fvs/mo vs clr/mo build

[mmofan]

in my previous thread (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=345400) i was deciding if i should go pure cleric after i TR or make a clonk. after much consideration and hearing the benefits of both sides i decided the monk splash.it was the best fit for my preferred play style. the one remaining question i had really need a thread of its own and so here it is. my question is should i go favored soul or go cleric. i have put together 2 rough builds to compare. i am looking for helpful feedback from players experienced in fvs and clerics and hopefully with a monk splash.

i am interested in endgame raiding and want to be effective healer and be offensive caster focused. i would hope to still be effective enough in melee not the best not, not horrible, just good enough generate some decent DPS.
i hear the fvs is your best bet to be an offensive caster. the thing i like most about the cleric is radiant servant and they have the most spell slots and they get all the divine spells.

regarding the builds i am much less familiar with how to build a fvs so if you have tips i am open to suggestions. i am also if it makes a difference at what levels u splash if so when is good.

[mmofan]

i haven't selected spell yet and i don't want to cover that yet
if left out any good pros/cons pleas tell me

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Human Male
(3 Monk \ 17 Favored Soul) 
Hit Points: 282
Spell Points: 1558 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 16
Reflex: 16
Will: 21

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(34 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             12                 14                   15
Dexterity            15                 17                   17
Constitution         14                 16                   16
Intelligence          8                  8                    8
Wisdom               17                 24                   27
Charisma             11                 13                   16

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               4                    22
Bluff                 0                     3
Concentration         2                     3
Diplomacy             0                     3
Disable Device       n/a                   n/a
Haggle                0                     4
Heal                  3                     8
Hide                  2                     3
Intimidate            0                     3
Jump                  1                     2
Listen                3                     8
Move Silently         2                     3
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair               -1                    -1
Search               -1                    -1
Spot                  3                     8
Swim                  1                     2
Tumble                4                    16
Use Magic Device      n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell
Feat: (Deity) Favored by the Sovereign Host
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
Feat: (Human Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 3 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 4 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 5 (Favored Soul)


Level 6 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Fire


Level 7 (Favored Soul)


Level 8 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 9 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist


Level 10 (Favored Soul)


Level 11 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light


Level 12 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 13 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Electricity


Level 14 (Favored Soul)


Level 15 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Penetration


Level 16 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 17 (Favored Soul)


Level 18 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Acid
Feat: (Selected) Heighten Spell


Level 19 (Favored Soul)


Level 20 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: WIS
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty (Favored Soul)
Enhancement: Favored Soul Angel of Vengeance I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Angel of Vengeance II
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Wisdom I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Human Versatility III
Enhancement: Way of the Clever Monkey I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Life II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Spell Penetration I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Spell Penetration II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Spell Penetration III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Charisma I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Charisma II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Charisma III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wisdom I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wisdom II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Toughness I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wand and Scroll Mastery I

pros
more sp from gear
resistances
wings
spell damage aura

cons
no radiant servant
no tuns
no divines

[mmofan]

if left out any good pros/cons pleas tell me

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.11.01
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Human Female
(3 Monk \ 17 Cleric) 
Hit Points: 252
Spell Points: 1234 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 15
Reflex: 11
Will: 22

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(34 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             15                 17                   18
Dexterity            15                 17                   17
Constitution         12                 14                   14
Intelligence          8                  8                    8
Wisdom               17                 24                   28
Charisma              9                 11                   11

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills        Base Skills        Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)          (Level 20)          (Level 20)
Balance               4                 22                   22
Bluff                -1                  0                    0
Concentration         1                  2                    2
Diplomacy            -1                  2                    2
Disable Device       n/a               n/a                   n/a
Haggle               -1                  0                    1
Heal                  3                  9                   11
Hide                  2                  3                    3
Intimidate           -1                  0                    0
Jump                  2                  4                    4
Listen                3                  9                    9
Move Silently         2                  3                    3
Open Lock             n/a               n/a                   n/a
Perform              n/a                n/a                   n/a
Repair               -1                 -1                   -1
Search               -1                 -1                   -1
Spot                  3                  9                    9
Swim                  2                  4                    4
Tumble                4                 12                   12
Use Magic Device     n/a                n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Cleric)
Feat: (Human Bonus) Empower Healing Spell
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 3 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 4 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 5 (Cleric)


Level 6 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Heighten Spell


Level 7 (Cleric)


Level 8 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 9 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Power Attack


Level 10 (Cleric)


Level 11 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light


Level 12 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: WIS
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 13 (Cleric)


Level 14 (Cleric)


Level 15 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 16 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: WIS


Level 17 (Cleric)


Level 18 (Cleric)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Penetration


Level 19 (Cleric)


Level 20 (Cleric)
Ability Raise: WIS
Enhancement: Cleric Radiant Servant I
Enhancement: Cleric Radiant Servant II
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Wisdom I
Enhancement: Human Greater Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Human Versatility III
Enhancement: Human Versatility IV
Enhancement: Lifting the Veil
Enhancement: Way of the Clever Monkey I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Improved Heal I
Enhancement: Improved Heal II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life II
Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Incredible Life I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III
Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic IV
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Spell Penetration I
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Spell Penetration II
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Spell Penetration III
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot I
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot II
Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot III
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom I
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom II
Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom III
Enhancement: Cleric Divine Healing I
Enhancement: Cleric Improved Turning I

pros
radiant servant
tuns
divines

cons
less Sp from gear
no resistances
no wings

[mmofan]

reserved

[mmofan]

reserved

[ayondie]

in my previous thread (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=345400) i was deciding if i should go pure cleric after i TR or make a clonk. after much consideration and hearing the benefits of both sides i decided the monk splash.it was the best fit for my preferred play style. the one remaining question i had really need a thread of its own and so here it is. my question is should i go favored soul or go cleric. i have put together 2 rough builds to compare. i am looking for helpful feedback from players experienced in fvs and clerics and hopefully with a monk splash.

i am interested in endgame raiding and want to be effective healer and be offensive caster focused. i would hope to still be effective enough in melee not the best not, not horrible, just good enough generate some decent DPS.
i hear the fvs is your best bet to be an offensive caster. the thing i like most about the cleric is radiant servant and they have the most spell slots and they get all the divine spells.

regarding the builds i am much less familiar with how to build a fvs so if you have tips i am open to suggestions. i am also if it makes a difference at what levels u splash if so when is good.

i would not go with a 3 monk splash you lose too much especially as an fvs. All level 3 monk will get you is fists of light which was nerfed with update 10. Fists of light healing damage and the save against the healing curse is based on the number of monk levels along with wisdom. Even with a maxed wisdom it would never be high enough to do any good. I would go with 2 monk and take 18 levels of cleric or fvs. I have not tried fvs but i do enjoy the 2 monk splash on a cleric and am looking at 61 ac self buffed without any real gear. if you want a really good build for a clonk it is called the Valience build. There is two versions by the same author one being halfling and one being valience 2.0 which is human. This build is 17 clr/2monk/1 rogue build utilizing umd for recon scrolls etc.

[wax_on_wax_off]

i would not go with a 3 monk splash you lose too much especially as an fvs. All level 3 monk will get you is fists of light which was nerfed with update 10. Fists of light healing damage and the save against the healing curse is based on the number of monk levels along with wisdom. Even with a maxed wisdom it would never be high enough to do any good. I would go with 2 monk and take 18 levels of cleric or fvs. I have not tried fvs but i do enjoy the 2 monk splash on a cleric and am looking at 61 ac self buffed without any real gear. if you want a really good build for a clonk it is called the Valience build. There is two versions by the same author one being halfling and one being valience 2.0 which is human. This build is 17 clr/2monk/1 rogue build utilizing umd for recon scrolls etc.

I agree with this. 3 monk is a bit of a waste.

Valiance 2.0 is an excellent build.

Overall, I'd tend to think that the monk splash on a FvS costs too much which leaves cleric splash as the better choice. There is also a lot of synergy between radiant servant and that style of play.

My idea these days:
17 cleric, 2 monk, 1 fighter half-elf with rogue dilettante. Stats are a bit tricky on account of how awesome it is to get enough charisma to use DMIII. It certainly is a very MAD build

[ayondie]

Stats are a bit tricky on account of how awesome it is to get enough charisma to use DMIII. It certainly is a very MAD build

madly awesome /signed

[wax_on_wax_off]

madly awesome /signed

Just to clarify for anyone who doesn't know; MAD = Multiple Attribute Dependent. Though yes, it is madly awesome

[Raoull]

I think a melee clonk can go favored soul instead of cleric, but a casting one runs into the problem of too few spellslots. An 18 FvS gets only 1 lvl 9 spell... for a melee, not having implosion is no big deal, but that leaves a casting FvS choosing between Implosion and Mass Heal.

[wax_on_wax_off]

I think a melee clonk can go favored soul instead of cleric, but a casting one runs into the problem of too few spellslots. An 18 FvS gets only 1 lvl 9 spell... for a melee, not having implosion is no big deal, but that leaves a casting FvS choosing between Implosion and Mass Heal.

True, however, hybrid or caster is much more fun and effective than wisdom dumped melee, imo.

[Shakanos]

Monk 3 is for the finishers (SP discount + others) more than it is for healing out of the actual light move. FvS has a fairly nice capstone, so I'm inclined to agree it's simpler to make the splash work on a Cleric. Especially if you only go to 17 and splash 3 levels of whatever, as FvS gets level 9 spells (Mass Heal) at 18.

One thought is to dump the Spell Pen feats and get Stunning Fist as the DC is 10 + half character level (changed from Monk level awhile back) + Wisdom mod. It does require using Handwraps to utilize Stunning Fist, though with melee as the third priority you likely focusing on effects more than base damage anyway so not really a big deal (and may've planned to use them already anyway). With a focus on Healing/Casting, your Wisdom should be quite high. Fort save cc (stun also increases damage taken - sure to be popular among the people trying to break their highest crit record) to go alongside the Reflex save of Cometfall and Blade Barrier, neither of which are subject to spell resistance. Stunning Fist also has the upside of not costing spell points, for when you feel stretched thin.

Greater Command is there for Will, but it has to overcome Spell Resist just like the Cleric insta kill (Fort) spells - though the DC should still be fine for targets without a high enough spell resistance. By splashing three levels, spell pen is already a losing game of catchup and I'd rather spend the feats elsewhere. Cleric doesn't have that many to spare in the first place, especially picking up the Two Weapon Fighting feats. In groups you can likely just let a Bard/Arcanes throw out dancing spheres when Will needs to be targeted on stuff that has spell resistance anyway.


I'm not quite sure which way to go on Weapon Finesse. It takes a feat, but allows focus on Dex for a better Reflex against traps/spells. My gut tells me that the required 15(17) base Dex needed for the Two Weapon Fighting feats is a good enough starting point (and you can more or less increase it the same amount, regardless of Weapon Finesse or not). And Str (for to hit) is a tad easier to pump (spells like Rage, Madstone boots, etc.) than Dex and of course also gives damage.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Monk 3 is for the finishers (SP discount + others) more than it is for healing out of the actual light move. FvS has a fairly nice capstone, so I'm inclined to agree it's simpler to make the splash work on a Cleric. Especially if you only go to 17 and splash 3 levels of whatever, as FvS gets level 9 spells (Mass Heal) at 18.

One thought is to dump the Spell Pen feats and get Stunning Fist as the DC is 10 + character level (changed from Monk level awhile back) + Wisdom mod. It does require using Handwraps to utilize Stunning Fist, though with melee as the third priority you likely focusing on effects more than base damage anyway so not really a big deal (and may've planned to use them already anyway). With a focus on Healing/Casting, your Wisdom should be quite high. Fort save cc (stun also increases damage taken - sure to be popular among the people trying to break their highest crit record) to go alongside the Reflex save of Cometfall and Blade Barrier, neither of which are subject to spell resistance. Stunning Fist also has the upside of not costing spell points, for when you feel stretched thin.

Greater Command is there for Will, but it has to overcome Spell Resist just like the Cleric insta kill (Fort) spells - though the DC should still be fine for targets without a high enough spell resistance. By splashing three levels, spell pen is already a losing game of catchup and I'd rather spend the feats elsewhere. Cleric doesn't have that many to spare in the first place, especially picking up the Two Weapon Fighting feats. In groups you can likely just let a Bard/Arcanes throw out dancing spheres when Will needs to be targeted on stuff that has spell resistance anyway.


I'm not quite sure which way to go on Weapon Finesse. It takes a feat, but allows focus on Dex for a better Reflex against traps/spells. My gut tells me that the required 15(17) base Dex needed for the Two Weapon Fighting feats is a good enough starting point (and you can more or less increase it the same amount, regardless of Weapon Finesse or not). And Str (for to hit) is a tad easier to pump (spells like Rage, Madstone boots, etc.) than Dex and of course also gives damage.

I leveled a drow clonk with 8 base strength. I made up for this with DMIII with 18 charisma (after a +2 tome) for +6 damage and the extra bursts along with the higher AC and AB from the better dex made it work really well.

[TasMagar]

My main is a human FvS 18/2 monk and is very fun character to play . Strength based can do about 36 str , playing with 2 longswords. can get decent AC for solo, around 49 , and sometimes while tanking switching to light armor + shield , ene tho i loose evasion but can do 57 ac and tank a bit .

I suggest either FvS / monk (2) or a pure FvS WF.

[mmofan]

i would not go with a 3 monk splash you lose too much especially as an fvs. All level 3 monk will get you is fists of light which was nerfed with update 10. Fists of light healing damage and the save against the healing curse is based on the number of monk levels along with wisdom. Even with a maxed wisdom it would never be high enough to do any good. I would go with 2 monk and take 18 levels of cleric or fvs. I have not tried fvs but i do enjoy the 2 monk splash on a cleric and am looking at 61 ac self buffed without any real gear. if you want a really good build for a clonk it is called the Valience build. There is two versions by the same author one being halfling and one being valience 2.0 which is human. This build is 17 clr/2monk/1 rogue build utilizing umd for recon scrolls etc.

i go 3 for the finishers and buffs

[erikbozelie]

ow joy another versus thread.

at multiclassen cleric will win, take an 3rd level or something else. roque pops up for skills, sa, umd, haste boost etc.
clerics lose pretty mmuch nothing by taking 3 levels of something else except for spell pen and sp. they keep the essentials.

as for fvs those are better kept pure, your stuck at 1 level 9 spell at level 18. true resurrection, sm9, mass heal, implosion, energy drain. pick 1!. not to mention they get an huge bonus from the capstone.

[Propane]

I have a 17/3 Cleric-Monk and love it. (Kerosene)

The Aligning the heavens saves more mana that you think-

High healing amp + RS allow for Cord OP + Torc + fighting in the front lines = lots of mana regen

When WIS based and dwarf for high stunning fist (43 in Fire Stance).

STR and DEX are balanced - save a feat on weapon finesse

[Feralthyrtiaq]

A leveling build, 2Monk/2Pal/16Cleric for a Cleric PL in my Completionist's long journey.

Helf w/Sorc Dilletante

Empower Heal
Quicken
Toughness
TWF
ITWF
GTWF
Extra Turning
Maximize
+Feat of Choice (Stunning Fist/Blow, PA etc)
36 Point, +2 Tomes in all relevant stats
Str 15 Level Ups here
Dex 15
Con 14
Int 8
Wis 13
Cha 13

Prolly do a similar type build but with FVS instead of Cleric, knock Wis down to 10 and boost Str to 16.

Not DPS powerhouses, Not Prime raid healers, Not Evokers...but...

For "Adventuring" both have Strong Survivablity, Self/Party Healing, MONK UA attacks, Paladin Goodies, No Fail Level 5 and under Arcane Scroll useage with Full Sorc Dille AP line (85% Lvl 6 Arcane Scrolls), Healing Amp, Saves, Level 8 Divine Spells.........

Not exactly what OP had in mind but...