Questions about FvS!

[lilleengen2]

So, I started a FvS a month ago or so.

I have to say, I have fallen in love with the class. I went with a caster-focused FvS with OKish STR so I could melee some. ( I solo a lot, so eh. )
But the thing is, I would like to know if Caster FvS can get a meaningfull DC at end-game?
For a more solo/duo/short-manning type, would for example FvS18/Mnk2 TWFer be a better option?
Is caster-focused FvS subpar compared to melee FvS?

I guess it's about what you like and all, but I would just like some general information about FvS' from someone a tad more experienced with the class than I am.

PS: I am an all Halfling-guy, so it might be a bit flavored

[TheDearLeader]

A Caster FvS is quite possibly one of the most versatile and powerful classes/builds in this game. I don't even have one, and I recognize this fact.

Like every other class, though, it depends on how you build it, gear it, and play it.

Personally, I *feel*:

• The splash is a bad idea. Capstone DR10 is amazing.
• AoV should naturally be included.
• Max Wisdom.
• A very tight "Feat" list - a Wiz TRed into FvS would be especially potent.
• Concordant Opposition, a Torc, and a High-Blocking-DR Shield are your best friends.
• Even though you *want* high DCs, a majority of their power seems to come from kiting through blade barriers for trash, and stacking Divine Punishment on bosses.

Last I checked, FvS melee DPS is far behind actual melee DPS - naturally, one could argue that the Melee FvS can also use Blade Barriers, and stacking Divine Punishment on bosses is still an option. While I technically agree, I see the Caster types often out-performing their Melee counterparts.

[Pape_27]

So <snip> flavored

I built a FvS like the one you have. The build is a Helf casting centered FvS with a fair str and maxxed wisdom.

I didnt want to give up melee altogether so I chose the fighter dilly in order to get access to martial weapons. While leveling I used a Xuum for the most part and still plan on making a LitII falchion one of these days. Xuum is a nice little chop-o-matic type weapon at low to mid levels (2d6 vs 2d4) and is easily found in the sands or on the ah for a reasonable price.

For the most part I use the dot and blade barrier supplemented by implosion and destruction. Because I didnt take spell focus evocation, Implosion is hit or miss, but when i get my wisdom over 40 (with yugo pots) it works fairly well in upper level content (amrath and the vale mostly, to qualify that statement). If i need to level the playing field a bit, I will use scrolls of symbol of death for a nice little area debuff (when possible).

Melee wise, the toon is mens-a-mens, but that has a lot to do with the dual weapons i usually have equipped - a minII long sword (+2 exc wis) and the cove dagger for arcane lore. If I run out or am low on sp, a swap to a falchion or terror. Using df/dp does help a bit with my hits.

Twf is tough to build into the toon if you go caster simply because you now have three to five main stats to deal with. Wisdom, Con, Str, Dex and to a limited extent Cha. You would be better off skipping that route imo. Using two or three feats for twf and really impact your ability to land spells (other than divine punishment and BB) in upper level content. While its not 100% effecient like a maxxed out caster's wail, having three or four mobs disappear from implosion is nice (oh so very nice) you really dont want to give that up imo.

[lilleengen2]

Thank you, this was the kind of answers I was looking for.

I have a couple more question, though: My stats are 12/10/14/8/18/12. ( First-life, Halfling. )
Does these stats seem OKish? Is minor melee worth 4 points into STR? ( Could bump CON to 16, for example. )
Also, would getting Falchion Prof or Great Sword Prof be worth it in such a feat-tight build?

[Pape_27]

Thank you, this was the kind of answers I was looking for.

I have a couple more question, though: My stats are 12/10/14/8/18/12. ( First-life, Halfling. )
Does these stats seem OKish? Is minor melee worth 4 points into STR? ( Could bump CON to 16, for example. )
Also, would getting Falchion Prof or Great Sword Prof be worth it in such a feat-tight build?

The stats seem fine to me. The 12 str is a little low for melee, but add a +2 tome, +6 item and maybe a +2 exceptional you are looking at standing 22. That can be boosted even further with yogo pots to 24 and even higher if you get something like Gloves of the Titans grip for a +6 stacking psionic boost to str for one minute.

As for the the gs or falchion prof, it depends on what you would have to give up feat wise. Since I dont know what your plan is, its hard to say.

[good_ole_corwin]

Because I didnt take spell focus evocation, Implosion is hit or miss

Eh, so your DC is 1 lower, big whoop. 5 percentage points difference does not a "reliable" into "hit or miss" make.

As for the question of high enough DCs, people tend to want 40+ DCs (some will say 41+, some even higher, but honestly, 1 or 2 points difference isnt something to commit suicide over) on their crowd controlling arcanes at endgame, so lets take a looksie at the FvS. Halfling makes it a tad more difficult because you wont have human adaptability, so, wis breakdown:

18 start + 5 lvl ups + 2 tome + 2 FvS enhancements + 6 item + 1 exceptional (GS weapon, ToD ring, Watchers blade, epic augment slot...) + 2 exceptional (GS weapon, ToD ring, epic time-sensing goggles, ...) + 2 yugo pots + 2 ship buffs = 40, getting any higher gets more difficult, +2 from house C alchemical crafting (even though is that really more difficult than GS? I need to start running those raids, somebody more familiar with the system could comment, curious myself) for a 42 total, +3 tome and Litany or +7 item for a 44 and the "holy **** Im so uber" combo of +4 tome, Litany and the +7 item for a 46, cant think of a way of getting any higher than that (I refuse to count store pots :-P). So lets count with the 40 which is reasonably available to people, thats a +15 mod.

DC: 10 base + 9 spell lvl with heighten + 15 wis + 2 greater focus item +2 AoV aura (-2 to mob saves, so the same as +2 to your DCs) = 38. If you put the effort in getting your wis to 42 (which still shouldnt be TOO difficult) youre getting to 39, wiz past life will get you to 40 and there you go if you want to reach the big 40 - but as I said, whether you have 38/39 or 40/41 is IMHO not a deal-breaker, especially since you have access to debuffs such as Prayer, neg lvls through symbol of death/energy drain...

Spell pen: 20 caster level (also a reason of why not to splash the monk) + 4 feats + 2 enhancement + 2 item (the goggles from House C are not difficult to obtain at all and give spell pen IX) = 28, effective 30 with your aura. I need to roll a 4 to get through the SR on barbazu in epic Devil Assault, which seems ok to me, but you can of course get higher if you want, wiz/FvS past lives, greater spell pen VIII from a sovereign DT rune...

TL;DR: Yes, caster specced FvSs can get relevant endgame DCs (and spell pen) with the right gear and maxed wisdom, especially if you can get a wiz past life (but even without one). Wizards can get there more easily, but the biggest issue is they have access to a wider range of CCing spells, FvS will basically only have 2 mass CC options - greater command and cometfall and perhaps more importantly, we lack persistent AoE dmg spells like firewall, ice storm, etc. that can be used to dispatch of those CCed enemies (you need stuff to be moving when using BBs). So soloing endgame/epics can be more difficult than uber-arcanes, but in a party with high-DPS melees you can supply the CC needed to make a quest run smooth and you bring so much more to the party as well.