Best fleshy wizard TR build

[wax_on_wax_off]

So thinking about TR'ing my sorc through 3 wizard lives before going back to sorc and trying to make some build decisions.

• Warforged Archmage or Human/Dwarf/Elf/Half-elf/Drow Palemaster? -> I have a Shroud of the Abbot so WF is out.
• Splash or pure? -> 1 rogue seems an option for UMD and trap skills but not sure, happy to take opinions on it.
• Shield mastery or no? -> Is this feat useful for leveling?
• Strength or charisma? -> some left over points are often available, I guess strength is the best direction for them?

Level 13 intelligence: 18 base+3 levels+2 tome+6 item+1 LotD+3 enhancements=33 -> Human or Helf the best choice?
Level 16 intelligence: 18 base+4 levels+2 tome+6 item+1 LotD+3 enhancements=34 -> Drow or elf the best choice?

[sweez]

Once you have both wizard and sorc past lives, I'd go human and cram both active PLs in, wiz is a no brainer, but sorc PL active is surprisingly useful (all metas but heighten work on it, works in antimagic fields, decent damage, and more SP while leveling is always nice).

Did 3 wiz lives recently, if you're careful and accept the fact that you'll most likely need help with elite Running w/devils, PM isn't a bad choice at all. Frees up more AP for damage specs, and basically gives you 2 extra feats (don't have to take a second spell mastery, and you can go human for another extra). If you craft a superior stability item (mithral light shield works great for low levels) you'll get held only on a 1, and cept for Running w/devils the light damage is manageable unless you go vamp (avoid vamp at all costs).

WF AM is always a safe choice of course, I just prefer the AP/feat flexibility PM gives. Shield mastery is almost certainly a waste, with wraith incorporeality and displacement, physical damage is basically a non-issue.

Splash or pure, I'd go pure unless you're running in a TR group, doing traps just isn't time-efficient if you're running solo, and with insightful reflexes, early and easy access to fireshield/protection element scrolls and GH, vast majority of traps will be completely trivial.

As for race, I'd go human. Helf doesn't really have any attractive dillies for a leveling arcane (paladin is ok, but not really needed, plus means you'd have to wear a cha item and/or put points into cha), elf is great for spell pen at cap, but one feat +2 wiz enhancements is mostly enough for leveling purposes, drow has absolutely horribad stat distribution issues for leveling so I'd definitely skip that unless you plan to LR at least once.

And yeah extra points in STR are always a good idea on leveling builds imho.

[Calebro]

[*]Splash or pure? -> 1 rogue seems an option for UMD and trap skills but not sure, happy to take opinions on it.

Arty is a better choice for a one level dip. If you go two, Rogue for evasion. If you're only going one, Arty for extra SP. Plus they're both Int based casters, so the double bonus SP from a high Int would almost equal a pure Wizard's SP pool.

edit:
Actually, upon looking, it would exceed a pure Wizard's SP pool.
A pure wizard gains 100 SP from 19 to 20, and another 15 from a 40 Int versus a level 19.
Arty gains 80 at level 1, plus the bonus from Int at approximately 150.
So ~230 from an Arty1 splash, but only ~115 by staying pure.
Trap skills for more XP, UMD at max ranks, and a larger SP pool to draw from.
Arty1 wins.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Arty is a better choice for a one level dip. If you go two, Rogue for evasion. If you're only going one, Arty for extra SP. Plus they're both Int based casters, so the double bonus SP from a high Int would almost equal a pure Wizard's SP pool.

edit:
Actually, upon looking, it would exceed a pure Wizard's SP pool.
A pure wizard gains 100 SP from 19 to 20, and another 15 from a 40 Int versus a level 19.
Arty gains 80 at level 1, plus the bonus from Int at approximately 150.
So ~230 from an Arty1 splash, but only ~115 by staying pure.
Trap skills for more XP, UMD at max ranks, and a larger SP pool to draw from.
Arty1 wins.

Decent points. Still, 17 wizard/1 artificer or 18 wizard?

Once you have both wizard and sorc past lives, I'd go human and cram both active PLs in, wiz is a no brainer, but sorc PL active is surprisingly useful (all metas but heighten work on it, works in antimagic fields, decent damage, and more SP while leveling is always nice).

Did 3 wiz lives recently, if you're careful and accept the fact that you'll most likely need help with elite Running w/devils, PM isn't a bad choice at all. Frees up more AP for damage specs, and basically gives you 2 extra feats (don't have to take a second spell mastery, and you can go human for another extra). If you craft a superior stability item (mithral light shield works great for low levels) you'll get held only on a 1, and cept for Running w/devils the light damage is manageable unless you go vamp (avoid vamp at all costs).

WF AM is always a safe choice of course, I just prefer the AP/feat flexibility PM gives. Shield mastery is almost certainly a waste, with wraith incorporeality and displacement, physical damage is basically a non-issue.

Splash or pure, I'd go pure unless you're running in a TR group, doing traps just isn't time-efficient if you're running solo, and with insightful reflexes, early and easy access to fireshield/protection element scrolls and GH, vast majority of traps will be completely trivial.

As for race, I'd go human. Helf doesn't really have any attractive dillies for a leveling arcane (paladin is ok, but not really needed, plus means you'd have to wear a cha item and/or put points into cha), elf is great for spell pen at cap, but one feat +2 wiz enhancements is mostly enough for leveling purposes, drow has absolutely horribad stat distribution issues for leveling so I'd definitely skip that unless you plan to LR at least once.

And yeah extra points in STR are always a good idea on leveling builds imho.

With the Shroud of the Abbot I think PM is a no-brainer, having Boon of Undeath from level 14 is a reason in itself but major lightning/void lore, 30 light resist and arcane augmentation IX is going to blow my mind.

Race is still not a settled issue for me. As much as anything I'm looking for reasons *not* to go human, just for a little bit of flavour.

Here is what I have:

• If I go drow then I'll have +1 intelligence modifier in the level range that I'll spend the most time: 16-20.
• If I go human then I'm not sure the extra feat will be needed if I skip over spell focus: other and shield mastery.
• If I go half-elf I can take cleric dilettante for instance and fill in as healer/raiser as needed and use harm scrolls on myself

Thoughts?

[AtomicMew]

Currently, I'm doing an evocation specced AM with a a barb splash. It doesn't have as much raw power as my sorc past lifes, but it is better in some ways due to run speed, higher DCs and sprint boost. For example, I solo'ed elite VON 3 in 14 minutes just by running past all the trash. It's much harder to do that without sprint boost. AM doesn't really get anything good at level 18, so there's also not much loss at higher levels. At least that's what I'm hoping.

I don't think rogue splash for traps is worth it anymore. Traps now represent a smaller fraction of your XP due to tome of learning and bravery bonuses, since trap bonus stacks additively. Also, if you do decide to go PM and splash, remember that you're going to lose out on PM III/lich form for basically your entire leveling path .

[daniel7]

Go pure wiz unless you enjoy stopping to do traps. Drow for +1 DC isn't worth it especially for a veteran player like yourself that has gear. Pale master sounds like it would be more fun for someone coming off a sorcerer life.
Why not try both? Human PM this life, WF AM for the next one. Then let the rest of us know which one you prefer.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Currently, I'm doing an evocation specced AM with a a barb splash. It doesn't have as much raw power as my sorc past lifes, but it is better in some ways due to run speed, higher DCs and sprint boost. For example, I solo'ed elite VON 3 in 14 minutes just by running past all the trash. It's much harder to do that without sprint boost. AM doesn't really get anything good at level 18, so there's also not much loss at higher levels. At least that's what I'm hoping.

I don't think rogue splash for traps is worth it anymore. Traps now represent a smaller fraction of your XP due to tome of learning and bravery bonuses, since trap bonus stacks additively. Also, if you do decide to go PM and splash, remember that you're going to lose out on PM III/lich form for basically your entire leveling path .

I considered a barb splash as well for move boost/sprint boost as well as easy access to shield mastery (might be entertaining to solo elite DQ at level for instance).

1 barb/18 wizard wouldn't be a bad split for that level and I don't think there is as much reason to stay at 18 as there used to be (pretty much only for vale farming, after that can level to 19 - though, farming level 17 quests on hard is obviously more difficult).

[wax_on_wax_off]

So I ended up going pure half-elf. I've took paladin dilettante at level 1 (17 base con, 13 base cha) and will swap to FvS dilettante when I take Palemaster PrE at level 12.

Smooth and fun so far. I'm surprised how easy is to do most quests with 0 metamagics active and just relying on superior clicky, best lore (major lore at level 7 is fun) and heavy enhancements (max/1/1). Speeds quests up considerably when I don't need to shrine and still have enough SP to turn on metamagics for the boss.

The sorcerer PL is interesting. The save is annoying when I'm not worried about my DCs atm, the damage is really random, I see hits of 25 and hits of 350 and the range is shorter than my ray spells. Still, it's a fair bit of extra damage and handy to take down casters without using SP. Possibly swap it out at some stage, do people do that?

I don't have any PrE atm. No mental toughness to qualify for AM and zombie form isn't interesting enough to warrant it considering the easy access to cure wands that I have through Paladin Dilettante (though perhaps cure serious won't be enough soon). Any thoughts on this?

[korsat]

what about pure dwarf?can start with 18 int 18 const and the rest into strenght(15-16 starting str) to help you lvl up using an axe with the access to axe enhancments with a master touch spell. You will never miss (tested on a 1st life dwarf wiz with 14 starting str) also on vale and end game

[wax_on_wax_off]

what about pure dwarf?can start with 18 int 18 const and the rest into strenght(15-16 starting str) to help you lvl up using an axe with the access to axe enhancments with a master touch spell. You will never miss (tested on a 1st life dwarf wiz with 14 starting str) also on vale and end game

What's the point?

I've tried it and it's so much quicker to just use 2 buffs (superior erosion/inferno) and burn everything down. Works totally fine from level 1 on hard or elite.

I've tried the melee stuff on an arcane but with the adjustment to SP costs there just isn't much point anymore, imo.

Levels 1-4: Tag team Acid Spray+Burning Hands (augmented by Robe of Duality, acid/fire lore, superior clickies, enhancements). Maximised, empowered Scorching Ray/Sorc PL for bosses.
Levels 5-6: Tag team Fireball+Acid Blast (as above, throw melfs acid arrow in occasionally).
Levels 7+: Tag team Firewall+Acid Rain (as above, add major fire/acid lore).

No need for metamagics except as shrines allow (though usually it's easy to just ignore shrines as it saves more time than killing the mobs faster and then shrining I found).

Good defenses are important: cure serious wands with healing amp (ship buff+improved recovery I) and W&SMI (just upgraded to II). Light Mithral Shield of Invulnerability from levels 1-4, Medium guild augment slot robe of invulnerability levels 5-6 (slotted with fort), moderate fort ring for levels 5-6 (for 90% total fort), heavy fort ring at level 7, add lifeshield to outfit at level 7 and slot with spell points in the future (guild HP item is GFL belt).

It's honestly depressing how hard it is to die with 5/magic DR, life shield and 100% fortification.

[EvilI]

I was wondering if 1 level of sorc would get you double sp from VPIS and guild augment crytals? If so that's what I think I'll do in the same situation. No use for capstone if you're going to TR again right away.

[wax_on_wax_off]

I was wondering if 1 level of sorc would get you double sp from VPIS and guild augment crytals? If so that's what I think I'll do in the same situation. No use for capstone if you're going to TR again right away.

No, doesn't work like that; you get a proportional increase in SP according to your level split. Deferring spells by 1 level definitely isn't worth some extra SP; I've really not had SP issues even though I've never used weapons and only occasionally used eternal wands.