New Challenge items

[Yan_PL]

They need the opposite greater resists on those...

Putting greater fire resist on a weapon that has a bunch of fire effects is pointless. You're not going to be using that weapon against fire-based critters, and cold-based critters aren't going to attack you with fire...

It should be:
2d12 base dmg
+5 enhancement
Flaming Burst
Brilliance
Metalline
Greater incineration
Magma Surge
Greater cold resistance

this. make it happen. make me smile.

[oradafu]

You know, I can't see why it's beyond the game technology to make this kind of reward item completely "players choice". They did seem to take that direction with the new raid crafting, you can make any base weapon and apply any tiers to it, right? So why go and limit these rewards to just four weapon types? Let us choose the element and the base, so you could make a dwarven axe of fire or water if desired, or hand wraps, or light maces, whatever.

I agree completely with giving more choices for players.

My acrobat is still a sad panda.

Exactly. The Calomel weapons should have included quarterstaves last time. I stated that before the update went live. Acrobats were the melees left out for that item, since other builds could switch to some other weapon with less penalties than Acrobats.

So I hear that new weapons were added and there's still no quarterstaff for Acrobats in this pack. And as HitFido stated, Dwavern Axes are always neglected in the updates.

[Voldomar]

So why go and limit these rewards to just four weapon types? Let us choose the element and the base, so you could make a dwarven axe of fire or water if desired, or hand wraps, or light maces, whatever.

Yes, please.
Common sense, devs.

They could even add prototype weapons from Master Artificer as an extra ingredient, in case you want a non-standard elemental weapon.
This gives more variety and more reasons to run MA ( witch are not much atm. Few run and you're set for a long time )

[barecm]

The bow is better then alchemical 3 earth really which is disappointing in my opinion.

So you think that....

+6 enhancement
Acid Burst
Greater Acid arrow (2-8 every two seconds)
Greater Stone Prison
Improved Destruction
Disintegrate
Greater Acid Resistance
Colorless Slot
Red Slot

is the same or better than?

3xEarth:

+6
Acid Burst
Greater Stone Prison
Earthgrab
Alchemical Con +2 (20hps)
Acid Blast
Disintergration
Acid Torrent
Red Slot

I admit that the challenge one is cool,very cool and relatively easy to make.... The addition of acid blast and acid torrent puts alchemical tier 3 above challenge tier 3.

[Aerendil]

Looking at that rapier....

So at T3 level 16, you could have:
+5 weapon, 1d6 damage, shocking burst (1d6 electric; 1d10 on crit), screaming (1d6 sonic), improved roaring (shaken; 2d6 sonic on crit), sirocco, and slicing winds (dmg DoT I presume). Plus a +3 craftable slot - unsure if this can be improved at all, but even at +3 that's enough to throw another effect on (flaming, frost, etc.) plus pure good.

So each hit you're looking at 1d6+5 +1d6 electric +1d6 sonic +1d6 random element from crafting +1d6 pure good.
On crits, which are frequent on a rapier, add in +1d10 electric and +2d6 sonic. Oh, and throw in +1d4 from force critical crafted.

That's a lot of combat spam.


Curious if that's worth it for a Tempest II character, or if the offhand 100% swing rate will be more beneficial to go with a Calomel weapon or that new Khopesh for the higher Crushing Wave proc chance. Hmm...


PS - for those curious, the khopesh now reads to have fire resistance on Llama; and the greataxe now has cold resistance. The rapier still shows lightning resist, and the bow acid resist :/

[Riggs]

They need the opposite greater resists on those...

Putting greater fire resist on a weapon that has a bunch of fire effects is pointless. You're not going to be using that weapon against fire-based critters, and cold-based critters aren't going to attack you with fire...

It should be:
2d12 base dmg
+5 enhancement
Flaming Burst
Brilliance
Metalline
Greater incineration
Magma Surge
Greater cold resistance

thematically it half makes sense, but only half.

You have a weapon enchanted to hold elemental fire - ergo it should also have the power to protect you from that same element (like the old rings of elemental command) - so with the power of fire you could walk into a fire and not get hurt etc.

However the weapon should ALSO give the opposite resist as well. If you are on fire - cold is not going to affect you as much as it would normally no? Even an elemental would/should have resistance to a certain amount of the opposite element - but the elemental would then get double damage that occurs over the resisted amount - once your threshold is passed, water/cold would/should affect a fire much greater after a critical mass, and same once a fire/heat gets past the amount needed to really affect a body of water/ice - it goes overboard.

So an air/earth weapon should have electric/acid resist, and cold/fire weapons cold/fire resist.

[Riggs]

And yeah being able to pick an element for your weapon of choice would be a lot nicer than being stuck on one. (The level 20 mage crafters making the weapons dont know how to put ice on an axe? or earth on a staff? sheesh)

Seriously - customization is what people want. Getting shafted into narrow choices that many people do not want is getting really old.

[danlan]

Another comparison

New greataxe versus epic xuum.

Assumptions both upgraded to +7, improved crit, seeker 10

assumed values for rare procs

Incineration: 2% 284 average dmg Greater incineration: 4% 284 average dmg

Magma Surge: 2% 120 average dmg

firega: 48.610+1.15*x

exuum: 45.13+1.5*x

once again x=additional dmg modifiers and 1.5 str mod

exuum will outdps the greataxe once x>10

Greataxe has more base dmg though and this favors both kensai and frenzied beserkers pushing the threshold a little higher but exuum will still fairly quickly bypass it.

Considering the rarity of exuum the fact that the two are even in the same ballpark is pretty bad please devs upgrade the exuum.

The fact that a crafting item is close the rarest epic two hander is so annoying!

[Faent]

Oh, and throw in +1d4 from force critical crafted. That's a lot of combat spam.

A rapier benefits more from Force Damage than Force Critical. If you slot Force Crit on this item, you've made a mistake. In fact, Force Damage beats Force Crit on ANY weapon. There is no good reason to slot Force Crit. This is also reflected in the ingredients you need. Force Crit ingredients are much more easily come by.

[sirio.gala]

2d8 base
+5 enhancement
icy burst
imp paralyzing
crushing wave (lists this twice actually)
Freezing Ice
Greater Cold Resistance


Sigh.
My E-chaosblade is crying.

[WruntJunior]

That khopesh and bow is delicious....and the rapier ain't bad. If only I could level my TR just doing level 20 challenges so I could make all of this stuff while capping 2 more times.

On the bright side, more and more stuff is coming out to make me only want epic chaos blades because of how awesome they look...and with the scroll change, I may see them soon!

[Yan_PL]

A rapier benefits more from Force Damage than Force Critical. If you slot Force Crit on this item, you've made a mistake. In fact, Force Damage beats Force Crit on ANY weapon. There is no good reason to slot Force Crit. This is also reflected in the ingredients you need. Force Crit ingredients are much more easily come by.

is that so? let's see, force crit is 1d4 on crit, averaging to 2.5
improved critical = 6/19 hits are critting. 6/19 * 2.5 = 15/19 < 1.

but now, assume we're having seeker +6 on something and exceptional seeker +2 and gloves, but we hit only on 9+.
if we miss on 8 or lower, but have +8 to confirm crits, suddenly half of our successful hits result in crits. 2.5*6/12 = 15/12.

Now, when we consider the fact that rapier is one of fav weapons of finesse dex builds, and you can't raise your dex as high as you can raise your str, question raises: are you able to hit with rapier on attack roll of 5? if so, go with force damage. if not, go with force critical and seeker stuff.

[LeLoric]

is that so? let's see, force crit is 1d4 on crit, averaging to 2.5
improved critical = 6/19 hits are critting. 6/19 * 2.5 = 15/19 < 1.

but now, assume we're having seeker +6 on something and exceptional seeker +2 and gloves, but we hit only on 9+.
if we miss on 8 or lower, but have +8 to confirm crits, suddenly half of our successful hits result in crits. 2.5*6/12 = 15/12.

Now, when we consider the fact that rapier is one of fav weapons of finesse dex builds, and you can't raise your dex as high as you can raise your str, question raises: are you able to hit with rapier on attack roll of 5? if so, go with force damage. if not, go with force critical and seeker stuff.

This is only true if you never progress past the 2nd swing. If you are missing on a 5 or lower for the first two swings you will only miss on a 1 for the 3rd and fourth.

[voodoogroves]

Force Critical is/was the hotness when things auto-crit ... but alas ... times gone by ...

[LordPiglet]

Force Critical is/was the hotness when things auto-crit ... but alas ... times gone by ...

My maiming rock splitters are still in my exploiters hot bar

[xveganrox]

Am I the only one who thinks the Khopesh looks sort of ridiculous? As someone who is pretty familiar with Improved Paralyzing on Midnight Greetings and the Spy Dagger, I can't help but find putting it on an easy-to-obtain "epic" weapon that uses a base weapon that is widely considered to be overpowered and even more widely considered to be the best one-handed weapon. Does the game really need another epic Khopesh? Up until now, at least you had to grind or run epics to get an alchemical/green steel/chaosblade/dynastic falcata (clearly I jest). I also sort of liked the exclusivity of Improved Paralyzing - up until now it wasn't really available for mainstream builds.

Also I find it odd that there's now a way to get epic tokens without having to deal with a timer. Maybe putting a timer on the epic challenges, like they are on real epics, would make sense.

Just my two cents. Haven't run the challenges a ton yet (haven't bought the pack), although I ran a few in Lamannia and wasn't particularly intrigued.

[Scraap]

Am I the only one who thinks the Khopesh looks sort of ridiculous? As someone who is pretty familiar with Improved Paralyzing on Midnight Greetings and the Spy Dagger, I can't help but find putting it on an easy-to-obtain "epic" weapon that uses a base weapon that is widely considered to be overpowered and even more widely considered to be the best one-handed weapon. Does the game really need another epic Khopesh? Up until now, at least you had to grind or run epics to get an alchemical/green steel/chaosblade/dynastic falcata (clearly I jest). I also sort of liked the exclusivity of Improved Paralyzing - up until now it wasn't really available for mainstream builds.

You're not alone in that, no. Matter of fact, aside from the odd named epic loot, I can't recall a single paralyzing weapon of any strength that's non-peircing before this, and now they're tossing it to folks in both epic and non-epic form while still leaving the other off the crafting list as they'd explicitly mentioned previously. But hey, not frothing at the mouth about it, so I guess that doesn't count as a valid complaint.

[LeLoric]

Am I the only one who thinks the Khopesh looks sort of ridiculous? As someone who is pretty familiar with Improved Paralyzing on Midnight Greetings and the Spy Dagger, I can't help but find putting it on an easy-to-obtain "epic" weapon that uses a base weapon that is widely considered to be overpowered and even more widely considered to be the best one-handed weapon. Does the game really need another epic Khopesh? Up until now, at least you had to grind or run epics to get an alchemical/green steel/chaosblade/dynastic falcata (clearly I jest). I also sort of liked the exclusivity of Improved Paralyzing - up until now it wasn't really available for mainstream builds.

Also I find it odd that there's now a way to get epic tokens without having to deal with a timer. Maybe putting a timer on the epic challenges, like they are on real epics, would make sense.

Just my two cents. Haven't run the challenges a ton yet (haven't bought the pack), although I ran a few in Lamannia and wasn't particularly intrigued.

I am ok with this just because it is an extremely low dps khopesh. It's way worse than a triple water shroud khopesh which I don't see people scrambling to make.

Freezing ice targets fort save which is kinda harsh not to mention you can give this to your good dps weapons with a tier one tunic.

I liken this to something similar to the epic whirlwind or sirroco. Weapons you would throw on if you need CC and the caster just isnt providing enough. He's not ready for the kind of content you are running or maybe just dc'd. Outside of that theres just not much reason to equip this thing.

[sirgog]

I am ok with this just because it is an extremely low dps khopesh. It's way worse than a triple water shroud khopesh which I don't see people scrambling to make.

Freezing ice targets fort save which is kinda harsh not to mention you can give this to your good dps weapons with a tier one tunic.

I liken this to something similar to the epic whirlwind or sirroco. Weapons you would throw on if you need CC and the caster just isnt providing enough. He's not ready for the kind of content you are running or maybe just dc'd. Outside of that theres just not much reason to equip this thing.

It's still much higher DPS than the other Improved Paralyzing weapons that are out there (except eMG on certain builds). Improved Paralyzing is outstanding when used against low Will save foes in Epics - even if they fail on a 2 and save on a 3 (and many foes in epics have Will saves of 22 or less), Improved Paralyzers are very potent.

This isn't a weapon for speedruns. It's a weapon for Epics where you aren't certain of success, which isn't rare in PUGs. In addition I'm seeing more melees swinging Cursespewing weapons (and spamming Imp Sunder) these days in Epics to assist medium DC casters in landing Wails - if something is Cursespewed or ImpCursespewed, Imp Paralyzing is even better.

[LeLoric]

It's still much higher DPS than the other Improved Paralyzing weapons that are out there (except eMG on certain builds). Improved Paralyzing is outstanding when used against low Will save foes in Epics - even if they fail on a 2 and save on a 3 (and many foes in epics have Will saves of 22 or less), Improved Paralyzers are very potent.

This isn't a weapon for speedruns. It's a weapon for Epics where you aren't certain of success, which isn't rare in PUGs. In addition I'm seeing more melees swinging Cursespewing weapons (and spamming Imp Sunder) these days in Epics to assist medium DC casters in landing Wails - if something is Cursespewed or ImpCursespewed, Imp Paralyzing is even better.

This is essentially what I said.

Imp paralyzing is nice but I'd rather have a sirroco or whirlwind for this type of job. Granted those are harder to get so they should be better.

For mob debuffing the new rapier is really nice with roaring and its a much higher dps weapon than this khopesh.