Improve Adventure Pack Information

[ChrisInSeattle]

Hello. I hope I'm posting this in the correct forum.

I've only been playing DDO for about six months. I originally signed up because so much of the game was free to play, and then became hooked.

Lately, however, I'm growing frustrated at some of the adventure packs, specifically those that require keeping a person or creature alive to finish an adventure. I cannot tell you emphatically enough how much I hate that. For instance, I just spent 90 minutes traipsing through an adventure in the Vale of Twilight that was going really well, until I had to keep some dude alive. 30 seconds later, the adventure has failed and I'll have to start over again. Had I known this, I wouldn't have purchased the Vale of Twilight. (Or Threnal, or Necropolis 3.)

I could go to the Wiki and find out everything about an adventure pack before I buy it, but that ruins half the fun. I also tend to hate adventures where I essentially have to follow a "walk through" to complete it for the same reason.

It would be really great if there were some basics listed in the DDO store when purchasing adventure packs. Like, "requires a strength of 22" or "requires protecting NPCs." Even better would be to make some of this stuff optional, then reduce the experience points received if those options aren't completely, but I realize I can't have everything.

Since DDO is an online game, and I can't "return" it, I feel like I've wasted a decent amount of time, energy and money on parts of it I don't like and won't ever return to with different characters. This makes me hesitant to spend more money on the game in the future.

Don't get me wrong - 90% of this game is freakin' fantastic! I haven't enjoyed a video game so much since the Baldur's Gate series. But man, I really hate spending hours toiling away to have everything ruined by a bad, computer-generated savings throw. It sucks

[somenewnoob]

Well, in all honesty, the Vale is probably the best bang for the buck adventure pack in the game....PERIOD with greensteel.

You could always go to the wiki and do some research, just dont scroll down too far and get spoilers. I always run a quest first time with zero spoilers (resulting in much death and cursing generally) so I feel your pain about not knowing stuff.

I was almost finished with Jungle of Khyber......until i got to the int runes! Almost finished with one in Deleras.......Until I needed somebod to pull a lever!

Here's a good link:

http://ddowiki.com/page/Quests_by_Ad...level_range%29

Just try not to look at the map (the right hand over eye trick works well!)

And you'll see:

What to Expect

Traps (fixed, disarmable)
Protect an NPC (mandatory)
Spawning/respawning monsters
Puzzle (mandatory: puzzle wheels)
Quest failure (if the Spider Queen dies)
Quest failure (if more than 4 spiders are killed after the first journal is picked up)

Things like that.

[Flavilandile]

ok, I agree that the description I've seen of the adventure packs is lacking some informations.
And that adding them would be interesting.

Now while Coyle ( Eastern 3 person you have to protect, Threnal Adventure pack ) is renowned all over DDO for his ability to die and everybody, including myself, want to strangle him with his own intestine, the chracter you have to protect in Ritual Sacrifice ( Vale of Twillight, Vale of Twillight Adventure Pack ) is more than able to survive by himself... as long as you are able to scroll cast him a heal from time to time and you are able to aggro the end quest boss before he does.... that is if you solo it. If you do it in a party it's a non issue, I've never seen it die when doing the quest with a party... the only time I saw him die was when I soloed it, at level, with a rogue that failed 10 scroll heal in a row on him after he agroed the end quest boss.

[SisAmethyst]

ok, I agree that the description I've seen of the adventure packs is lacking some informations.
And that adding them would be interesting.

Now while Coyle ( Eastern 3 person you have to protect, Threnal Adventure pack ) is renowned all over DDO for his ability to die and everybody, including myself, want to strangle him with his own intestine, the chracter you have to protect in Ritual Sacrifice ( Vale of Twillight, Vale of Twillight Adventure Pack ) is more than able to survive by himself... as long as you are able to scroll cast him a heal from time to time and you are able to aggro the end quest boss before he does.... that is if you solo it. If you do it in a party it's a non issue, I've never seen it die when doing the quest with a party... the only time I saw him die was when I soloed it, at level, with a rogue that failed 10 scroll heal in a row on him after he agroed the end quest boss.

Yes, Coyle was a pain in the beginning but since you can put him to sleep...

Mhh, anyway I guess ChrisInSeattle was soloing this ... probably with a Hireling and the automatic occasional cure critical of those is usually more then enough to keep that guy in Ritual Sacrifice alive. You could even wipe a cure wand from time to time to keep him alive.
Just click on the guy before you open the door and then select the blue shield on the hireling to tell him to protect this target.
However if you only spend your time to watch his HP bar, you may indeed run in trouble because this guy is charging a little bit ahead if you are too slow. Also if he does more damage then you, he will get all the aggro and then indeed get down faster. So ensure that you have the aggro and kill the mobst faster and this guy and quest is painless.

[Zirun]

Yes, unfortunately they aren't very specific about what kind of quests are in each pack.

Ultimately, you'll need to find out before you buy. You can do that by asking people about the content or researching it somewhere like DDOWiki.

For future references, P2P quests that you have to prevent something from dying in order to complete include The Bookbinder Rescue (Sharn Syndicate), Guard Duty (Three-Barrel Cove) and The Last Stand (Red Fens), in addition to the ones in the packs you noted. As far as I know, those (in addition to Threnal and F2P quests like Faithful Departed) are the only quests where you have to protect an allied NPC from enemy attacks in order to complete. There are some like Let Sleeping Dust Lie (Vale of Twilight) and Slavers of the Shrieking Mines (Restless Isles) where you have to not kill certain enemies.

Since it's kind of unreasonable to have every possible quality of a quest pack that might annoy people listed in their description, there's nothing we or they can really do except to find out beforehand whether or not the pack has anything about it you wouldn't like.

And persevere! Ritual Sacrifice is doable solo with a healing hireling so long as you can buff the NPC and your hireling a bit and protect them from the air elementals. I know I was taken aback when I failed Ritual Sacrifice the first time on my Wizard, but then I took a hireling in and buffed the guy up a ton, and even though the hireling ended up dying because of permanent knockdown from air elementals, I haven't failed it since that first time!

[Kmnh]

I don't think I have ever seen that "keep Paetus alive" objective fail. He takes fairly good care of himself.

The spiders on sleeping dust, those have driven many people to ragequit.

[brian14]

Now while Coyle ( Eastern 3 person you have to protect, Threnal Adventure pack ) is renowned all over DDO for his ability to die and everybody, including myself, want to strangle him with his own intestine, the chracter you have to protect in Ritual Sacrifice ( Vale of Twillight, Vale of Twillight Adventure Pack ) is more than able to survive by himself... as long as you are able to scroll cast him a heal from time to time and you are able to aggro the end quest boss before he does.... that is if you solo it. If you do it in a party it's a non issue, I've never seen it die when doing the quest with a party... the only time I saw him die was when I soloed it, at level, with a rogue that failed 10 scroll heal in a row on him after he agroed the end quest boss.

I did Ritual Sacrifice at least 10 times, and saw Paetus die only once -- and it was with a party. Odd thing about that particular quest is if Paetus dies but you kill end boss, you still get the end chest -- just not the xp/flagging. Since people mostly run all Vale quests for end chest treasure, "Paetus dies" is almost never an issue.

[brian14]

The spiders on sleeping dust, those have driven many people to ragequit.

If you are wizard/sorc, use acid spells. Spiders are immune to acid.

If you are melee, use Acid weapon of (greater) giant bane. Minimal damage to spiders even if you hit them by accident.

If you are arcane archer, cast Imbue Acid Arrow and turn off Improved Precise Shot.

If you are divine caster, I am not sure. Spells that only affect evil? Spiders are not evil.

[DavionFuxa]

In some sense I think it might be a good idea to give a little bit more info but for those actually looking to experience the game with no idea of what to expect it would kind of suck to have any further information then the fact that your going to the Plane of Shavarth or the quest involves Pirates. That's part of the reason I see for them having such limited information, you don't know what to expect for the quests.

That said though, I think a better idea would be to improve the quests regarding protecting NPCs a bit. The NPCs themselves shouldn't be Chuck Norris but they should be more then capable of handling themselves a bit more then many of them do, or in quests like Let Sleeping Dust Lie it wouldn't hurt to have maybe a few more spiders you can kill before failing the quest.

[sweez]

I did Ritual Sacrifice at least 10 times, and saw Paetus die only once -- and it was with a party. Odd thing about that particular quest is if Paetus dies but you kill end boss, you still get the end chest -- just not the xp/flagging. Since people mostly run all Vale quests for end chest treasure, "Paetus dies" is almost never an issue.

Well, now that shroud drops vale mats as end-rewards there's no real reason to run vale quests once you're not getting xp for them

[Flavilandile]

If you are divine caster, I am not sure. Spells that only affect evil? Spiders are not evil.

Slay Living, Destruction, works fine on Ogres...
Greater Command too.
Otherwise stay behind and pike... Sadly for a divine there's not much choice in Sleeping Dust, so if the party can handle itself, piking is an option.

[sirgog]

ok, I agree that the description I've seen of the adventure packs is lacking some informations.
And that adding them would be interesting.

Now while Coyle ( Eastern 3 person you have to protect, Threnal Adventure pack ) is renowned all over DDO for his ability to die and everybody, including myself, want to strangle him with his own intestine, the chracter you have to protect in Ritual Sacrifice ( Vale of Twillight, Vale of Twillight Adventure Pack ) is more than able to survive by himself... as long as you are able to scroll cast him a heal from time to time and you are able to aggro the end quest boss before he does.... that is if you solo it. If you do it in a party it's a non issue, I've never seen it die when doing the quest with a party... the only time I saw him die was when I soloed it, at level, with a rogue that failed 10 scroll heal in a row on him after he agroed the end quest boss.

Paetus is actually fairly tough to keep alive solo (IMO the quest is more difficult on single-player Normal than on six-player Elite). He seems to get hit pretty hard by scaling, plus it takes you as the player longer to kill the mobs that are on him, and mobs split their initial attacks between 2 targets rather than 7 in a full group.

IMO friendly NPCs should keep their full HP when scaling kicks in. They should lose some offensive power, however.

[djl]

Coyle always hate you!

[AZgreentea]

I don't think I have ever seen that "keep Paetus alive" objective fail. He takes fairly good care of himself.

The spiders on sleeping dust, those have driven many people to ragequit.

When I was running that the first time on normal, I just assigned my cleric hireling to defend him, and I didnt have any issues. He gets a little zergy, but he also backs down too.

As a frequent solo with hirelings player, any objective with "Dont kill X number..." in it is guaranteed to make me skip it. I'm just glad Sleeping Dust is so popular to PUG.

[Aliss7]

Turbine now understands the hatred players generally have about the "keep xxx alive" type objective. I don't think moving forward, the newer packs will have any such rage inducing objective. There is actually this objective in the House C pack, but the npc is nigh indestructable if not impossible to kill.

[bigolbear]

On the subject of STAT RUNES: get rid, the nature of ddo has changed from a perfect party centric game. They were bad design to start with and theres no reason to keep them.

I dont mind them so much for optionals.

We hate coyle too. think your self lucky - hes a lot tougher than he was and now we can knock him out... oh and heal him.

i remember the days of 3 fighters sheild blocking coyle into a corner while the rest of the party handles the dungeon.


Im a firm beleiver that any character should be able to solo any quest (not raid). it may take inventiveness, it may take buying a hireling and it may be very dificult but it should be possible. Stat runes prevent this leading to upset customers.

Op, although in some respects i feel you have a legitimate complaint - in others I feel you just need to try harder, get better gear and adapt your tactics, this is not a dig at you, it will come with time and practice.

Protect the squishy npc quests are often troublesome - but can be done solo on any class with the right tactics and a hireling, The complaint about stat runes is totaly valid as there is no way at all for some characters to complete these quests(that you have paid for) without aid from others. Rather than placing a buyer beware warning, id prefer if these issues were dealt with.


Conversely the oposite is true some times.......

Ive soloed many a quest that claims to need atleast 2 or 4 people. and i mean solod - ie no hireling, on both mele and casters.

[Starp]

...For future references, P2P quests that you have to prevent something from dying in order to complete include The Bookbinder Rescue (Sharn Syndicate), Guard Duty (Three-Barrel Cove) and The Last Stand (Red Fens), in addition to the ones in the packs you noted. As far as I know, those (in addition to Threnal and F2P quests like Faithful Departed) are the only quests where you have to protect an allied NPC from enemy attacks in order to complete. There are some like Let Sleeping Dust Lie (Vale of Twilight) and Slavers of the Shrieking Mines (Restless Isles) where you have to not kill certain enemies.
...

Also, the plansecaller Leilla (sp?) in the Weapons Shipment has to be protected for roughly the first half of the quest.

[ChrisInSeattle]

I really appreciate the advice. I was running the quest as a Level 19 Wizard, and I'd assigned two separate cleric hirelings to protect Paetus. I'm more than willing to try again and change up my tactics. That is the fun of D&D to me, and DDO is the same in that respect.

I guess I phrased my actual objection poorly. My own beef is the "keep x alive" thing. Seems like others feel the same, but other people may hate the tile puzzles, or etc.

I guess I was thinking maybe a row of icons in the DDO Store adventure packs to let you know what skills are required to complete the quest. (Mandatory Keep Alive, Strength of a certain level, etc.) Just very basic mandatory requirements. But, as someone pointed out, even that might be too much information for some.