Un-Nerf Vorpal

[macubrae]

A vorpal confirmed with another 20 works like it used to against non-purple/reds.

If less then 1000HP, a confirmed vorpal kills.

If more then 1000HP, a confirmed vorpal does 10% of HP damage. Against an enemy with 1001HP it would do 100 damage, 2000HP/200dmg, 5000HP/500dmg, etc, etc...

As the fight goes on each vorpal will do less damage then the previous, until the enemy is under 1000HP. Even if you are on a crit-streak, chances are that some people will never see a double 20 insta-kill. But if it happens at the right moment, it'll be a high5 occasion.

That's my 2cp

[Rodasch]

Because low ML vorpals are easy to come by and removing the HP cap would make vorpals the go to weapon in epics, I think there should be tiers of vorpals. The tiers could be tied to the ML or the + of the weapon, with the higher the tier the higher the HP cap would be.

What's the difference between vorpals in epics and every melee weilding terror or tharaak wraps? The difference is vorpal goes off less. So you can't use "the go to weapon in epics" argument, it rings hollow.

[R0cksteady]

Naw, keep melees useless! A couple years ago it was annoying how I'd have to choose between characters. Now I can just leave my Melees on a shelf and play my casters and Divines.

It sucks to see all that wasted epic gear and TR lives on my melees, but hey, I have less to think about when I log on and can just pass by the useless melees.

[Talias006]

Naw, keep melees useless! A couple years ago it was annoying how I'd have to choose between characters. Now I can just leave my Melees on a shelf and play my casters and Divines.

It sucks to see all that wasted epic gear and TR lives on my melees, but hey, I have less to think about when I log on and can just pass by the useless melees.

Either this response is close to the reason why we need a melee pass....
Or, I failed my Sarcasm Check (DC: OMG!)

[R0cksteady]

Either this response is close to the reason why we need a melee pass....
Or, I failed my Sarcasm Check (DC: OMG!)

Melee pass? What more do we want for Melees?

I mean already they have the ability to distract enemies while casters kill them, and take up divine SP so they can't use their full potential in battles. What more can we ask for?

[Talias006]

Trying to keep from laughing to myself while reading your posts is increasingly difficult.

Maybe, have them be more than a sponge for Divine's SP and a stalling tactic for Arcane's killing stroke?

What form would this take?

I'm not entirely certain I want to figure something out that will most likely cause me to lol later.

[fco-karatekid]

What is that? I'm a 2nd edition player.

Coup de grac would work to, give it like a 15 second cooldown where you can wind-up a big swing on a helpless target that'll give you a very high chance of a one-shot. The cooldown will prevent from being over-powered.

And that 'no opportunity cost" garbage is exactly that . . . garbage. There are more than enough shrines in 99% of the quests to never need to worry about running out of SP.

Why 15 secs or 30 secs. I think it needs to be like my ranger's manyshot that everyone thinks it just fine - 2 minute cooldown. Good for the goose...

[fco-karatekid]

Naw, keep melees useless! A couple years ago it was annoying how I'd have to choose between characters. Now I can just leave my Melees on a shelf and play my casters and Divines.

It sucks to see all that wasted epic gear and TR lives on my melees, but hey, I have less to think about when I log on and can just pass by the useless melees.

I almost agree with this one - exception being my monk builds - those are an absolute blast. With any other melee, however, I totally agree.

[voodoogroves]

Why 15 secs or 30 secs. I think it needs to be like my ranger's manyshot that everyone thinks it just fine - 2 minute cooldown. Good for the goose...

In PNP you can use it every round.

A common 3.5 power gamer option for a low-level cleric was the combination of Hold Person one round, and a Scythe w/ Coup de Grace next (or by the other party members). Auto-hit, auto-critical on a x4 multiplier weapon ... no proficiency necessary ... tasty cheese.

[Sidewaysgts86]

Heck id be happy to have vorpal drop off x% of a mobs *Current* hp. This imo would keep vorpal a powerful tool against trash mobs with ridiculously high hp, while still giving us a reason to pull out our higher "dps" weapons.

[~Quilny]

with the increase to the DC of terror, and the monk wraps working just fine on 1k+ hp people, please UnNerf Vorpal. it's not over powered, it's not faster than a Finger of death/wail/power word kill/etc.

more often than not, most trash mobs are dps downed long before vorpal hits currently, it's an absolute waste. pending that is if melee even get in range to hit the mob due to finger, wail, implosion, destruction, power word kill, etc etc.

I ran epic Devil's assault earlier tonight on my ranger, 2 PM's in the group so it often looked like (at least to me) that my weapons were casting finger of death anytime I got close to a mob.

Casters get a no cap insta kill effect, why can't melee?

I used to /sign posts like this because I felt bad for melee however now have done serveral melee lives and DANG they are OP high DR and AC and HP UMD to self heal CRAZY op and no Blue bar to worry about. Casters have limited dps melee unlimited. Having said all that it takes skill to play casters so i still feel bad for melees

/signed

[FuzzyDuck81]

/signed

Vorpals used to be great, now they're ok but nothing all that special. My suggestion would be to have vorpal weapons do either 2d6 slicing/bleeding damage on every hit (putting it on a level with vicious but without the drawback of self-harming), OR (if possible) make it expand the crit range by 1, eg a vorpal greatsword would now crit on 18-20 or 16-20 with imp crit. Either would add a nice boost to the effect as well as keepin with the flavour of vorpal weapons being super-duper sharp.

[Ninety]

Many great suggestions here, turbine care to voice an opinion?

[kilagan800]

I just bought my first vorpal weapon for a melee alt -- it's my first because I'm always playing those pesky palemasters, and I agree with the op. I would like to see it create more damage and even a special effect would be nice to see.

Also, the description says it can chop off an enemy's head, (if it has a body). That'll be a great finishing move. I realize turbine would have to come up with all new animations. If not, then why even add that little tid-bit in the description in the first place?

[Talias006]

Animation-wise, there is already an effect that happens whenever the vorpal goes off.

Unfortunately, Vorpal shares the bluish glowing with Destruction and Improved Destruction effects.

[kilagan800]

Animation-wise, there is already an effect that happens whenever the vorpal goes off.

Unfortunately, Vorpal shares the bluish glowing with Destruction and Improved Destruction effects.

Ahh, must not have noticed.

It's my understanding that vorpal and destruction are the same. Doesn't the description for destruction weapons say that they have a vorpal effect?

[Talias006]

Nope, Destruction weapons are more akin to Sunder being put into a weapon effect.

You can take off 1 AC and 1% fortification per hit, up to 4 AC and 4% fortification on Destruction weapons.

With Improved Destruction weapons it's 2 AC and 2% fortification per hit, and up to 8 AC and 8% fortification.

The Destruction spell, is a kill effect like vorpal, though.

edit: Some clarification links.

Destruction as weapon enhancement

Destruction as Spell

[dng242]

[QUOTE=Avidus idea would amazing. adding a 4d6 damage untyped/bane damage would be nice.[/QUOTE]

I would go with the higher threashold (e.g. 5000 hp or whatever) that would make a viable, but different choice from the others.

[Sgt_Hart]

Isn't it time to kindly take vorpal's dangly bits out of the jar, and give it back to vorpal?

Honestly, the Nonsense about Under X many hit points needs to go.

1. Must have a head / be susceptible to decapitation.
2. Must roll a Natural 20
3. Must confirm critical (Roll another 1d20 and be within critical range values)
4. Must have under 1K HP (This is Turbines invention.)

Really?

1. Must be driving a car.
2. Must be exceeding 35 MPH
3. Must hit intended victim.
4. Must fishtail and hit intended victim with the rear quarterpanels only?

Am I nut's, or is this Nonsense?




I understand the intent to make it behave like all those other special On-a-20 effects.. but unlike banishing, Smiting, Disruption, ect... Vorpal Does Not Deal Additional Damage On Every Hit.


Come on turbine, Vorpal shouldn't be a Eunuch.

[Chai]

We need some old 3.0E epic feats in the game that melee can build for that put them on par with casters. No need to reinvent the wheel here folks - they already exist and would just need to be adjusted to fit DDO.

Devistating critical. On crit save or die. DC = attack roll -vs- mobs discipline check. I played on a NWN server that nerfed this feat to "knockdown + blind + deaf" for a number of rounds.

Epic dodge. First attack in each round that would have landed is ignored - /automiss.

Divine Shield. Up to 20 points of dodge AC. Cleric / paladin / divine champion (champion of torm etc) feat.

The requirements on most of these were crazy. They would have to be adjusted as well to fit into the numerical DDO balance scale.

The list goes on.