Failed Normal Shroud...

[Blackbird]

I figured it was because I used the dreaded "e" word.

But anyways, if you think this you haven't read my prior posts very thoroughly. As I said before, I commented on the arcanes because I know there were some of them who weren't dotting harry at all. That's equivalent to a melee not swinging or a divine not throwing mass cures/heals. To compare my contribution even while not having a DR breaker to them hardly even doing damage is just silly. I contributed more than them, that's just a fact. They weren't doing hardly any damage. My toon did thousands of points of damage. I'm not "bashing" them, just pointing out what happened in the run.

Not necessarily. DoTs are not the only way to damage Harry. I don't know how long you've been around but DoTs are relatively new. We ran Shroud for years without them. I know you said that the casters were casting other inappropriate spells such as Wail but I didn't want you to think that it was Dots or nothing. Either way, 3 arcanes can't carry a bunch of melee that are also doing insufficient damage.

Second, making money really ISN'T hard in DDO...it just requires doing something like farming collectables. Just running Tangleroot, for example, a couple of times (at most) and collecting all of the collectables, then selling them on the AH, would make you enough money to buy the sword you paid for...similarly, farming chests in a place like Orchard or Gianthold or Vale can make you lots of money, between items to deconstruct for essences/possibly sell on the AH and useful collectables/ingredients to sell as well. As hard as people like to pretend it, getting plat in DDO isn't hard...just boring.

Or you could work the street corners in the Harbor like Wrunt.

[Crann]

Imagine if you opened the refrigerator and said: "There is no beer!" I then responded by pointing out that you've made a ridiculous claim. There is plenty of beer. There is beer at the brewery, bar and store just down the road, for example. Plenty of beer exists! Clearly, this would be a radically uncharitable and inappropriate interpretation of your statement. Context often matters when it comes to determining what people mean. I thought the context here was pretty darn clear. The "certain level of gear" being referred to was a DR breaker.

Imagine of you were going to a party, and you wanted to drink beer.

Would it be acceptable to just assume that everyone else is bringing extra, and that there will be enough for you?

[HungarianRhapsody]

Imagine of you were going to a party, and you wanted to drink beer.

Would it be acceptable to just assume that everyone else is bringing extra, and that there will be enough for you?

As long as you are female and attractive (at least after other people have been drinking), it appears to be socially acceptable to do so.

[BDog77]

I also would like to clear up a minor point. I have no problems at all with running a Shroud with new toons who don't know they need a DR breaker. None at all...

However, when someone who knows they should have a DR breaker doesn't bring one, well that's a whole 'nother can of worms.....

[WruntJunior]

Or you could work the street corners in the Harbor like Wrunt.

Hey, whatever it takes to get more claw gloves/envenomed cloak scrolls. :P

[ariel7]

I can't do that because then I couldn't use my best weapon for general questing.

If you can be bothered to do your part, why in the world would you complain about casters not DoTing or healers not hjealing? One shroud completion starting from scratch and you can get a dr breaker. I find your playstyle incredibly selfish and predatory - you seek groups willing to give you completions you don't really contribute to and benefit by doing less than your fair share. My alts are mostly based on the names Nighbreak, Daybreak and Severuss. Kindly exclude me from your lack of effort. Nowhere have I seen someone ask you to do anything but be able to contribute a sub-average dps, but excuses are coming with the speed of a rapper on coke. Btw my favorite one is "if you don't want me abusing your raid group you should change your raid group to elite since I don't sponge loot and xp on elite shroud currently." That's rich.

[XL_Jockey]

I hit a normal Shroud LFM on my lvl 18 FvS with my guildie, another FvS. The LFM only needed 2 healers to fill. I sent a tell to the leader letting them know it was my first time healing Shroud but that I'd be fine. I got booted with no explanation. My guildie dropped group and I asked why I was kicked. He laughed, said my HP were too low and he didn't want to fail because of me. True, my HP were at about 360, but really, normal shroud? He had a melee in there with less HP.

We made our own Shroud group, filled it with pugs and completed no problem. I also thought about his advice and swapped some gear around and hit 450hp. Turns out I didn't have my CON+6 item equipped, but I also didn't have GFL or a toughness item at the time. I still feel bad for him when he has an LFM looking for a healer and I'm free though.

[Ivan_Milic]

I hit a normal Shroud LFM on my lvl 18 FvS with my guildie, another FvS. The LFM only needed 2 healers to fill. I sent a tell to the leader letting them know it was my first time healing Shroud but that I'd be fine. I got booted with no explanation. My guildie dropped group and I asked why I was kicked. He laughed, said my HP were too low and he didn't want to fail because of me. True, my HP were at about 360, but really, normal shroud? He had a melee in there with less HP.

We made our own Shroud group, filled it with pugs and completed no problem. I also thought about his advice and swapped some gear around and hit 450hp. Turns out I didn't have my CON+6 item equipped, but I also didn't have GFL or a toughness item at the time. I still feel bad for him when he has an LFM looking for a healer and I'm free though.

HP isn't important as people think it is.
There are some casters/divines doing epics with 300 hp and they do just fine.

[HungarianRhapsody]

HP isn't important as people think it is.
There are some casters/divines doing epics with 300 hp and they do just fine.

There are some players whose play style allows them to play casters/divines in some (not all) epics with 300 hp and still get a completion without too many deaths.

That's not quite the same as what you said.

[XL_Jockey]

HP isn't important as people think it is.
There are some casters/divines doing epics with 300 hp and they do just fine.

Exactly. More is certainly nice, but on normal Shroud that's hurting to find 2 healers I think 350 is at least adequate given the situation. Usually when I do Shroud I'm mostly scroll healing and using SP for buffs and mass heals as needed. If it's a good DPS party I'll do more dots and other damage to speed things up. If the DPS is questionable I'll conserve SP in case something goes wrong (only once so far thanks to a lag spike that wiped out half the party).

[Ivan_Milic]

There are some players whose play style allows them to play casters/divines in some (not all) epics with 300 hp and still get a completion without too many deaths.

That's not quite the same as what you said.

What I said is that casters/divines with 300 hp do epics the same as ones with 500,600 hp.
Booting someone because they dont have as much hp as you think is enough is stupid,casters/divines dont need 500,600 hp,melees do need if the quest is like shroud where you cant have 1 person take all the dmg.

[foxom1]

If you're capped and don't have at least 400hp on your toon it's not unreasonable to boot someone. If you don't know enough to make a worthwhile toon why should the leader think that you know enough to contribute to the party. 400 is simple to get with any decent build and minimal gear(toughness, GFL, a couple points spent into enhancements and a starting con over 13).

[HungarianRhapsody]

What I said is that casters/divines with 300 hp do epics the same as ones with 500,600 hp.
Booting someone because they dont have as much hp as you think is enough is stupid,casters/divines dont need 500,600 hp,melees do need if the quest is like shroud where you cant have 1 person take all the dmg.

Casters/divines with 300 hp don't do epics the same as ones with 500 or 600 hp.

They can do *most* of the same epics just as well *most* of the time. But when two characters are the same except for the extra 200 or 300 HP that one of them has, the one who has 200 or 300 fewer HP has less room for accidents and errors - including accidents and errors that other players make that end up causing extra damage that wasn't the caster/divine's fault at all.

You absolutely can do most content just fine with 300 HP. There is very little content where more than 300 HP is really necessary. Saying that 300 HP is just as good as 500 or 600 HP is just plain false, however.

[HungarianRhapsody]

If you're capped and don't have at least 400hp on your toon it's not unreasonable to boot someone. If you don't know enough to make a worthwhile toon why should the leader think that you know enough to contribute to the party. 400 is simple to get with any decent build and minimal gear(toughness, GFL, a couple points spent into enhancements and a starting con over 13).

I think it's entirely reasonable to have less than 400 HP on many characters that have just recently capped - especially if you are on your first or second character on a server.

All of the gear that is required to get 400 or more HP is relatively straightforward to acquire eventually, but leveling happens *so* fast in DDO that it's very easy to hit 20 before you actually get even some of the basic gear that you have planned for that character unless you have "big brother" characters to farm the gear for you.

I wouldn't take that character along for an LoB/MA run and I'd have to consider carefully whether to take them into a HoX, but I would have no problem taking them into a Shroud.

[foxom1]

are you kidding me? it's quite easy to get and if someone can't put forth the effort to have a toon with the bare minimum gear then I'll boot them all day long. I'm lookin to do a quest not fill my backpack with soulstones.

[maha0201]

Well i recon one elite shroud i did with guild, i was on mine 770 hp pally monk, and we had 350 hp AA ranger in group that i didn't like cause of hp.
I died pt 4 and ranger survived - guildies poked me
Pt 5 ranger died 5 time i died 1ce at end when blades got me and casters finished harry with dots

Depending on play stile low hp cant be measurement of skills. If i know guild or player playing ill probably take 350 hp lvl 16-17(20 even ) that can carry his own weight than 700+ WF bbn who use Sword of Shadows since it is ubbbah DPS

are you kidding me? it's quite easy to get and if someone can't put forth the effort to have a toon with the bare minimum gear then I'll boot them all day long. I'm lookin to do a quest not fill my backpack with soulstones.

Im soooo gonna bring gimps in your run and Be THE guest star ! no con no GS hp no toughness no GFL !

[Ivan_Milic]

are you kidding me? it's quite easy to get and if someone can't put forth the effort to have a toon with the bare minimum gear then I'll boot them all day long. I'm lookin to do a quest not fill my backpack with soulstones.

So you gonna boot someone before you see if they are good?

[maha0201]

So you gonna boot someone before you see if they are good?

If they ain't me prolly

[foxom1]

if they're good i already know them. 'nuff said

[foxom1]

Im soooo gonna bring gimps in your run and Be THE guest star ! no con no GS hp no toughness no GFL !

Good luck Maha, I can "smell" your gimp toons coming a mile away ;-)