Does Pally DPS suck or is it just me?

[grodon9999]

I've hit the level 18 wall on my 36-point TR and it's my first pally. KoTC right now, done with vale so fighting a bunch of non-EOs right now and I must say . . .

her DPS sucks.

Sucks hard.

If her DPS sucked any harder it'd put it on the street corner and tell it to make me money.

I mean it was fine against EOs, but you don't fight that many EOs after Vale before Amrath. When streaking elites to get the most XP possible I've absolutely hit a wall at 18.

Don't get me wrong, the survivability is extremely nice with the great AC and saves, plus self healing that's saved her ass a lot. She's died 3 times in a life that's been nothing but complete maniacal zerging since she's hit Korthos.

But damage wise (against non-EOs at least) if she didn't have dual icy-burst +5/+3 WOP rapiers and good Greensteels she'd be absolutely piking.

And please keep in mind my point of reference . . . I do not have a single max-DPS-tard in my stable.

Excaulted Smites? these are a joke right? Sure it's cool WHEN you triple-proc a crit but all the other times it adds so little damage it's not worth pressing the button.

Divine sacrifice is good, very nice actually but that cooldown is too long to be of much use.

The Divine might activation time is so long I don’t bother to use. That is so stupid, it should be a fast boost like Power Surge.

Divine Favor and Zeal are good.

Is it really this bad?

[LeLoric]

Yeah it's pretty bad.

Full 20's get some advantages with an esos but that still only brings them up within view of the dps leaders and then really only on good/silver dr mobs.

Don't play a pally if you are looking to be a great dps char. Their advantages lie much more on the defensive mindset of things.

[grodon9999]

Yeah it's pretty bad.

Full 20's get some advantages with an esos but that still only brings them up within view of the dps leaders and then really only on good/silver dr mobs.

Nothing claiming to be a DPS build/PRE should require an ESOS or dual Chaos Blades to reach the level of not sucking.

I had suspected pally DPS was bad based on observation, aggro pulls, etc . . . but I had no idea it was this bad.

Don't play a pally if you are looking to be a great dps char. Their advantages lie much more on the defensive mindset of things.

Her layover at cap will be spent as a DOS but I will mess around with KoTC for a little just to see what it's like in a few raids.

This needs some serious love when the ENH pass happens, I'm surprised the pally fanbois aren't rioting in the streets.

[voodoogroves]

I'm struggling with a pall TR I've done on my cleric as well.

Hate the divine might timing. Hate the inconsistency of smites. I've got plenty of twink gear on him, but still feels really weak on the DPS.

If Divine Might were quicker to activate or lasted longer, I'd be a bigger fan.

EDIT: I'm leveling this dude to be Chimera'd out at cap - but the journey is kind of a pain. Luckily I have a guildy who just TR'd his cleric into a FVS, so at least I can ride his coattails as he zergs past.

[Sarisa]

Mine is "ok", but even with an eSoS, eAG, and eXuum, against most mobs I feel like a weak fighter. Smites are great, but limited and inconsistent.

I also HATE the Divine Might casting time and duration.

She's great as a survival character, nice being able to switch stances and equipment and gain 20-30 AC, and it's nice to be able to be able to get epic traps, lead in eVoN6, and backup scroll as needed. As DPS, though, I started really noticing the loss at level 18 or so, when Fighters and Barbs get their more powerful tier 3 PrE's.

[Cyr]

Nod, I am dreading my next life (pali) on my main.

I think the only way I can bear it is to go deep splash.

[grodon9999]

Nod, I am dreading my next life (pali) on my main.

I think the only way I can bear it is to go deep splash.

6 fighter levels looks nice, or even 7 rogue levels for full UMD and sneak attack. Some haste boosts and possibly tactical feats would go a long way.

Yeah, deep splash or LR+5 hearts looks like the way to go to get that pally PL

. . . As DPS, though, I started really noticing the loss at level 18 or so, when Fighters and Barbs get their more powerful tier 3 PrE's.

Ah . . . so this "level 18 wall" is real and I'm not imagining it.

[Sarisa]

Ah . . . so this "level 18 wall" is real and I'm not imagining it.

From level 10 to 17, I was holding my own fairly well with either an SoS or a LitII Greataxe against the fighters and barbs in my parties. I could take an hold aggro if I wanted to, or lean back and let them. Once we all hit 18, there was no contest. The Fighters and Barbs wiped the floor with me.

[Aaxeyu]

Yeah, paladins have **** DPS.
They really need a add a PrE that gives alot of dps against all targets and merge hotd with Kotc.

[Absolute-Omniscience]

Yeah, paladins have **** DPS.
They really need a add a PrE that gives alot of dps against all targets and merge hotd with Kotc.

This pretty much.
It's sad to say that a kotc (specialist against evil outsiders) deal less damage against EOs than Fighters, barbs, rogues, and artis. Probably less than rangers as well, but can't say that with certainty.
And when it comes to non-EOs it's just rediculous how bad their DPS is compared to all other melee classes (and ranged for that matter).

They need to merge *all* the benefits of kotc with *all* the benefits of hot, *and* change the kotc against EO to work on *all* enemy types. Then they'd at least be decent, still terrible DPS, though.

[grodon9999]

. . .Probably less than rangers as well, but can't say that with certainty.

This toon was a ranger in her previous lives . . . there is no probably about it, tempest pwns KoTC.

[Culver.Civello]

Awww... This makes me kind of sad, because I was looking to TR into a paladin next life. >.> Though I was thinking of just tossing in 2monk, and using my fist. I do have 2 monk past lifes, so I will have +2damage. Will that make a difference?

[elraido]

Get out of KotC. Since you are 18 just go straight to DoS. How much base damage are you doing?

[AylinIsAwesome]

Yeah, paladins have **** DPS.
They really need a add a PrE that gives alot of dps against all targets and merge hotd with Kotc.

Now this I could get behind!

[CanuckWisdom]

I was gonna suggest DoS too.

And I agree that divine might is annoying because of the cast time and short duration, however, complaining about DPS when actively leaving possibly 6 damage(x1.8) per hit off yourself?

I'd love it if DM was made longer lasting or quicker casting, but the opportunity for it is when you moving from one baddy to another, as it doesnt slow run speed like your spells do.

...now Im kinda worried about getting to 18 on my guy haha. Almost 16, holding at 14. This is my second pally life, but compared to the 6 additional build points that I have now it is not a good guideline.

[Meat-Head]

I was gonna suggest DoS too.

And I agree that divine might is annoying because of the cast time and short duration, however, complaining about DPS when actively leaving possibly 6 damage(x1.8) per hit off yourself?

I'd love it if DM was made longer lasting or quicker casting, but the opportunity for it is when you moving from one baddy to another, as it doesnt slow run speed like your spells do.

Uh.. THIS. If you're not using DM on a pally, ESPECIALLY when TWF, then you are doing it wrong.

That being said, DM needs to have much faster cast time. Also, they need a lot of buffs in general. Smites should be auto-crit for one. They should also regen a lot faster-- esp on KoTC.

I think we'll see some love this summer though. Probably gonna make a big difference.

[elraido]

I don't have a huge issue with DPS on my main. While it isn't the uber of the uber, I am doing roughly 60 base damage on each swing against a "normal" mob. You have to use Divine Might as well. That is basically a must....8 more damage per swing is roughly the same as +16 to you your str (minus the to hit). And that number is also factored into your crit multiplier, as is divine favor. That is 11 total between those two spells. Personally, I gave up on huge DPS numbers on my paladin. I knew it was never going to reach barb/fighters with ESoS, so I concentrated on other aspects that a Paladin shines at (AC, UMD, aggro, DR etc).

[karl_k0ch]

It sucks.

Everytime I run and EDA with my TWF Khopesh KotC, I am embarrassed about his kill count. Oh, yes, and I do use DM, Smite and Divine Sacrifice.
Only having a level 14 AA Ranger prevents him to be the least favorite of my toons.

[Carpone]

Excaulted Smites? these are a joke right? Sure it's cool WHEN you triple-proc a crit but all the other times it adds so little damage it's not worth pressing the button.

Divine sacrifice is good, very nice actually but that cooldown is too long to be of much use.

The Divine might activation time is so long I don’t bother to use. That is so stupid, it should be a fast boost like Power Surge.

Divine Favor and Zeal are good.

Is it really this bad?

I share your opinions. Yes, it's really that bad.

I'm currently leveling up my 3rd life 18 Paladin/2 Fighter (eLOB tank). Survivability for the past 17 levels has been off the charts (I never want to level a melee that can't self-heal again), but DPS is terribad even with best-at-level items like SoS and triple positive maul. My only saving grace is TRing with two FvS, so they run ahead and zerg while I clean up anything that didn't die to Blade Barrier.

This needs some serious love when the ENH pass happens, I'm surprised the pally fanbois aren't rioting in the streets.

Didn't Junts quit DDO?

[DragonMageT]

Funny you should bring that up.

Was just discussing this with another long time player yesterday. I haven't played one in recent years.

Back in the day...Paladins really and I mean really sucked at DPS, bottom of the barrel.
I remember when it was hard for Paladins to get into Shroud runs.

2 Paladins in a group, BAM! closed to Paladins.

It tainted my opinion of Paladins and I can't play one now.
Loved playing them in PnP though.