The Heavy Priest: Con based cleric

[Miahoo]

I was looking for another heal bot to serve my guild, and a clone of my con based FVS.

My requierments were:
- Be able to heal, especially with pres.
- High survivability.
- Tanki.
- Solid DoTs.

The build, more than a heal bot, is to save your raid, and disign to get the boss rage while raising the rest of the group and giving the time to recover.

Why not FVS?

Thats a very good question.

FVS has so many advantages:
- 10 DR.
- Free heals as capstone.
- More HP due to enhancements.
- More SP.
- Wings.
And thats the reason you see dozens of solid con-based fvs out there.

So what do you get from a cleric?
- More heal power from pres (75%).
- Mass heal even w/o mana, which regen every 2 minutes.
- Heals over time with pres: Even when you knocked down - you're still healing!
- Free* heal every 3 seconds instead of 6 seconds for FVS.
- DI.

* No mana usage.

So what do we have left? 10 DR, Mana and wings.
Well, DR can be enhanced with items, same is mana (also, dont be too wacky with dots) and wings.. well... wings

Stats:
Half Elf (Monk D.) (32 points)
8 STR
8 DEX
18 CON
12 INT
14 WIS
14 CHA

Final CON = 18 (Base) + 5 (Level ups) + 1 (Enhancements) + 7 (Item) + 3 (Exceptional) + 2 (Tome) = 36
Pushed: 36 + 3 (Abishai Set) + 1 (Tome) + 2 (Alchemical) = 42

HP:
392 (Base with 26 CON)
70 (+7 CON Item)
30 (+3 Exceptional CON)
45 (Shroud)
30 (GFL)
20 (+2 Tome)
20 (Toughness)
20 (Ship)
---
627
30 (Abishai)
10 (+3 Tome)
10 (SFL)
10 (CC Trinket)
20 (Large Guild Slot)
40 (Yugo)
---
747
(You can add rage for 20 more HP - I dont like adding it since the duration is too low).

Non-SP [Self] Healing:
Aura: 7 (Base) * (1 + 0.4 (Enhancements) + 0.75 (Clicky)) * (1 + 0.5 (E.H) + 0.25 (Pre)) = 26

Burst: (1d8 + 22 (Base)) * (1 + 0.4 (Enhancements) + 0.75 (Clicky)) * (1 + 0.5 (E.H) + 0.25 (Pre) + 0.5 (Emp.) + 1 (Max.)) = 160-209

Healing amp: 1.2 (Monk D.) * 1.2 (Human) * 1.1 * 1.2 * 1.3 (Items) * 1.1 (Ship) = 2.71
==> ~70 HP / Tick Aura (~81 / Tick with SS bard).
==> ~433-566 Burst.

This is where you glow! Where FVS do a single target free heals - you do it AoE! Not only you, but all your teamates will enjoy it. Use it smartly!
Your aura will be up for ~1:30 Minutes. Every 2 mintues you get another Turn.

Feats:
1) Monk D. 1) Thoughness 3) Shield Mastery 6) E. Healing 9) Empower 12) Maximize 15) Quicken 18) Imp. Shield Mastery.

Imp. Shield mastery can be replaced (-5% damage is nice, but other feats might be better), other valid feats:
Extra Turning or another Thoughness are nice feats.
If you think you can hit the DC and have some past lifes to support: Heighten Spell, Spell Penetration or Spell Focus can be nice.
And if you really really wanna: Extend, Eschew Materials or Mental Thoughness can also fit in (which personally, I dont very like).

Skills:
Max Concentration, Balance and UMD. Put 1 point on Tumble and the rest on Jump, Diplo or Tumble (I prefer Jump).
Dont forget to eat +2 INT Tome at lvl 7 for more SP.

Equip:
A heal bot dont really need a good equip in order to function and do his job. But you're more than just a heal bot! You are an ass savior! You are... A DIVINE!!

Epic Cavalry Plate is a great armor! it gives ya SFL, Demonic shield, DR 5 against most mobs (well.. DQ might be a problem..) and a blue slot to put your Thoughness in it. Other good choices are: Epic Deneith Heavy Chain, Epic Tourney Armor (i know i know... Its basically vs DQ), and more - so dont be upset if you didn't craft the plate from the last CC event.

Epic chrono set is a great way to boost your hp, give you all the stats you need, +3 CON and enough slots to craft goodies.

Levik's Defender is a great tower shield for tanking. Alchemical Flametouched Iron shield for healing and Alchemical Silver shield for dots are great: Tier 1 - Martial Water for fire shield, Tier 2 - Mystical Fire (or any type tbh) for Superior Lore (Tier 2 Martial Earth can also be valid for +2 CON, if you feel you already have enough crits).

Con-Opp Heal Amp GS will be your main hand weapon most of the times.

Con-Opp 45HP GS as Goggles, can be switched to SP GS.

Large Guild Slot as Belt, switch with Rahkir's Sash for Archmage Set.

Rahkir's Ring Will be your main unswitchable ring, crafted with +2 CON. Your other ring will be switchable slot for: Striding, Anathema, ROSS, etc.

Torc will complete your set and be on you 95% of the time. On HoX and other rare situations I switch to Silver Flame or other necklace I need.


Summary:
This build will hand ya a solid cleric, with nice hit points. True - you wont be able to instakill most of the high content nor BB the evasion mobs (So save your mana!), but you wont be squishy like the 400HP cleric next to you, will block much more damage and you wont be a poor-guy caster.

Post your opinions! also if I have any error or calculation mistakes.

Sources:
Wiki, SirValentine, This post

[Miahoo]

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.12.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Miahoohjeal 
Level 20 Lawful Good Half-Elf Male
(20 Cleric) 
Hit Points: 392
Spell Points: 1292 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 20
Reflex: 6
Will: 15

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength              8                    10
Dexterity             8                    10
Constitution         18                    26
Intelligence         12                    14
Wisdom               14                    16
Charisma             14                    17

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               1                    11.5
Bluff                 2                     3
Concentration         8                    31
Diplomacy             2                     3
Disable Device        n/a                   n/a
Haggle                2                     3
Heal                  2                     5
Hide                 -1                     0
Intimidate            2                     3
Jump                 -1                     6
Listen                2                     3
Move Silently        -1                     0
Open Lock            n/a                    n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                1                     2
Search                1                     2
Spot                  2                     3
Swim                 -1                     0
Tumble                0                     1
Use Magic Device      3                    14

Level 1 (Cleric)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Monk
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Cleric)


Level 3 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery


Level 4 (Cleric)


Level 5 (Cleric)


Level 6 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell


Level 7 (Cleric)


Level 8 (Cleric)


Level 9 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 10 (Cleric)


Level 11 (Cleric)


Level 12 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 13 (Cleric)


Level 14 (Cleric)


Level 15 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 16 (Cleric)


Level 17 (Cleric)


Level 18 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Mastery


Level 19 (Cleric)


Level 20 (Cleric)
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Intervention
Enhancement: Cleric Radiant Servant I
Enhancement: Cleric Radiant Servant II
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Constitution I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Half-Elf Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
Enhancement: Improved Heal I
Enhancement: Improved Heal II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Smiting I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Smiting II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Smiting III
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life III
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Smiting I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life II
Enhancement: Cleric Smiting I
Enhancement: Cleric Smiting II
Enhancement: Cleric Smiting III
Enhancement: Cleric Smiting IV
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic IV
Enhancement: Cleric Charisma I
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality I
Enhancement: Cleric Extra Turning I
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Turning I
Enhancement: Cleric Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Cleric Wand and Scroll Mastery II

[Mubjon]

I thought about doing something similar to this, build basically to tank and dot on bosses with blade barriers and maybe comet falls while getting there.

You are correct that equipment can help bridge the gap with DR from a FvS to cleric. My one cleric that is geared for a caster has DR 14 right now while blocking, not to mention DR 5/Slash, DR 5/Pierce DR 5/blungeon DR/5 Magic and DR 3/Adamantine she will get shield mastery next level. She mitigates a lot of damage to the point that I forget which cleric I am on as I am doing a test build that is around the same level and cannot take the punishment she can.

Granted with all those items equip to reduce damage from every weapon type I know of it does not leave much room for other things to equip so I am constantly swapping gear depending on what I need at that time.

[Impaqt]

What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 747 hit points that you wont be able to do with 647?

This is where this build fails.

you completely nerf your own spell DC's to gain something that doesnt make a difference.

[Sarisa]

Sounds like Mahmood. Sacrifice DC casting for massive survivability and DoT tanking. I can see a dedicated raider who does little else besides raids where divine DC's don't matter making good use out of such a build.

[Matuse]

not to mention DR 5/Slash, DR 5/Pierce DR 5/blungeon DR/5 Magic and DR 3/Adamantine

You know that with the first three, the last two don't do anything, ever?

[Inferno346]

What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 747 hit points that you wont be able to do with 647?

Survive a stun while soloing tod part3?


@OP:

You list a conc-opp GS healing amp, which has to be x/20% amp/30% amp. Then you list 10% amp in your breakdown. Where does the 10% come from?

Consider 18 cleric/1 fighter/1 monk. This gets you 17 more HP from enhancements and the bigger hit dice of fighter, as well as 2 more toughness feats, for a total of 61 HP, at the cost of DI. DI is nice to have, but not sure it is worth 61 HP for this build.

Oh it also gets you full ranks in intim.

[AtomicMew]

What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 747 hit points that you wont be able to do with 647?

This is where this build fails.

you completely nerf your own spell DC's to gain something that doesnt make a difference.

What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 647 hit points that you wont be able to do with547? What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 547 hit points that you wont be able to do with 447?

Past break points for one shot kills, I don't believe there is any magical break point where having more HP isn't useful.

[Impaqt]

Survive a stun while soloing tod part3?


@OP:

you and I both know full well that can be done with 650

What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 647 hit points that you wont be able to do with547? What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 547 hit points that you wont be able to do with 447?

Past break points for one shot kills, I don't believe there is any magical break point where having more HP isn't useful.

true, but at what cost? I just dont like giving up casting DC's for hit points.

[Miahoo]

What exactly do you think you can accomplish with 747 hit points that you wont be able to do with 647?

This is where this build fails.

you completely nerf your own spell DC's to gain something that doesnt make a difference.

I respect DC divines. But imho, it all comes to the role you need to fill in your group, and the type you run with.

There was another section I omitted before posting the OP. but here it goes:

OT / IMHO / Forget it if personal thoughts gets ya mad:
I agree a divine can get good DCs, even necro DCs! but in order to do that you have to put so much effort, almost twice than regular caster - and even then - such a long cooldown on implosion, and such short distance on slay living will leave you with ONE reliable instakill spell.
So instead of BB kiting, why not build a solid toon with more HP, more survivability and DOT the evasions while shield blocking?

DC Divine, Necro or Evoker ?
- If necro: Will you be able to get into mid 40s? What about Spell Pen. ?
- If evoker: How high your DC will be? How efficient is BB kiting in your group?

This old school argument WIS based FVS vs. CON based FVS. It all depends what content are you running, with which group and what is more fun for you to play.

Groups in DDO are looking for a role! And getting classes by the roles they can do. Melee/Range classes for DPS, Arcanes for CC or spell DPS, Bards for buffs and Divines for heals.
Yes, thats the main reason people want your cleric/fvs that much - your band-aid blue bar. Have you ever try to CC with Symbol of stunning/Soundburst in high level content? Have you ever seen a divine who do that? - Even if, thats so rare...

I usually run with a solid group, the trash is mostly dead or dance, so kiting with BB/implosion is just for fun in the way to the quest.

I played both sides: my current CON based FVS was WIS based Cleric before TR. So yeah - it was fun doing epic last stand and leave the melees with 0 kills. But other than that, my FVS has 200 more HP and way more solid.

Now, I totally agree when it comes to tanking, FVS will be x10 better than a Cleric.
- 30% more for DoTs. As a cleric you'll miss 30% DMG and it'll be even harder to keep the aggro.
- Aura and fort reduce. Very important post U11!
- More HP. HP DOES count! every single point does! If I could count the times I got below 100HP when tanking Horoth or Suuly. 10HP can save you from stuns, curses and lags. (We all know lag is rare in DDO! but still... sometimes it happen).

Now lets talk feats. Do you have enough feats for all the metamagics and shield blocking ? What about Spell Pen. ? Its not matter if you have 50 DC, when you cant pass the mob's spell pen! And in high level content, it does matter. (heck! this even matters in normal amarath!).

Basically, we talk about roles here. Is it a second tank you aim for in order to save the raid, or a Last Stand's insta-killer ?

[Miahoo]

You list a conc-opp GS healing amp, which has to be x/20% amp/30% amp. Then you list 10% amp in your breakdown. Where does the 10% come from?

That is correct.

And myself missing 10% amp on my FVS.

Con-Opp Healing Amp GS can also be crafted as Pos-Neg-Pos, with 10% and 30% amp, while the 20% can be crafted on a second amarath ring.

Also a good way, is to craft triple Pos GS with 10%, 20% and 30% amp. This I gonna do with my FVS. (The con-opp weapon is nice, but 10% amp is more important than some sp regen - which might be fixed anytime. And as a tank you better keep anathema on so you wont lose aggro).

Another way is to use DT armor and use other slot item for DR.

Also note: With the fleshmaker armor, you can get another 10% stacking amp, add 3 paladin lifes and you get the max amp for a pure divine.

Consider 18 cleric/1 fighter/1 monk. This gets you 17 more HP from enhancements and the bigger hit dice of fighter, as well as 2 more toughness feats, for a total of 61 HP, at the cost of DI. DI is nice to have, but not sure it is worth 61 HP for this build.

Oh it also gets you full ranks in intim.

I wouldnt go this way. DI is very nice, and saved me so many times.

And even if, 2 monk will be much better choice in order to get evasion. Buy yeah - this build is also valid.

Also note, if you want to build a tank, I highly recommend FVS, from the points I mention in the upper post. When the capstone gives ya free heals you better not lose by multiclassing.

[Miahoo]

you and I both know full well that can be done with 650

I start plan this build to be non equip depended.

So yeah, I wrote full abishai set in the OP, but this can work even w/o and fit for a new player.
* -3 CON from Abishai
* -3 Exceptional CON
* -1 +3 Tome (+2 CON Tome instead of +3)
* -1 +7 CON (+6 CON instead of +7)
* -10 HP SFL (GFL instead of SFL)

Which just what I was missing when I first cap my cleric. This will leave ya with -90 HP = 650HP!
This will be my HP when I cap this toon (Another abishai set is planned to my rog).

So now ask whats the different between 650 HP and 560HP...

[SirValentine]

Now, I totally agree when it comes to tanking, FVS will be x10 better than a Cleric.
- 30% more for DoTs. As a cleric you'll miss 30% DMG and it'll be even harder to keep the aggro.

You're doing a lot better than me if you can consistently keep the light vulnerability debuff triple-stacked. Because, of course, without the debuff, a FvS DoT does exactly the same damage as a Clr DoT. DP does not get the 30% boost that BB does from AoV.

Now lets talk feats. Do you have enough feats for all the metamagics and shield blocking ?

That gives the advantage to Clr; they can easily splash to get extra feats, while FvS loses a lot more by splashing.

[butcheredspirit]

Hahaha

"The Heavy Priest"

First thing I imagine is some fat pompous preacher, passing out the dish for tithes.


What do people think of shield mastery on a cleric?
I've been considering it for my next life, since the introduction of alchemical shields.
However I wondered if the feat was a bit overkill, given our already good survivability.

To take or not to take...

[Miahoo]

You're doing a lot better than me if you can consistently keep the light vulnerability debuff triple-stacked. Because, of course, without the debuff, a FvS DoT does exactly the same damage as a Clr DoT. DP does not get the 30% boost that BB does from AoV.

It depends the enemie attack speed. Thats the avarage I notice when tanking horoth.
Tanking suuly in VoD might get lower percentage (due to phases and teleport).

Dont forget FVS also have an archon which generate ~50 dmg/tick (not including crits).

The pre boosts fire, physical and untype. So DoTs (aka light) do not automatically boost by the pre. Thats is correct. Only when he attacks ya (10% chance).
Click here for more details.

Hahaha

"The Heavy Priest"

First thing I imagine is some fat pompous preacher, passing out the dish for tithes.


What do people think of shield mastery on a cleric?
I've been considering it for my next life, since the introduction of alchemical shields.
However I wondered if the feat was a bit overkill, given our already good survivability.

To take or not to take...

Lol.

Currently the game is going this way. not only the -25% damage (1st feat for tower shield), not only the blocking DR, but also the debuffing you prevent by shield blocking (curses, and most recent - LoB).

Edit: Shield blocking prevent curses and debuffing even if you dont have the feat. but if you use a shield, why not take the feat for -25% damage?

[Sarisa]

What do people think of shield mastery on a cleric?
I've been considering it for my next life, since the introduction of alchemical shields.
However I wondered if the feat was a bit overkill, given our already good survivability.

To take or not to take...

DR is good, very good. Shield Mastery is one feat I would like to fit in, but can't afford to.

[Logic]

Awesome build.

Only thing I saw is that the healing aura does not benifit from the +0.25 PrE empower healing metamagic for some reason (I believe). Total metamagic factor is only 1.5 w/ empower heal active for some reason (tested myself yesterday 2/29/2012 ... need to gather a little more data to see exactly what its doing).

[Miahoo]

Awesome build.

Only thing I saw is that the healing aura does not benifit from the +0.25 PrE empower healing metamagic for some reason (I believe). Total metamagic factor is only 1.5 w/ empower heal active for some reason (tested myself yesterday 2/29/2012 ... need to gather a little more data to see exactly what its doing).

Thats interesting. I'll check it up when I get home.
Ty for noticing.

[SirValentine]

Only thing I saw is that the healing aura does not benifit from the +0.25 PrE empower healing metamagic for some reason (I believe). Total metamagic factor is only 1.5 w/ empower heal active for some reason (tested myself yesterday 2/29/2012 ... need to gather a little more data to see exactly what its doing).

Odd. It should, and it used to. I'm not currently on a Cleric life, so I can't test it myself. Let us know what you find.

[Mubjon]

I am not sure why people think that DI is so great, to long of a cool down and only lasts what 5 min? Yes it can be useful, but more useful than say say 2 more feats? Not sure I agree with that. Splash two fighter and now you can get a few melee based feats and still keep all the casting feats that you want.

Now if the capstone did something a bit more useful, like add +2 to my wisdom stat, or added +2 DC to my evocation spells, or even doubled the length of the healing aura that would be a tough choice to splash or not splash.