes me puke a little in my mouth each and every time. By the end of any given quest I use a hireling in, I surely doth overfloweth with induced vomit.

But rogues are the worst. Especially since you have to pay TP to get them (which I still don't really understand). They must dump intelligence, constitution, dexterity and strength. But for some reason they don't have sufficient wisdom to hit runes, so I gotta assume they are really charismatic. I could perhaps understand requiring TP if they were particularly overpowered, but my 7 year old has a better shot at disabling or even finding traps. If he's watching me play, he points the box locations out and when the hireling can't find it, we both wail and gnash our teeth in frustration in grotesque harmony. Maybe its Turbine's way of saying that you don't need to disable traps to succeed in a given quest? Well, its working.

[redspecter23]

As mentioned above, this is a massive problem with hirelings in general, but becomes much more clear on classes such as rogues or healers. The hirelings were designed with nearly no gear, no metamagics, no enhancements, etc. Simply put, they are barely qualified to be in a normal at level quest, even if they could get the AI working. They have no business in anything higher than normal unless you take special precautions to keep them protected at all times. In essence, you're babysitting them so they can perform the role you brought them in for.

I'd love it if I could just let my hire tag along with me and fight things in the thick of the fight, but after trying it once, then having a good laugh, you realize hirelings as currently implemented serve very specific roles most times (spot heals and pulling levers are all that really come to mind). I think the rogue probably could have disabled the traps if you were in a level 5 dungeon... on normal... maybe. They just aren't designed to be useful in at level content and that's something I'd like to see changed.

[Krelar]

heck a quick fix at least would be to update the description with the highest level/difficulty of quest the rogue hireling can reliably find/disable traps on.

"This hireling can find traps in up to level 8 quests on NORMAL, level 7 quests on HARD or level 5 quests on ELITE"

[Impaqt]

Xorian Cypher is L10 on elite isnt it?

Assuming Hirelings are of "Average" equipment and ability, I wouldnt expect a Hireling rogue under 10 to be able to spot, search or disable L10 Traps.

heck, I might go L12....

The Traps are annoying for sure, but if you cant get around them, perhaps your not up to elite.

[DrunkenBuddha]

In the interests of fairness, there are some hirelings that far exceed expectations - so long as you temper your expectations by accepting that they will still not perform to "your" intended purpose. Of whom do I speak? Why its Larafay Do'rett. This nigh suicidal lv 15 drow favored soul will do her best to lead the kill count. Regardless of whether she is set to defensive or offensive, she will use her entire blue bar to cometfall and then destruct every single mob she encounters, be they kobold or orthon, often blowing her entire load in the first room. If you expect her to heal you, then you hired the wrong divine. The lvl 19 drow favored soul will sometimes act in a similar manner, but she also seems to heal you from time to time, almost out of pity.

[Jaid314]

In the interests of fairness, there are some hirelings that far exceed expectations - so long as you temper your expectations by accepting that they will still not perform to "your" intended purpose. Of whom do I speak? Why its Larafay Do'rett. This nigh suicidal lv 15 drow favored soul will do her best to lead the kill count. Regardless of whether she is set to defensive or offensive, she will use her entire blue bar to cometfall and then destruct every single mob she encounters, be they kobold or orthon, often blowing her entire load in the first room. If you expect her to heal you, then you hired the wrong divine. The lvl 19 drow favored soul will sometimes act in a similar manner, but she also seems to heal you from time to time, almost out of pity.

judging by some posts i've seen here, i'd say that's pretty spot on to how many favored souls work when played by humans, too

[sweez]

This is disgusting. People buy rogue hirelings for one reason alone, to find traps.

Classist! Rogues are dps!

[Esserbe]

In the interests of fairness, there are some hirelings that far exceed expectations - so long as you temper your expectations by accepting that they will still not perform to "your" intended purpose. Of whom do I speak? Why its Larafay Do'rett. This nigh suicidal lv 15 drow favored soul will do her best to lead the kill count. Regardless of whether she is set to defensive or offensive, she will use her entire blue bar to cometfall and then destruct every single mob she encounters, be they kobold or orthon, often blowing her entire load in the first room. If you expect her to heal you, then you hired the wrong divine. The lvl 19 drow favored soul will sometimes act in a similar manner, but she also seems to heal you from time to time, almost out of pity.

She's level 16. I took her into Ritual Sacrifice on elite and she was destructing and cometfalling everything.

If only you could have more than one of her.

[Chette]

Xorian Cypher is L10 on elite isnt it?

Assuming Hirelings are of "Average" equipment and ability, I wouldnt expect a Hireling rogue under 10 to be able to spot, search or disable L10 Traps.

heck, I might go L12....

The Traps are annoying for sure, but if you cant get around them, perhaps your not up to elite.

The point wasn't that I couldn't get around them (I'm sure I've done this quest at least 200 times, usually without a rogue)....elitist quips like this do nothing to contribute to the conversation nor address the point of the original post.

The point was that I spend TP on a rogue specifically to disarm these traps to make the quest easier, and he completely and utterly failed at this even after providing every buff we could. A level 9 hireling should be able to disarm level 10 traps, especially one I paid real life money for, especially since the only reason anybody would EVER buy a rogue hireling form the store would be to find the traps.

If they are going to be terrible at the only thing people want them to do, they shouldn't be in the store. Put them with the normal hirelings like all the other terrible ones. I'd rather pug out the rogue spot if I want traps done that bad, since at least it won't cost me money when they can't do their job.

[Rawel_San]

The point wasn't that I couldn't get around them (I'm sure I've done this quest at least 200 times, usually without a rogue)....elitist quips like this do nothing to contribute to the conversation nor address the point of the original post.

The point was that I spend TP on a rogue specifically to disarm these traps to make the quest easier, and he completely and utterly failed at this even after providing every buff we could. A level 9 hireling should be able to disarm level 10 traps, especially one I paid real life money for, especially since the only reason anybody would EVER buy a rogue hireling form the store would be to find the traps.

If they are going to be terrible at the only thing people want them to do, they shouldn't be in the store. Put them with the normal hirelings like all the other terrible ones. I'd rather pug out the rogue spot if I want traps done that bad, since at least it won't cost me money when they can't do their job.

The point is that you used the wrong level hireling. The lvl 10 rogue can do the traps assuming adequate buffs.
The lvl 9 which is one level under quest (8 base 10 on elite) can't. Makes perfect sense to me. The difference
between lvl 9 and 10 on a rogue isn't more then 2 skill ranks (1 from level up and 1 from enhcs). The difference
between the dc's on hard and elite is waaaay more than that. The fact that a lvl 10 hireling can actually do the
traps is a testament to the dev's actually scaling the hireling much better then you might expect.

[madmaxhunter]

/signed

Makes me laugh my butt off when a rogue hireling not only fails to disarm a trap, but blows the trap. With skill boost running. I sure wish I could give him a couple +5 kits I've got on a mule. I got a ton of them.

[danotmano1998]

The hirelings find the traps just fine.

If you don't believe me, summon one and stand next to a trap location.
Chances are excellent they will move directly into said trap and die.

If you have a cleric hire? Well that's even better!
Not only will they find said trap, but they will stand directly IN it, while they attempt to heal!

It's like a mini- 3 stooges act, without the slapping. Unless you count the inevitable facepalm as a slap, which I could see.


You *are* getting your entertainment dollar. It's just in a slightly different way than you would want.

[Esserbe]

The point is that you used the wrong level hireling. The lvl 10 rogue can do the traps assuming adequate buffs.
The lvl 9 which is one level under quest (8 base 10 on elite) can't. Makes perfect sense to me. The difference
between lvl 9 and 10 on a rogue isn't more then 2 skill ranks (1 from level up and 1 from enhcs). The difference
between the dc's on hard and elite is waaaay more than that. The fact that a lvl 10 hireling can actually do the
traps is a testament to the dev's actually scaling the hireling much better then you might expect.

There's a new player in my guild who's a rogue. At one level under elite Gwylan's Stand (level 8 vs level 9) he managed to do the traps. No GH, no heroism pots, just +5 tools, +7 item, skill boost, fox pot.

A level 9 rogue hireling paid for with TP should be able to do quests on elite one level above his level if a level 8 newbie rogue can.

[Noneof]

You could try what I did once when several rogue hirelings (including one above level) I bought failed to find the traps. Assuming you know where the box is supposed to be get the rogue as close to it as possible. Then use the disable command. When I did that the rogue went to the box location and disarmed the trap without the box appearing.

[cdr]

High search + UMD + Find Traps scrolls

[Gadget2775]

I feel your frustration, and have experienced the same. At the same time I have to point out that the game doesn't scale at a one for one rate when going from Normal to Elite. There was a dev post about it ages ago, (I'm pulling from memory so these may not be exact) think Hard is like 1.5 - 2 effective levels higher and Elite is 3-4. Means for a quest listed as 8, setting it to Elite scales everything about it to lvl 11-12.

You'd have needed to use a higher level Rogue, which with store bought, you could have done.

The point is that you used the wrong level hireling. The lvl 10 rogue can do the traps assuming adequate buffs.
The lvl 9 which is one level under quest (8 base 10 on elite) can't. Makes perfect sense to me. The difference
between lvl 9 and 10 on a rogue isn't more then 2 skill ranks (1 from level up and 1 from enhcs). The difference
between the dc's on hard and elite is waaaay more than that. The fact that a lvl 10 hireling can actually do the
traps is a testament to the dev's actually scaling the hireling much better then you might expect.

[FranOhmsford]

First of all trying to use a Lvl 9 Rogue Hireling in a Lvl 8 Elite = Lvl 10 quest {Elite Lvl 8 is harder in every way than Normal Lvl 10} is asking for trouble.

Secondly Gwylan's Stand traps are not amongst the hardest at level traps in the game and that newbie rogue may very well have rolled high each time anyway.

Thirdly Corbin Kohl {Lvl 9 Rogue Hireling} has been known to be borked for at least the last two updates. He used to be superb when Rogue Hirelings were first added into the game but something happened during the first patch afterwards that has so far been ignored completely borking him.

Fourthly Xorian is a particularly hard quest for it's lvl {unlike Gwylan's}.

Your biggest problem is NOT that Corbin is incapable of doing said traps. It is that the Lvl 10 Rogue Hireling {Veil} is if I remember correctly a Rogue Acrobat like many of the lowbie rogue Hirelings and as such not specced out for traps either.

One Rogue Hireling who is good is the Lvl 5 {Kelorn Gossinar - Rogue Mechanic - Don't ask how he has the PrE at Lvl 5 but he does}.
Another is the Lvl 1 {Riana Montague}.
And the Lvl 13 {Fira Greylocke} is amongst my favourite hirelings of any level.

BTW Elitist in my view is expecting to be able to complete elite quests when under level and moaning when one cannot. NOT telling someone to use the appropriate lvl Rogue Hireling for the quest.

[Skar]

My 2 cents:

1. Don't buy rogues from shop. Also don't buy hair colors. Show turbine that it's stupid.
2. Dont buy cleric hires. You want healers with sp and hp. Fvs always have more hp and sp. Lv 13 fvs >> Lv 16 cleric. No joke. I solo every day with hire heal.

[Miow]

I agree...annoying...