How much AC at each level to be near-unhittable?

[wax_on_wax_off]

Did VoN3 but Marut was being kited so I didn't get hit too much. I did get a little aggro but difficult to see in the heat of the moment if I was getting hit by grazing/glancing/regular hits. I've got a feeling you'd need 70+ AC for him.

51 AC in elite shadow crypt worked fine up until the boss fight with Nereza. Wasn't getting missed all the time as wraiths and what have you have massive high AB but it was often enough that with a little bit of movement I didn't have to heal while fighting but rather could just heal at the end.

Trolls in Gateway to Khyber need about the 53 AC sustainable that I can manage but with that I didn't get hit at all (until someone gave me red alert and I ended up fighting about 20 trolls that ended in a run back from Korthos).

[WruntJunior]

Did VoN3 but Marut was being kited so I didn't get hit too much. I did get a little aggro but difficult to see in the heat of the moment if I was getting hit by grazing/glancing/regular hits. I've got a feeling you'd need 70+ AC for him.

51 AC in elite shadow crypt worked fine up until the boss fight with Nereza. Wasn't getting missed all the time as wraiths and what have you have massive high AB but it was often enough that with a little bit of movement I didn't have to heal while fighting but rather could just heal at the end.

Trolls in Gateway to Khyber need about the 53 AC sustainable that I can manage but with that I didn't get hit at all (until someone gave me red alert and I ended up fighting about 20 trolls that ended in a run back from Korthos).

If it's like PnP, incorporeal undead ignore some types of ac. Therefore, your ac is effectively lower against them.

As far as everything else...with a 65 ac, I don't really get hit in anything before refuge hard and elites

[wax_on_wax_off]

If it's like PnP, incorporeal undead ignore some types of ac. Therefore, your ac is effectively lower against them.

As far as everything else...with a 65 ac, I don't really get hit in anything before refuge hard and elites

No, it's not like PnP. They didn't bother to go the extra mile to include the sort of mechanics you're talking about. They just got lazy and said that wraith etc have stupid high AB.

[Arsont]

Good to hear about your experience in Von3. Totally skipped Necro II this life, so can't speak to Nerezza, but found the trolls in Gateway to need around 60 AC once I would pull red alert, and even then was still getting pounded pretty well. Noticing the stupid high AB for some incorporeal mobs in Necro IV though (Namely in Vol), so I'm not sure what range you'd need for to cover all of that area.

What does your sustainable AC look like for GH? I'm just finishing it myself, and so far mid 60's AC is enough for pretty much everything on elite (Elite Madstone was probably the hardest, with the trolls and ogres. The Marilith in elite PoP couldn't touch me with 67). Could probably get away with 57-60 if you have Blur or something.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Good to hear about your experience in Von3. Totally skipped Necro II this life, so can't speak to Nerezza, but found the trolls in Gateway to need around 60 AC once I would pull red alert, and even then was still getting pounded pretty well. Noticing the stupid high AB for some incorporeal mobs in Necro IV though (Namely in Vol), so I'm not sure what range you'd need for to cover all of that area.

What does your sustainable AC look like for GH? I'm just finishing it myself, and so far mid 60's AC is enough for pretty much everything on elite (Elite Madstone was probably the hardest, with the trolls and ogres. The Marilith in elite PoP couldn't touch me with 67). Could probably get away with 57-60 if you have Blur or something.

I'm mostly leveling with a TR'd bard guildy so with IH at level 15 it'll put me at 60. No other gear that I know of available to increase my AC (it's a few posts back with a total of 56).

I'll have a decently high DC Stunning Fist (35+)/Blow (30+) and Improved Sunder (26+) as well so that will hopefully reduce incoming damage by killing things faster/disabling mobs.

At some stage I'll have to stop playing like a monk AC tank and start playing like a rogue. Not sure when that will happen.

In other news I ran elite Church and the Cult mostly solo. Nothing hits me of course until the boss. The boss didn't seem to hit me all that much, I think it was more his spells. I noticed I went from maximum to minimum health once or twice, maybe I just forgot to put deathward on and he was harming me or something.

Edit: I know I can get a Chattering Ring and I might run Titan once or twice as I'm flagged anyway and yet I've never run it.

[Moltier]

At lvl11, with 48AC on my stupid melee wizzy build i did into the deeps on elite.
Near perfect protection till the demon. There, I saw a few misses, but not much. Maybe 60AC is enough. After 1 minute fight, i accepted my fate.
I should have just kite him as a normal wizard. :P

[Arsont]

The demon in elite Deeps was probably as bad as the marut in Von 3. Think they both need about a 70 on elite. I'll go run elite Deeps later tonight on my main to check though.

EDIT:Just did a quick solo check of elite Deeps. Hard to tell exactly since I didn't have anyone to kite the adds, but it looks like 70 AC is indeed the mark for 95% miss. Between that and Blur, I could have probably sat there all day without really any healing.

[wax_on_wax_off]

So I noticed that Siren's Set from Fens has +2 insight bonus to AC so I was considering shifting gear around to fit it in.

Current plan for level 13:
Body: Garments of Equilibrium with +1 dodge AC ritual
Trinket: Greater Nimble Trinket (+1 dodge) or Pale Lavender Ioun Stone
Bracers: Chaosguarde (+2 dodge) (I'd love to swap these for Thaarak Hound Bracers but don't have pack
Belt: Sirens Belt (+5 armour, +2 insight)
Necklace: Sirens Charm (+4 con, +2 insight)
Goggles: Goggles of Battle Skill (+2 attack) with Medium Guild Augment slot (+15 HP) (+6 int goggles, +4 reflex goggles, 3*DW clickies, search, disable etc as swap ins)
Gloves: Brawling Gloves (12th)
Cloak: Mantle of the Worldshaper
Helm: Wise +6 helm or +6 seeker/+7 balance cove hat
Boots: Madstone Boots
Ring1: Dexterity +6 ring
Ring2: Protection +5

This gives +4 strength, +6 dexterity, +6 wisdom, +4 con
Items in red I don't have yet but can work on easily*

This will give:
10 base
+3 14 base wisdom +1 monk wisdom +1 greater adaptability: wisdom
+4 15 base dex +3 rogue dex
+6 +6 items on dex/wis
+2 insight sirens set
+2 dodge Chaosguard
+5 sirens belt
+4 natural AC from madstone rage (or +3 barkskin pot)
+5 deflection
+1 haste (pot)
+4 from ship buffs
+2 from dex/wis +2 tomes
+2 from water stance
+1 dodge nimble trinket
+1 monk AC (from level 2 monk)
+4 level 5 shield wand (95% activation chance and 80+ charges available)
=56 standing
+5 versatility: armour class
+6 improved uncanny dodge
=67 burst

Should work well. I've noticed that I can give up brawling gloves and instead use the Wrath of Kora Sell set. Gain AB but give up sneak attack. Probably worth while. See how we go.

Edit: *I now have the items listed in red.

So just did titan elite for BB. Talk about an experience. Anyway, pulled a chattering ring, you know.


New plan:
Body: Garments of Equilibrium with +1 dodge AC ritual
Trinket: Cove Trinket or Pale Lavender Ioun Stone
Bracers: Chaosguarde (+2 dodge) (I'd love to swap these for Thaarak Hound Bracers but don't have pack
Belt: Sirens Belt (+5 armour, +2 insight)
Necklace: Sirens Charm (+4 con, +2 insight)
Goggles: Goggles of Battle Skill (+2 attack) with Medium Guild Augment slot (+15 HP) (+6 int goggles, +4 reflex goggles, 3*DW clickies)
Gloves: Brawling Gloves (12th)
Cloak: Mantle of the Worldshaper or Protection +5
Helm: Wise +6 helm or +6 seeker/+7 balance cove hat (ML:15)
Boots: Madstone Boots
Ring1: Chattering Ring (+3 dodge, +13 spot, -10 move silently)
Ring2: Dexterity +6/Prot +5 ring

10 base
+3 14 base wisdom +1 monk wisdom +1 greater adaptability: wisdom
+4 15 base dex +2 rogue dex +1 adaptability: dexterity
+6 +6 items on dex/wis
+2 insight sirens set
+2 dodge Chaosguard
+5 sirens belt
+4 natural AC from madstone rage (or +3 barkskin pot)
+5 deflection
+1 haste (pot)
+4 from ship buffs
+2 from dex/wis +2 tomes
+2 from water stance
+1 dodge nimble trinket
+1 monk AC (from level 2 monk)
+4 level 5 shield wand (95% activation chance and 80+ charges available)
+3 dodge (chattering ring)
=59 standing self buffed
+4 IH (bard song level 15)
+1 barkskin (level 12 ranger)
+3 paladin aura
=67 raid buffed
+5 versatility: armour class
+6 improved uncanny dodge
=78 burst

I don't need adaptability: strength at the moment as fighter strength I (from fighter dilettante) is giving me an even strength score. Only way I could make use of a +1 would be if I had abishai set. I only have a +4 strength item but I have 10+ uses of DP on clickies and a roc cloak too for the +6.

I can have +5% XP and only lose 1 AC if I use a +5 prot ring as it only loses me 1 AC as +4 dex is on boots. Similarly, I can use a GFL ring and only lose 1 AC. With a friendly cleric/fvs/artificer I can have GFL and +5% xp and only lose 2 AC (for 57 total) with shield of faith cast on me.

[Bakarne]

Edit: I know I can get a Chattering Ring and I might run Titan once or twice as I'm flagged anyway and yet I've never run it.

4 days later...

So just did titan elite for BB. Talk about an experience. Anyway, pulled a chattering ring, you know.

I hope you realize how obscene this is.

During my TR, I've run Titan 6 times for the chance for the ring, and in half of our runs with 11 or more people the chest was a complete skunk. A rune arm in a run with no artificer. 4 Insulated Armors in a single run. 2 Shining Crescents in the other.

[wax_on_wax_off]

4 days later...



I hope you realize how obscene this is.

During my TR, I've run Titan 6 times for the chance for the ring, and in half of our runs with 11 or more people the chest was a complete skunk. A rune arm in a run with no artificer. 4 Insulated Armors in a single run. 2 Shining Crescents in the other.

What was worse is that 2 chattering rings dropped. To be fair I literally jumping out of my chair with joy when I saw it under my bard guildies name. I was going through all sorts of stress when he explained that he needed it for his next barb TR, I was like ***! Sif mess with me at a time like that ...

60 AC self buffed as long as I don't run out of shield wand charges again. Though recently I've swapped to earth stance when using my vampiric stonedusts for the stoneskin proc so only 57-58 (depending on haste). Basically capped on 13 now which means not to far off 15 and then I'll be keeping that bard around full time for the IH, I mean, I like to to have him around because I value him as a person?

[wax_on_wax_off]

Anyone know what Lailat's AB is in elite DQ1 and DQ2? I'm thinking of taking Acrobat II for knockdown immunity which would let me have 68 sustainable AC for 4 minutes self buffed. Could this work?

[sweez]

I know people used to intimitank her with ~70 a while back, not sure how much they were getting hit though.

[Zenako]

Anyone know what Lailat's AB is in elite DQ1 and DQ2? I'm thinking of taking Acrobat II for knockdown immunity which would let me have 68 sustainable AC for 4 minutes self buffed. Could this work?

Unless you have some serious DR going, the glancing/grazing hits on Elite will likely be an issue as they keep nicking you all the time.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Unless you have some serious DR going, the glancing/grazing hits on Elite will likely be an issue as they keep nicking you all the time.

That doesn't sound too bad, I'd hardly plan to do it without any healing, could certainly be entertaining.

[MrChipinator]

My rule of thumb is you do this equation: Quest Level: (15) x 2 + 30. For Elite/Hard I usually recommend either: Getting +7/4 AC and getting a Dusk/Blur effect.

[wax_on_wax_off]

So just did titan elite for BB. Talk about an experience. Anyway, pulled a chattering ring, you know.


New plan:
Body: Garments of Equilibrium with +1 dodge AC ritual
Trinket: Cove Trinket or Pale Lavender Ioun Stone
Bracers: Chaosguarde (+2 dodge) (I'd love to swap these for Thaarak Hound Bracers but don't have pack
Belt: Sirens Belt (+5 armour, +2 insight)
Necklace: Sirens Charm (+4 con, +2 insight)
Goggles: Goggles of Battle Skill (+2 attack) with Medium Guild Augment slot (+15 HP) (+6 int goggles, +4 reflex goggles, 3*DW clickies)
Gloves: Brawling Gloves (12th)
Cloak: Mantle of the Worldshaper or Protection +5
Helm: Wise +6 helm or +6 seeker/+7 balance cove hat (ML:15)
Boots: Madstone Boots
Ring1: Chattering Ring (+3 dodge, +13 spot, -10 move silently)
Ring2: Dexterity +6/Prot +5 ring

10 base
+3 14 base wisdom +1 monk wisdom +1 greater adaptability: wisdom
+4 15 base dex +2 rogue dex +1 adaptability: dexterity
+6 +6 items on dex/wis
+2 insight sirens set
+2 dodge Chaosguard
+5 sirens belt
+4 natural AC from madstone rage (or +3 barkskin pot)
+5 deflection
+1 haste (pot)
+4 from ship buffs
+2 from dex/wis +2 tomes
+2 from water stance
+1 dodge nimble trinket
+1 monk AC (from level 2 monk)
+4 level 5 shield wand (95% activation chance and 80+ charges available)
+3 dodge (chattering ring)
=59 standing self buffed
+4 IH (bard song level 15)
+1 barkskin (level 12 ranger)
+3 paladin aura
=67 raid buffed
+5 versatility: armour class
+6 improved uncanny dodge
=78 burst

I don't need adaptability: strength at the moment as fighter strength I (from fighter dilettante) is giving me an even strength score. Only way I could make use of a +1 would be if I had abishai set. I only have a +4 strength item but I have 10+ uses of DP on clickies and a roc cloak too for the +6.

I can have +5% XP and only lose 1 AC if I use a +5 prot ring as it only loses me 1 AC as +4 dex is on boots. Similarly, I can use a GFL ring and only lose 1 AC. With a friendly cleric/fvs/artificer I can have GFL and +5% xp and only lose 2 AC (for 57 total) with shield of faith cast on me.

Level 18, while since I've posted in this thread. Suffice to say, with the above gear I've been able to relax my AC in many situations and just try to maintain ~60 in most content with occasional bursts for some bosses etc.

Pulled Icy's today and starting to think about raid buffed AC values:

Body: Icy Raiments with +1 Dodge Ritual
Trinket: Nimble Trinket
Bracers: +7 Bracers of Armour (with a SGA, unused)
Belt: Heavy Fortification Belt
Necklace: Shintao Cord
Goggles: Goggles of Dodge +2
Gloves: Brawling Gloves (16th)
Cloak: Protection +5
Helm: Wise +6 helm
Boots: Madstone Boots
Ring1: Chattering Ring (+3 dodge, +13 spot, -10 move silently)
Ring2: Dexterity +6 (-1 AC if I swap this to GFL)
Weapon: Air/Water Alchemical Handwraps (+4 insight, +2 alchemical wisdom)

10 base
+8 14 base wisdom +1 monk wisdom +1 greater adaptability: wisdom +2 tome +6 item +2 alchemical
+8 15 base dex +2 rogue dex +1 adaptability: dexterity +6 item +2 tome
+4 insight alchemical air on tier 1
+2 dodge goggles
+7 bracers of armour
+4 natural AC from madstone rage
+5 deflection
+1 haste (pot)
+5 from ship buffs
+2 from water stance
+1 dodge nimble trinket
+1 monk AC (from level 2 monk)
+4 level 5 shield wand (95% activation chance and 80+ charges available)
+1 dodge ritual
+3 dodge (chattering ring)
+4 dodge (icy raiments)
=70 standing self buffed
+4 IH (bard song level 15)
+1 barkskin (level 12 ranger)
+6 max DoS paladin aura
+4 halfling heroes companion
+2 recitation
=87 raid buffed
+2 showtime (sustainable for 7 minutes)
=89 raid buffed
+6 improved uncanny dodge (sustainable for 4 minutes)
=95
+5 versatility: armour class (7/day lasting 20 seconds for bursts)
=100

Not that I have the hate, HP or saves to actually put the AC to use tanking anything worthwhile but I think it's pretty hilarious that the character is capable of that, unless I added something up wrong?

[LFKnowledge]

Sorry for the necro, but I've actually put to use the information on this thread and just providing feedback.

This is a great thread, I find that most AC advice given is that "don't bother, takes too much to get worthwhile AC, etc."
After reading this below:

So far all the estimates are quite far off.
Take it from someone who always levels with AC in mind (simply because it's so easy to get and gives you so much).

Low levels
1-4 - Around 23 and it's good, 26 and it's unhittable unless it's a named
5-9 - Around 30 and you're unhittable, and it's quite easy to reach because of barkskin (+3) and sof(+3) pots at level 5.

.....

Easy way to get AC while leveling:
10 base
3 dex
8+x for mithral full plate, remove 2 from dex if you don't have one)
3 barkskin potion
3 shield of faith potion
1 haste potion
-----
28, and then another 1 more per + of your full plate, and guild buffs if you have those.

Throw in a shield after that, which you should use if you're rushing (doesn't matter on class) and you'll get another 1+x if it's light (casters) or more if it's a tower shield (melees).

That way you have around mid 30s low 40s without any investment in it besides gear. Once you reach GH you dump all the ac for other stuff, unless you have high 40s or low 50s.

I took this advice and made a big difference in survivability and fun factor.
1st life, I was a Fighter Stalwart Defender, with AC in the 70s. (Using Combat Expertise feat, enhancements, sword and board, etc)
2nd life, did Paladin, but thought that AC was hard to maintain, so opted to go THF dps. Dumped AC early on, and started running into bumps around the L7 range. Was taking a lot of damage and was really missing the AC.

That was about the time I found this thread and applied A-O's advice.

I use a cat's grace potion from marketplace in lieu of the dexterity. (started with low dex, and use gear slots for str, con and other stuff)

Used mithral full plates from previous life, that also had the alchemical rituals.

Was able to use cannith crafting (natural armor on bracers) for the barkskin potions. This was discovered later on, did use barkskin pots at first.

Also used cannith crafting (protection on cloaks) for the shield of faith potions. Also used pots before the crafting.

Mainly went THF, and didn't want to use a shield, so found out that I could use a Shield clicky, that gave me +4 AC. Also added bonus of immunity to magic missiles. At level 5 range, short duration of 1 minute, so I have several clickies and mainly activate when I know big fights are coming up.

As mentioned by A-O, haste pot and ship buffs added to the AC total.

Overall, was very glad to see "misses" again, made me more survivable. AC was easily in the 30s.
I did dump AC during/leaving Sands and entered GH.

Very satisfied with how AC is helping with the leveling. Thank you all!