lore item and conc. opp. questions

[XanimaX]

Hi

I am planning to TR my cleric into a cleric and I need advice and to clarify a few points. It will be a pure healer with obviously attack spell.

- does concordant opposition crafted on a weapon will stack with concordant opposition crafted on an accessory ?
- arcane lore increases critical for all spells, included cure and heal ?
- heal lore increases critical for cure spell and also heal spell ?
- heal lore and arcane lore doesnt stack, right ?
- does a item greater heal lore (9% crit, multiplier +0.25) stack with enhancement cleric prayer of life (9% crit) and cleric prayer of incredible life (multiplier 2.25) ? If so, shall it be 18% crit and multiplier 2.5 ?
- for lv 14, i have 2 armors, I can use : Parasitic Breastplate (http://ddowiki.com/page/Parasitic_Breastplate) or Fleshshaper Brigantine (http://ddowiki.com/page/Fleshshaper%27s_Brigandine). Which one should be more usefull till lv 16 (lv 16 armor is cove one) or more ? What should be crafted on it : 10 reflex save or arcane lore (6% crit, multiplier +0.25) ? maybe u have a better suggestion too. (my reflex save should be around 9 at lv 14)
- does nullification and void lore are so important (i m not using inflict wounds spell) ?

Ty in advance for ur help

[Kinerd]

-not sure
-yes
-yes
-yes
-yes
-Definitely the Fleshshaper's Brig: 10% heal amp for 30 SP is an outstanding trade. Definitely Arcane Lore: your Reflex save will be good enough for clericing without the +10, Lore soups up your Aura, Blades, Divine Punishments. You could also go Melodic Guard but between Aura and blocking I've found most trash to be pretty negligible danger on my cleric.
-The only times I ever use Harm on my cleric are to emergency heal PMs and to hurt Shroud portals. I guess I could carry a Nihil clicky for the second but... nah.

[GotSomeQuestions]

- does concordant opposition crafted on a weapon will stack with concordant opposition crafted on an accessory ?

At the moment, yes. Either or both can trigger off of the same hit, giving you twice as many sp procs, and the chance of a double sp proc. However, the temp hp will never go over 30 (although it will refresh to 30 twice as often). Also, devs have stated that they may (someday) fix this to not stack.

[XanimaX]

At the moment, yes. Either or both can trigger off of the same hit, giving you twice as many sp procs, and the chance of a double sp proc. However, the temp hp will never go over 30 (although it will refresh to 30 twice as often). Also, devs have stated that they may (someday) fix this to not stack.

so i ll not spend 2 shard for this.. ty for tip

[XanimaX]

-not sure
-yes
-yes
-yes
-yes
-Definitely the Fleshshaper's Brig: 10% heal amp for 30 SP is an outstanding trade. Definitely Arcane Lore: your Reflex save will be good enough for clericing without the +10, Lore soups up your Aura, Blades, Divine Punishments. You could also go Melodic Guard but between Aura and blocking I've found most trash to be pretty negligible danger on my cleric.
-The only times I ever use Harm on my cleric are to emergency heal PMs and to hurt Shroud portals. I guess I could carry a Nihil clicky for the second but... nah.

short answer, clear answer and wise ty

[XanimaX]

-not sure
-yes
-yes
-yes
-yes
-Definitely the Fleshshaper's Brig: 10% heal amp for 30 SP is an outstanding trade. Definitely Arcane Lore: your Reflex save will be good enough for clericing without the +10, Lore soups up your Aura, Blades, Divine Punishments. You could also go Melodic Guard but between Aura and blocking I've found most trash to be pretty negligible danger on my cleric.
-The only times I ever use Harm on my cleric are to emergency heal PMs and to hurt Shroud portals. I guess I could carry a Nihil clicky for the second but... nah.

i need more advice

[ArcaneMelee]

i need more advice

Don't give the hooker your wallet. Trust me on this.

[Isharah]

Hi
- does concordant opposition crafted on a weapon will stack with concordant opposition crafted on an accessory ?

Tested this in-game last night.

Torc = ~12% proc rate
Torc + conc opp goggles = ~25% proc rate
Torc + conc opp goggles + conc opp weapon = ~26% proc rate

Around 40-50 data points per test. Used dogs in vale.

So conc opp on an accessory and weapon probably don't stack, but the torc effect and a conc opp effect do.

Edit: Will repeat test with better resolution later, if i remember. :P

[Cardtrick]

Torc = ~12% proc rate
Torc + conc opp goggles = ~25% proc rate
Torc + conc opp goggles + conc opp weapon = ~26% proc rate

I think your torc + conc opp item rate is too high . . . I know conc opp doesn't proc as frequently as torc, and those numbers would imply that it's actually slightly more frequent. There's either some weird luck, a problem with your testing method, or (possibly) a recent change.

[Jaid314]

Used dogs in vale.

psh. you call that a test???

vale rats is where it's at. lab dogs are for retrieving stuff. lab rats are for experimenting with.

i dunno where you people get these crazy ideas.

(seriously, your proc rate looks *way* high compared to what it should be... torc is estimated around 10%, conc op is estimated around 4% last i heard).

[Isharah]

(seriously, your proc rate looks *way* high compared to what it should be... torc is estimated around 10%, conc op is estimated around 4% last i heard).

Definitely not 4% for conc opp.

Best way to find out is to try it out yourselves.

[Cardtrick]

Definitely not 4% for conc opp.

Best way to find out is to try it out yourselves.

4% seems to match my experience, and I'm pretty sure I remember some dev posts confirming that that's the actual number. Do you think it's higher or lower? I could see it being 5%, but no way is it as high as 10%.

[Matuse]

Tested this in-game last night.

Torc = ~12% proc rate
Torc + conc opp goggles = ~25% proc rate
Torc + conc opp goggles + conc opp weapon = ~26% proc rate

Around 40-50 data points per test. Used dogs in vale.

So conc opp on an accessory and weapon probably don't stack, but the torc effect and a conc opp effect do.

This is not the way to test it. It's been proven (via seeing a conc-opp weapon and accessory proc on the same hit) that these stack. Both are known to stack with the Torc.

The thing is, the weapon/accessory stacking is a KNOWN BUG. It could be fixed by the devs at any time with no warning. I would not grow to rely on it, or really even bother using it at all unless you are swimming in larges.

[Isharah]

Again, I tried it in-game with the info that I provided; I didn't just jot down random numbers.

If someone else has the patience and means to do the same, please post your findings in this thread.

We all know that things in DDO don't always work out as they're supposed to.

[MattiG]

Ishy, you could be totally right, but the sample size is a bit low.

Just sayin.... http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=354768

[Isharah]

Ishy, you could be totally right, but the sample size is a bit low.

Just sayin.... http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=354768

Why would I bother?

Obviously I am wrong since everyone here says so, even the devs say so, and I am proven wrong by known facts.

So, accessory and weapon stack, and my proc count on 200 hits is more than 150% off the actual rate.

Cheers.

[Madryoch]

This is not the way to test it. It's been proven (via seeing a conc-opp weapon and accessory proc on the same hit) that these stack. Both are known to stack with the Torc.

The thing is, the weapon/accessory stacking is a KNOWN BUG. It could be fixed by the devs at any time with no warning. I would not grow to rely on it, or really even bother using it at all unless you are swimming in larges.

This is one of the posts i ve been ranting about in other posts of mine ... of people reading something somewhere and blindly following it ...

I guess your ''known facts'' knowledge explains this video too ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n33sAMpCZZs

I know it was from a previous update and it has been ''fixed''

But are you sure u weren't thinking that way before as well when this video came out ?

Why would it make u surprised if they INDEED ''fixed'' the ''weapon/accessory'' bug ??

Have you ran tests and u know since last update? Or do u happen to know someone who DID run tests and since u can ''trust him with ur life'' u can tell that it is so?And yes the proc rate taken from almost 300 hits as sample won't give u as good a reading as 5k yet it won't give u 16% extra chance to proc translated in roughly 2.5 times the original (stacking result which is not even right since they are irrelevant occurences the torc and the conc op)

Test and print your results please.

The only thing i don't know for sure is if by any chance weapon and torc procs are considered same type and they don't stack in which case it would make sense if u put accessory and weapon to work but accessory + torc + weapon won't. I ll run tests...

[Kinerd]

If you saw 26% rate on 200 hits, that's a variance of 200*.26*.74, for a standard deviation of about 6.2. Your reading of 52 hits could therefore match any expected outcome from a little under 40 to a little over 64 without arousing suspicion. If we take Vanshilar's reading of 15% for the Torc and the suggested reading of 4% for each Con Opp, that adds up to 23%, or 46 hits.
-Your third measurement is consistent with 4% stacking Con Opp and 15% Torc.-

25% rate on 200 hits works out to a range of a little under 38 to a little over 62. 15% + 4% is 19%, or 38 hits.
-Your second measurement is consistent with 4% Con Opp and 15% Torc.-

12% rate on 200 hits: 15 to 33. 15% is 30 hits.
-Your first measurement is consistent with 15% Torc.-

[Badnade]

if you saw 26% rate on 200 hits, that's a variance of 200*.26*.74, for a standard deviation of about 6.2. Your reading of 52 hits could therefore match any expected outcome from a little under 40 to a little over 64 without arousing suspicion. If we take vanshilar's reading of 15% for the torc and the suggested reading of 4% for each con opp, that adds up to 23%, or 46 hits.
-your third measurement is consistent with 4% stacking con opp and 15% torc.-

25% rate on 200 hits works out to a range of a little under 38 to a little over 62. 15% + 4% is 19%, or 38 hits.
-your second measurement is consistent with 4% con opp and 15% torc.-

12% rate on 200 hits: 15 to 33. 15% is 30 hits.
-your first measurement is consistent with 15% torc.-

+1


whoops.. necro.. sorry

[Lonnbeimnech]

As far as 2 con opp items, you dont need to check for % of proc, you can clearly see in combat log when is procs twice on one hit.

As far as the level 14 armor, I would seriously consider getting blue dragon scale armor, it is far far easier to farm these days.

whoops.. necro.. sorry

D'oh!