Worst Chains to run

[HungarianRhapsody]

Tangleroot is the worst, not because the quests (Threnal takes that) but I feel any chain which cannot be run together has issues. Level 3-7 quests? By time your group can handle the late quests, you get no xp from the first quests. Sure, experienced people can do it, but for a sizable portion of the populace, not-so-much.

At least the Sorrowdusk stuff is broken into two chains.

If you start out at level 6, you'll only miss your bravery bonus on the first quest (and you'll still get full XP with no penalties) and you shouldn't have any problem getting through the entire chain on Elite. The last two quests really aren't at all bad once you know how to run through the traps in the final chapter. A full party that has been through the chain at least once or twice before shouldn't have a serious problem on Elite.

...and if you do have a problem getting through the quest on Elite, you can certainly go through on Normal or Hard. There's no law that says everyone has to do every quest on Elite.

[karsion]

the worst probably is Sorrowdusk - mostly because of the level spread. I solo'd them in two level blocks, and then amazingly had a couple of other people help on the final part. Though, it's kind of an unwritten rule to do that first hafl early, and then flag for Co6 (which is a reference to the last half, specifically), and then try to find a group for that.

But I agree it's really, really hard.

As a TR, looking to do at level elites, there are several in this category:

Pugging at level Chronoscope is nearly impossible.

Sorrowdusk is a pain.

Threnal, as others have mentioned.

Tangleroot is also hard because of the level range, and the fact that the chain sucks.

I don't typically have a problem with the Catacombs. It's also fairly close in level, and I usually wait for the LFM to fill before we start. This solves the late stragglers problem.

Necro II isn't too bad - the XP is really good, so lots of folks run it.

Filling an LFM for Sentinels is also pretty hard.

Pugging at level "Spies in the House" is next to impossible.

Well, maybe Orien is special in that respect but never had problems with getting a group for any of the quests mentioned. Chronoscope is probably the worst cause almost no one runs it for xp and even when we got at level group for Elite Chrono we wiped at Bloodplate.

As a TR most of those quests (except for Chrono and maybe some Necro II stuff) are pretty soloable with a hire on most classes (I can imagine rogues or rangers having some problems).

When talking about difficulty of getting PUGs to run it Threnal is one of the worst (thanks to ******** Coyle quest). Necro may be a little problematic as well (not Necro 4 tho which is run to death for xp and sigils).

[Brennie]

NecroIII. Hands down. There is not a single quest in necroIII that doesn't make me wish I could punch something small and cute.

[QuantumFX]

Three Barrel Cove.

Sorry Dude. Nope. Not in a million years.

3BC’s only sin is that it’s P2P. It’s no more difficult than any of the other House D quests. If it was FtP then it would get run just as often as the “Depths of…” series.

Thernal requires you to pay for the privilege to subject yourself to the worst “Escort” quest in the game and actively invites you to eff up your bravery streak while you do so.

Or, to put it another way: I am a favor w****. And I have never brought an over leveled hireling into a 3BC quest so I could complete a single quest, on casual, to maintain my streak.

[Ziindarax]

Sorry Dude. Nope. Not in a million years.

3BC’s only sin is that it’s P2P. It’s no more difficult than any of the other House D quests. If it was FtP then it would get run just as often as the “Depths of…” series.

Thernal requires you to pay for the privilege to subject yourself to the worst “Escort” quest in the game and actively invites you to eff up your bravery streak while you do so.

Or, to put it another way: I am a favor w****. And I have never brought an over leveled hireling into a 3BC quest so I could complete a single quest, on casual, to maintain my streak.

I'd say Shavarath was, by far, the biggest offender in terms of tempting people to break their streaks to beat a quest. Bastion on Elite is a nightmare, even with an epic party (New Invasion's no picnic either). >.>

[FranOhmsford]

I'd say Shavarath was, by far, the biggest offender in terms of tempting people to break their streaks to beat a quest. Bastion on Elite is a nightmare, even with an epic party (New Invasion's no picnic either). >.>

Why are you worrying about streaks at lvl 19?

As for the worst chains in the game:

Catacombs - Soloable on elite with hireling - Make certain to take down the Arcane Skelly first in the final quest {He does far more damage than the Wraith of the Bishop.}.

Tangleroot - I usually solo this - 2 lvl 3 quests and 2 lvl 4 quests at lvl 5, 2 lvl 5 quests at lvl 6, 2 lvl 6 quests at lvl 7 etc.

Sorrowdusk - This is a pain - First 4 quests have seriously nasty force traps {seem to have become slightly easier in pt 1 and 2 recently} that require you to pass through before they can be disarmed {Rogue Hire no use here unless you have Evasion / Super High Reflex yourself.}.
No more traps for the next 3 {nice easy} quests - Then you come to the Mephits and some more seriously OP traps.
Final Quest btw is surprisingly easy after doing the Penultimate quest in this chain.

Threnal - Aaaaaaarrrrggh

Necro II - Shadow Knight is Superb XP, Shadow King needs to slow down the respawns, Shadow Guard is just tedious, Shadow Lord is one of the worst quests in the game.
I actually had to lead a party of newbies {favour only - we had a lvl 20 in party} on my lvl 12 Acrobat with no Ghost Touch through this last night - Having learnt the lever mechanics I managed this without splitting the party {hireling teleport ftw} BUT I STILL LOATHE THIS QUEST.

Sentinels - Not really a chain per say - BoB, Storm the Beaches, Black Loch can be done in any order and Spies isn't even required.

Necro III - Barely know it - Too hard to get a group together - Just join Cursed Crypt runs.

Chains of Flame - I actually find Wiz King and OoB to be much more of a pain in the posterior.

I'm going to add Gianthold to the list: Crucible is a nightmare of epic proportions, Madstone has the worst most annoying DM Voiceover in the game once the Giant goes into his "I must Heal" routine, I actually enjoy PoP.
Tor is ridiculously hard to get a group together for {sometimes groups can fill in 90 seconds I'll accept BUT other times I've waited 30 mins before even one person hits the LFM}.
Then we get to a raid which only ever gets run on elite with lvl 20s in the party {I've never seen an LFM for Normal or Hard Reaver's Fate}.
Plus the Slayer is a total pain.

[TekkenDevil]

Sorrowdusk and Restless Isles are definitely the worst if you ask me.
It's just really hard to PuG them.

Sorrowdusk has a very long spread of level range, to the point where you can't finish the entire chain on one level set, if you're doing Elite difficulty. The first quests are base level 6, while the final quest is base level 11 if I remember correctly. Very inconvenient to have to visit it twice and be properly progressed in the chains.

Restless Isles on the other hand is too confusing. I even soloed it nice and slow once to learn what the hell is going on, but I still forgot everything, from the path to the pre-requisites of being flagged for the raid.

Runner Up: Threnal.
Threnal is pretty easy with a full party. You only need one person that knows what he's doing, really. Threnal's inherent problem is that since it's a lowbie quest, and tucked away with all the other choices of content/quests, it comes down to how long it takes to complete. And completing all 3 sides of Threnal takes forever and ever and ever. Recycled dungeons don't help either.

[Gizeh]

Necro2 with all its incorporeal and phasing creatures is *very* annoying if you play a melee character.

[karsion]

Necro2 with all its incorporeal and phasing creatures is *very* annoying if you play a melee character.

Heard about ghost touch? Been hearing it is pretty nice.

[Gizeh]

Heard about ghost touch? Been hearing it is pretty nice.

Yeah, ghost touch is awesome while all the incorporeals are phased out...

[HungarianRhapsody]

Yeah, ghost touch is awesome while all the incorporeals are phased out...

Wall of Fire works exactly as well on enemies that are phased out as a Phase Hammer.

[cjhume3]

The catacombs and the grey moon/cult of six series, since you have to run out and talk to someone after every part.

[Drak]

I pitty the noob, who would like to do a whole chain. No new toons I only TR, so max xp/min is all I do. I will never do a whole chain, just in parts only the quests I am +2 levels above, and on elite, window farming hard if worth it. Some day everyone will realise it is the only way to go and put up LFM's like 'CO6 pt 1,2 ONLY, elite' or not LFM at all.
As for threnal and coyle being the worst. Great XP with BB for all parts, and unless you have a pot ticking (and who would for that) get a L20 guild FvS to do East 3 on casual for you if you really want chain completion.

[QuantumFX]

I'd say Shavarath was, by far, the biggest offender in terms of tempting people to break their streaks to beat a quest. Bastion on Elite is a nightmare, even with an epic party (New Invasion's no picnic either). >.>

I think you may have misunderstood what I was saying. I purchased a Level 13 hireling from the DDO store just so I could run Hold for Reinforcements on Casual. With Amrath, you can at least get capped guildies to run with you. (Since there is no way, currently, to overlevel those quests.)

[Uhtred_Stark]

Tangleroot and Co6 have tremendous xp when windowed, I almost always hit those. I actually like Catacombs now, pretty good xp on elite with streaks etc and the whole chain can be done in under an hour. I would actually say Catacombs is a fairly perfect chain, good xp for level, can be completed in reasonable amt of time, great storyline, all enemies makes sense and have synergy.

Worst would be Three Barrell Cove....the quests are terrible, there is just so much competing xp at the level there is rarely any reason to do them. The aforementioned Threnal for all the reasons listed above plus it is competing with the Shadow Crypt and Von3 for xp at level, really no reason to run it. The IQ quests are starting to get hard to fill now that you don't need pieces to unsupress items vs just getting crystal ones from the DD quest turn in.

[decease]

threnal is on top of my list.. sadly i have to solo it on every toon for dm set.

[MorningStarSE]

TBC, Catacombs and Threnal are those I dislike. (and also didn't buy).

No issue with the other chains yet.

[Xeraphim]

Three Barrel Cove.

For shame! Wash your mouth out with soap young man!

..."We dare not speak it's name."
"What's it's name"
"Oh! We dare not speak it."
~Invader Zim, Episode 1. Quotes from the Tallest and Zim exchanging words regarding a "secret mission."

Having kids around sure fills me with worthless information

[Grieve]

So let's see what do we have for quest chains (assuming atleast 3 quests and one cannot be accessed before the other).

WW - Easy with/without group. Everyone has done it and it is quick. (Pain Rating 1/10)

Catacombs - Can be solo'd, but much easier with group. The fourth quest in chain is painfully long for the XP and level. Also, there is alot of running up and down stairs. Otherwise it isn't too bad, especially with the Bravery Bonus now. (Pain Rating 5/10)

StK - Again very similar to WW, but may require a rogue for pt3 on Elite to survive. (Pain Rating 2/10)

Sharn Syndicate - Mostly quick runs. Can be solo'd, but a group is better. Saving the Binder family on elite may be painful to accomplish. Lots of running around the marketplace and of course the XP is really lacking. (Pain Rating 6/10)

TR - Quick, easy, and mostly painless with/without group. It is excellent experience for time spent. Only issues are the initial run out and the level breadth of the chain, 5 levels. (Pain Rating 3/10)

Necro I - Quests are fairly quick to run, but require a party to be efficiently run, one quest needs a party to complete and almost no one will run at level due to better options. Must re-flag for Bloody Crypt after each completion, unless with party window farming. (Pain Rating 7/10)

Carnival - Quests can take some time to complete, but decent XP. Partycrashers on elite at level is painful to say the least. A party is not required, but it will be very slow and not worthwhile solo. Recommend doing chain at level 20 on Epic instead of at level on Elite. (Pain Rating 4/10)

Sentinels - Mostly quick and semi-painless with/without party. Experience is somewhat lacking compared to other quests at level. Must run a long way to reach Bargain of Blood. Storming the Beaches has no Epic version. Only run for players wanting House D favor. (Pain Rating 3/10)

Deleras - Great XP, but requires a party or at least a hireling to complete pt2. Run by almost every player though making parties easy to come by. There was a flagging issue in the past going from pt3 to pt4, but with this fixed and more direction given on the chain it is not really an issue. (Pain Rating 2/10)

Necro II - Can be solo'd, with Hireling, but much more efficient with party. Also, normally requires at least one arcane caster to be done efficiently. Amazing XP for level. Finding your way in one or two of the quests can be a pain. Must re-flag for Shadow Crypt after each completion, unless with party window farming. (4/10)

VoN - Good XP. Flagging quests may be solo'd or completed with a group. Grouping is required for raid portion and flagging mechanism may fall through occasionally. (Pain Rating 4/10)

Threnal - XP is reasonable. The chain is in an out of the way location. Extremely long chain with some of the most annoying quests in game. The progression of the quests is not easy to follow unless players know the chain and can easily be reset making it frustrating to complete the entire chain. May be completed with/without party, but much easier with a party. (Pain Rating 9/10)

Grey Moon & CO6 - Fairly long chain, but numerous quick quests with reasonable XP. Lots of running around, but may be circumvented partially with a caster with DDoor. Chain is somewhat out of the way. Traps encountered can be party ending. Nonetheless chain may be done with/without party. (Pain Rating 5/10)

Restless Isles - Raid Flagging quests may be solo'd, but raid requires a party. Very few players run the quest. Explorer map is horrible to navigate. XP is reasonable. (Pain Rating 7/10)

Necro III - Requires a party to complete the chain. Quests can be very painful and sometimes frustrating with certain traps and quest mechanics (Trading items quickly and guiding rats). Even with the time investment of quests, the XP is still decent. (Pain Rating 5/10)

Sands - Can be solo'd if necessary. Overall decent chain excluding Chains of Flame. Also, somewhat annoying to keep track of flagging items that may easily be destroyed for the raid. (Pain Rating 4/10)

Attack on Stormreach I - May be completed with/without a party. Good XP. Requires party members to have done previous quests in chain to even be able to enter later quests, which can be a nuisance. (Pain Rating 3/10)

Attack on Stormreach II - May be completed with/without a party. Great XP. Undermine can be painful and slow if not handled well. (Pain Rating 4/10)

Gianthold - Decent XP. Cannot be solo'd effectively. Crucible relies mainly on a single character normally to complete the quest, but needs others around. Tor requires a party to complete and flag for the raid. (Pain Rating 6/10)

Necro IV - Flagging process is long though may be done solo. Litany bosses, specifically Cholthulzz, can be excruciating painful without certain builds or items. Excellent experience out of the quests. Though Fleshmaker's Lab requires multiple players, or a good hireling. Not going to touch the raid for now. (Pain Rating 5/10)

Harbinger of Madness - May be completed with/without party. Decent Experience. Directions are straightforward. (Pain Rating 2/10)

Vale - Flagging can be solo'd. Good XP. Coalescence Chamber can be frustrating with the jumping physics. Everyone will runs this chain. (Pain Rating 2/10)

Web of Chaos - Still somewhat new so going to leave this one alone. (Pain Rating ?/10)

Reign of Madness - Cannot Comment effectively on this chain, but assuming the lack of good or bad comments it seems to be a reasonable chain. (Pain Rating 4/10)

Reaver's Refuge - Can be solo'd. Excellent XP. Must spend extra time collecting certain items outside of quests to flag. (Pain Rating 3/10)

Inspiration Quarter - Can be solo'd. Decent XP. Must complete specific quests before accessing further quests in chain. (Pain Rating 4/10)

Dreaming Dark - Can be solo'd. Great XP. Must complete Eye of the Titan before accessing further quests in chain. (Pain Rating 3/10)

Shavarath - Requires party to flag. Mostly Decent XP. Dungeon Alert issues with two of the quests make flagging on higher difficulties frustrating. (Pain Rating 5/10)

Secrets of the Artificers - May be completed with/without party. Low XP. Fairly straight forward. (Pain Rating 4/10)


Anything I rated greater than 5 could probably be considered for a some reworking. Though, these ratings are all just my opinion of course.

A few stand out mechanics that can be frustrating...
* Allowing unintentional Quest Chain resetting.
* Preventing players from entering a quest due to not completing a prior quest in chain for first time even if party is on the quest in question. (Exceptions are raids of course.)
* Heavy party member requirements/reliance.
* Easily disposable or innocuous required collectibles for flagging.
* Hard to follow maps

[Isolani]

Just came back to the game recently after a bit of a break and started up an artificer TR. Ran most of the chains. Skipped Threnal because it is awful. But I found necro IV to be a pain now too. Fleshmakers is horrible with the air elementals being back to their old ridiculous selves. Fleshmakers was an ok xp run with the weak air elementals, but now it is infuriating to do this solo + hireling. I don't mind the knockdown, which has a save, but getting constantly thrown off the catwalks by the no save knockback just makes me want to take a sledgehammer to my pc.

Then when you clear the elementals and have a short time window to get your hireling to help you light runes, you have to fight with your hireling's horrible AI...like when you tell them to activate a rune and for some reason they run off in the wrong direction then just stop and stand there. Or it will run up to the rune and then tell you it's too far away to activate. And by the time you actually get the hireling to do something, the elementals have respawned.

Also, the 4 random sigil pieces are harder to find now, since I seem to find the quest specific one almost every time I run these now. I did 8 temple of Vol runs and got 8 of the Vol sigil pieces for instance...that makes it pretty freakin hard to get the random ones. I had to ransack GoP, Vol, Fleshamakers, and then got the 1 random piece I needed on my 4th Inferno run. Not looking forward to doing this again next life. I wish they would just add a chance for these to appear in the completion reward list or something. I may just skip litany flagging next life, no way I'm running 25+ quests just to get 1 sigil piece again.

They have added that crafting thing to Necro IV now, would it really have been that hard to put in a recipe to let us exchange 2 or 3 of a sigil piece for 1 of a different one. Because having 8 temple of vol sigil pieces and zero of the center frame piece isn't really helping me.

Anyway, Necro IV isn't the worst, but it isn't one of my favorites anymore either. I thought I read in an update note that they had changed the drops for necro IV chests, but if anything, litany flagging seems worse than ever to me. I never had to do that many quests for 1 piece before.