Solid first life build

[macubrae]

With the expansion pack offering so much, I'm attempting to get a few friends to switch over to DDO from various other MMO's.

What is the best build for a tomeless, gearless, experienced gamer?

I have a couple toons that I can TR to help them out, but most really good gear is bound to account. That, and they like to gear themselves. I did it and I understand, there is a sense of accomplishment in doing it yourself. If there is a single build that stands on it's own, what is it.

As a PnP gamer, I've learned how to keep a character alive and usefull. There comes a point though, if you're not having fun with a toon, reroll and try something else. What is best for a first time toon? Is it "pew pew", a wizzy, a pally, or a healer?

Don't just read it and leave it, give me of your insight and experience. Any contributions will be appreciated.

[xoowak]

I'd go Warforged Wizard. Almost no gear required for non-epic content, easy to level, and extremely survivable. Wizard over sorc for flexibility and experimenting with spells/playstyle.

For melee I'd go barb. The boosts from rage offset the lack of gearing a bit.

I'd avoid pew-pew and pally. People that make pew-pews for their first characters are the reason everyone hates rangers. Pallies require some experience and gear to compete with barb/fighter, imo.

[Dwarfo]

To get a feel for the game, as a melee, id go pally. They are all around alright at low lvls.

[macubrae]

WF wizard, self healing and buffing with a healthy supply of toughness enhancements sounds promising.

Pally has excellent saves, d10 HP, can go DoS for great first life ac.

lets keep it going, I have to overcome some obstacles to convince them and I'd like to offer a little more.

[Thebeest]

If your including purchased classes/races (ie warforged wizard).

Warforged FVS - early lvls acts as a meleer that can heal themselves/others. once you hit 12 and get archon, blade barrier, let the slaughter commence!

[unbongwah]

What is the best build for a tomeless, gearless, experienced gamer?

The one they have the most fun with.

Seriously, that question is so wide open. Maybe I'm crazy, but it seems like you've got things the wrong way around. Find out what your friends would like to play, then find good builds for them.

Enjoy hitting things? Hard to go wrong with a pure barb or ftr. Or a monk if you prefer punching things. Pallies do less DPS and are more stat-dependent, but they also have better self-sufficiency & survivability. And few things do more DPS under the right circumstances than a backstabbing Assassin...

Like the classic S&B tank? Ftr or pally (or both).

Want to be a healer? Plenty of good cleric builds out there who do a lot more than just heal.

Like arcane spells? Go sorcerer for a pure DPSer or wizard if you prefer the CC / instakill spells (Necro, Enchantment, etc.).

Wanna deal with traps? Any number of rogue-based builds fit the bill, either pure or mixed with ranger, wizard, or even bard.

Enjoy the pew-pew-pew? An artificer, Arcane Archer, or Mechanic fit the bill nicely.

Prefer a jack-of-all-trades? A good bard is always welcome: buffs, heals, CC, and some DPS if you build it right.

The point is there are a lot of solid builds out there for first-lifers. Heck, there are threads dedicated to them. Asking something as generic as "what's the best build?" is just silly.

[Kinerd]

I just mentioned this in another thread, but it applies just as well here: THF barb. Heavily front-loaded in terms of relative prowess, with a heavily back-loaded PrE to give the (erroneous) impression of continued power:

Dwarf Barbarian
18 Str (all 5 level-ups here)
8 Dex
20 Con
8 Int
8 Wis
6 Cha

Feats
THF
Power Attack
Cleave
Improved Critical: Slash
Toughness
Improved THF
Greater THF

Enhancements
Frenzied Berserker

Alleviates every problem a first character has, exacerbates none.

Yes, warforged wizards are awesome... starting at level 7. I am not doubting your IRL charisma, macubrae, but I think you're putting yourself behind the eight ball trying to convince someone to stay that long with an apparent gimp.

Healers have a +400 to getting into pugs, but also have a +800 to getting berated the instant anything goes slightly wrong in a quest. With a friend to play with and with no strong ties to the game, I don't think they're the best choice.

[Maelodic]

My favorite character when I first started was a human standard warchanter. Free buffs/heals/crowd control. Made soloing really easy and in parties I always felt wanted and loved but not expected to keep anything but songs going. Performs very very well. I used thiocan's revisiting paths build.

My favorite character now is my dragonmarked halfling force SLA wizard, while it's not fantastic endgame without a wizard PL, it's really fun to level, and performs remarkably. It goes something like:

1 Least dragonmark of healing
1 Maximise
3 Empower
5 Mental Toughness
6 Spell Focus: Evocation
9 Lesser Dragonmark of Healing
10 Heighten
12 Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
15 Greater Dragonmark of Healing
15 Spell focus: Enchantment
18 Greater Spell Focus: Enchantment
20 Spell Focus: Conjuration (For free webs, could switch out with Necro)

[EustaceTrevelyan]

I just mentioned this in another thread, but it applies just as well here: THF barb. Heavily front-loaded in terms of relative prowess, with a heavily back-loaded PrE to give the (erroneous) impression of continued power:

Dwarf Barbarian
18 Str (all 5 level-ups here)
8 Dex
20 Con
8 Int
8 Wis
6 Cha

Feats
THF
Power Attack
Cleave
Improved Critical: Slash
Toughness
Improved THF
Greater THF

Enhancements
Frenzied Berserker

Alleviates every problem a first character has, exacerbates none.

Yes, warforged wizards are awesome... starting at level 7. I am not doubting your IRL charisma, macubrae, but I think you're putting yourself behind the eight ball trying to convince someone to stay that long with an apparent gimp.

Healers have a +400 to getting into pugs, but also have a +800 to getting berated the instant anything goes slightly wrong in a quest. With a friend to play with and with no strong ties to the game, I don't think they're the best choice.

WF wiz would have zero probs leveling to 7 tho, with just self heal, masters touch, and an axe Heck, you could prolly get to 10 with the axe, since you have self stat buffs. I'm planning on TRing something at some point, and i have half a mind to do it in starter rags and see how long that works for me But having said that, it would be absolutely impossible to not like leveling your dwarf barb unless they hated 1)Hitting things very hard till they stopped being an issue, 2)Dwarves, for some odd reason, or 3)Ale. (which is a must on any dwarf build. I know you pretty much assumed it there, not even bothering to mention it, but i'm just pointing it out for the kids at home

The one they have the most fun with.

Seriously, that question is so wide open. Maybe I'm crazy, but it seems like you've got things the wrong way around. Find out what your friends would like to play, then find good builds for them.

Enjoy hitting things? Hard to go wrong with a pure barb or ftr. Or a monk if you prefer punching things. Pallies do less DPS and are more stat-dependent, but they also have better self-sufficiency & survivability. And few things do more DPS under the right circumstances than a backstabbing Assassin...

Like the classic S&B tank? Ftr or pally (or both).

Want to be a healer? Plenty of good cleric builds out there who do a lot more than just heal.

Like arcane spells? Go sorcerer for a pure DPSer or wizard if you prefer the CC / instakill spells (Necro, Enchantment, etc.).

Wanna deal with traps? Any number of rogue-based builds fit the bill, either pure or mixed with ranger, wizard, or even bard.

Enjoy the pew-pew-pew? An artificer, Arcane Archer, or Mechanic fit the bill nicely.

Prefer a jack-of-all-trades? A good bard is always welcome: buffs, heals, CC, and some DPS if you build it right.

The point is there are a lot of solid builds out there for first-lifers. Heck, there are threads dedicated to them. Asking something as generic as "what's the best build?" is just silly.

"the one you'd have teh most fun with" is dead on, and in fact good advice for everyone at all times in this (or any game, and i agree with your analysis for the clerics, arcanes, pure barb/ftr, and barb. so +1 for that.

for pew pew pew, arti is dead on, provided you read some good build advice, and carefully explain how to play ranged. it has built in utility first life even to end game raids.

Arcane archer however i would NOT recommend to someone new to this game but with experience in others, since ranged here is a lot different from most. AA has got some new oomph from monk splash ZA 10k Star power, and is good in its own right, but while the ranger stuff (assuming it's not elvish racial AA) has some utility, it takes experience and the right build to do AA right. Also playstyle is huge, since you need to have the right tactics or know/be able to put away the bow (i know there are builds for the experienced that don't ever need to put away the bow, but we're talking DDO newbies.)

And mechanic for pew pew? No, just no. It has better reflex for traps that you need to walk through to disarm, but otherwise, it has all of the disadvanages of rog without the situational sweet damage. A splash with something else, well we were talking about elementary things for new players. I have a mech at 16, and really, i've stopped playing him other than to sell stuff in favor of arti, which has all the xbow lub i've ever wanted, and more to offer a group when there's no traps.


If you just want traps, well, i'm really not recommending rog just to do that. You can absolutely have a rog with great damage who can get the traps, but they're more of a challenge to play and esp gear, being squishy and melee (and you should play them melee if a beginner, IMHO.) You're really better off with arti first life if you want traps, or wiz/rog splash. Still most of the wiz stuff, wiz doens't require much gear, free class, great surviveability with WF or PM, etc.

Of course, having said all that, perhaps you're more than capable of running down the pitfalls with them, and they're able and willing to learn and take on a challenge. In which case, i rescind all of my advice, cept for the rog for traps and mechanic, which i stand by.

[Clayness]

My favorite character when I first started was a human standard warchanter. Free buffs/heals/crowd control. Made soloing really easy and in parties I always felt wanted and loved but not expected to keep anything but songs going. Performs very very well. I used thiocan's revisiting paths build.

My favorite character now is my dragonmarked halfling force SLA wizard, while it's not fantastic endgame without a wizard PL, it's really fun to level, and performs remarkably. It goes something like:

1 Least dragonmark of healing
1 Maximise
3 Empower
5 Mental Toughness
6 Spell Focus: Evocation
9 Lesser Dragonmark of Healing
10 Heighten
12 Greater Spell Focus: Evocation
15 Greater Dragonmark of Healing
15 Spell focus: Enchantment
18 Greater Spell Focus: Enchantment
20 Spell Focus: Conjuration (For free webs, could switch out with Necro)

You would recommend a first life wizard to not take toughness or any spell penetration feats?

[Aelonwy]

As I have some insight into the friends we're trying to convince to play... let me sum up:

Friend A) great guy, power gamer type, strong background in PnP, likes to create and play the kind of characters that can overcome just about any obstacle, likes to be self sufficient. Willing to read and research builds and game mechanics.

Friend B) Friend A's wife. Likes raids more than other types of content. Likes to lead or have some control over whats happening. No PnP background. Prefers scifi to fantasy type adventures. Doesn't like being low level for long. And... doesn't like to use keyboard much. Hates "research" to play.

We will never convince A to play unless we convince B first.

I was thinking a warforged arty maybe for B, but she might object strenuously to the wf appearance.

So any suggestions based on above information?

[Aelonwy]

I just reread what I wrote and got a flashback to "10 Things I Hate About You" where the two guys are talking on the bleachers and one says to the other "hey I want you to sound more upbeat" so the other smiles and says happily " We're screwed!"

[hiryuu42]

Friend B) Friend A's wife. Likes raids more than other types of content. Likes to lead or have some control over whats happening. No PnP background. Prefers scifi to fantasy type adventures. Doesn't like being low level for long. And... doesn't like to use keyboard much. Hates "research" to play.

Friend A is easy -- WF Wizard/Rogue. If you're willing to put in a little effort, those can walk away from almost anything.

My issue with WF arty is asking her to buy into a game she may not even like. (On the surface, there's plenty for her to not like, given your description.) I would suggest Warchanter Bard, played basically like a Barbarian. Bards get self-healing, which saves time and plat early on. Cast some Extended buffs at the door and charge onward. Sure, that's not the optimal way to play a Bard, but it gets the Korthos and Harbor job done just fine.

[Kinerd]

As I have some insight into the friends we're trying to convince to play... let me sum up:

Friend A) great guy, power gamer type, strong background in PnP, likes to create and play the kind of characters that can overcome just about any obstacle, likes to be self sufficient. Willing to read and research builds and game mechanics.

Friend B) Friend A's wife. Likes raids more than other types of content. Likes to lead or have some control over whats happening. No PnP background. Prefers scifi to fantasy type adventures. Doesn't like being low level for long. And... doesn't like to use keyboard much. Hates "research" to play.

We will never convince A to play unless we convince B first.

I was thinking a warforged arty maybe for B, but she might object strenuously to the wf appearance.

So any suggestions based on above information?

I think friend A will be the tougher test, because he has so much knowledge from PnP that is useless or will actively mislead him in DDO. Wiz/rog, as hiryuu42 suggests, is a very versatile/self-sufficient build, but boy are the low levels ever pathetic, especially if he starts as rogue. A level one Int-based rogue is just hard to watch. I would stay away from it unless you can convince them to get veteran status of some level. I think unbongwah's Tempest Trapmonkey is our friend here.

Friend B is absolutely perfect for the barb build I mentioned. Every build has to use the keyboard a little to reach its full potential, but you can really get away with 2 buttons on a pure barb. I also have heard that people can use a game controller to play DDO, so maybe that would work well.

[GlorifyQuC]

Group of palemasters would be strong.

Otherwise a bunch of casters.

Likes to lead

And... doesn't like to use keyboard much

These two points contradict one another.

[qoolboxer]

With the expansion pack offering so much, I'm attempting to get a few friends to switch over to DDO from various other MMO's.

This. We do not yet know what the expansion pack is offering yet. Although we know the pack is priced at 2495TP, we do not know how much content we will be getting, and have not seen any screenshot from the new adventures (the screenshots in the Underdark pre purchase page is LOLth). Also, the pack will offer nothing to new players since the content is epic only.

[Aelonwy]

These two points contradict one another.

Can't do much about contradictions in her personality, can only work with what we have.

Hmmm. The PnP angle could be the problem with A. There are alot of differences between DDO and D&D, enough to frustrate or put-off some long-time tabletop players.

Hmmm. The biggest problem I forsee is that the couple seems to have different taste in game mechanics than us. They both played WOW for several years, which we tried and didn't like immediately. They both played Rift for, idk, half a year. Now they're playing SWTOR, though truth be told they seem to be going through the motions rather than really enjoying it.

Recently they bought us each a month subscription to Swtor for christmas, to entice us to play with them... we played out our month but blah... game play was extremely limited, figthing was basically hitting hotkey 1 than 2 than 3 than 1 again if off timer etc, not alot of strategy or thought. Really only the cutscenes and conversation dynamics were interesting. So we were thinking of doing something similiar with DDO for their anniversary.

[Purkilius]

I am an old pnp player and had a friend like you playing DDO and told me to try it, I did still playing and loving it

Rolled a fleshy sorc first then went to make a self healing TWF pally with evasion. The pally is better to get to know the game as he can take a hit or 2 (as the driver has no sense of direction either lol).

I would suggest to make a self-sufficient melee first to get to know the game!

[AtomicMew]

WF earth savant /thread