Newbie Cleric Questions

[hideyoshi1973]

I' ve been playing about six months and have my second toon up to level 9 cleric. This mean I just got Raise Dead. I was wondering if people normally slotted this as spell or just cast it from scrolls to make room for spells used more often.

I also took Maxmize as feat, but am thinking I should have taken Quicken instead. It looks like people normally take Empower Healing or Maximize on Clerics, but not both. Should I think about swapping for Quicken?

[Flavilandile]

I' ve been playing about six months and have my second toon up to level 9 cleric. This mean I just got Raise Dead. I was wondering if people normally slotted this as spell or just cast it from scrolls to make room for spells used more often.

I also took Maxmize as feat, but am thinking I should have taken Quicken instead. It looks like people normally take Empower Healing or Maximize on Clerics, but not both. Should I think about swapping for Quicken?

I uses both scroll and the spell slot for Raise Dead... at least until I get at least Resurection. ( on my clerics that don't have all of the raise spells slotted )

Is some circumstances you will need to do lots of raise very fast and the fastest way to do it is : scroll, spell, scroll, spell... as the scroll is not on the same cooldown timer as the spell.

And scrolls always works when you are out of mana.

Can't help much on the feat side... as I'm one of the "Quicken is not a requirement for a cleric" cleric. I take up empower healing ( you need it for Radiant Servant PrE ) and toughness ( when my cleric has enough Con to take it [ Yes I'm also one of those : while Con shall not be dumped, it doesn't need to be maxed to the detriment of other things, so my clerics usually end up with Con between 12 and 14 ] )

[blkcat1028]

I've found this link to be very helpful while planning my first cleric.

Valiance created a very good guide as well but my search-fu has failed and I cannot find it right now.

[LVSammy]

For an answer to ur first question, as i general rule, if a scroll is just as effective as casting the spell, scroll it. This differs slightly at endgame where needing to make insane concentration checks become an issue. However, u wont have to worry about that then, clerics have plenty of slots at 20.

And for the second, u ABSOLUTELY want max, emp AND emp heal as they affect your bursts and aura, which are some of the main reasons for going clr instead of fvs. Additionally max and emp amplify your divine punishment, as well as cometfall, harm, etc. And for the final bit, quicken... What a beautiful meta. Quicken is a healers pre u9 firewall. With that said, however, depending on your play style, you might not need it until 15 or 18.

Gl with the healer, hope this helps.

[morticianjohn]

Maxing concentration is not worth the effort IMHO (Action points, item slot, build choices, etc...) and there are too many situations where you could fail the concentration in spite of having it at max. I could go further but there are many threads which discuss the merits of the quicken feat. As you likely won't need it much until level 12 you can put off taking the feat until then (even later in many cases).

Empower healing is important as it affects the heal spell while empower does not. I would take all three, maximize (mostly for blade barrier and offensive spells), empower heal, and quicken. If you need a feat swap look up Fred in house jorasco.

[Ugumagre]

I uses both scroll and the spell slot for Raise Dead... at least until I get at least Resurection. ( on my clerics that don't have all of the raise spells slotted )

Is some circumstances you will need to do lots of raise very fast and the fastest way to do it is : scroll, spell, scroll, spell... as the scroll is not on the same cooldown timer as the spell.

And scrolls always works when you are out of mana.

Can't help much on the feat side... as I'm one of the "Quicken is not a requirement for a cleric" cleric. I take up empower healing ( you need it for Radiant Servant PrE ) and toughness ( when my cleric has enough Con to take it [ Yes I'm also one of those : while Con shall not be dumped, it doesn't need to be maxed to the detriment of other things, so my clerics usually end up with Con between 12 and 14 ] )

Just this morning I was thinking about swapping the quicken feat. I never use it. It is my guess that is usefull only in raids or end game...could you give me a clue?

[Flavilandile]

Just this morning I was thinking about swapping the quicken feat. I never use it. It is my guess that is usefull only in raids or end game...could you give me a clue?

That's about it... It's nice to have it in some Amrath quests, in ToD, in Epic Raids ( Queen, VoN 6 ).
But you can live quite well ( and do your job as a cleric ) without it if you are careful.

It's main use is to avoid loosing concentration when hit while casting Mass Heal.
Due Mass Heal casting time you are going to be hit, and you have most of the chances to get your concentration broken.... that is if you are somewhere where you can be hit. [ in DQ there's no way you cannot be hit ]

[Psyker]

LVSammy (and for the most part everyone else in this thread) is giving good advice, I have never gotten a healer to cap yet (unless you count bards, and I'm working on a FVS that will be there eventually!) but for the most part if I can use a scroll instead of a spell I would strongly consider saving the spell slot for something else that I need. However if your funds are low and you cringe at the thought of having to use a few scrolls per quest then go ahead and slot the spell, but if you have enough plat to make it where you aren't concerned with how much you have to spend on scrolls then you might be better off using that spell slot for something else.

As for worrying about having the spell and scroll so you have separate timers, I think that is overdoing it a bit, perhaps that could be usefull a time or two, but for the most part if people are dieing faster than you can res them too many things are going wrong and trying to res people as fast as you can probably is not the answer.

[SirValentine]

I' ve been playing about six months and have my second toon up to level 9 cleric. This mean I just got Raise Dead. I was wondering if people normally slotted this as spell or just cast it from scrolls to make room for spells used more often.

I normally keep it slotted, and Rez and True Rez when I get them, too. Sometimes you need to help the party get up fast from a near-wipe. That said, scrolling it when you have the time is fine, save a bit of SP.

Do you have specific other things for that spell slot you'd rather carry?

I also took Maxmize as feat, but am thinking I should have taken Quicken instead. It looks like people normally take Empower Healing or Maximize on Clerics, but not both. Should I think about swapping for Quicken?

You will want Quicken eventually, but you probably don't need it at already at level 9.

Of course you want to keep Empower Healing, because it' a pre-req for Radiant Servant.

However, if you ever intend to do damage via your spells, Maximize is awesome, and Empower, too. They ramp up your Divine Punishment and Blade Barrier, two of the most powerful spells in the game. Oh yeah, and they make your Positive Energy Burst more powerful for free, too!

If you want to list your build, or your goals for your build, I'm sure people could give you more detailed suggestions. At level 9, you're only beginning to awaken your true power as a Cleric.

[Kmnh]

At level 9 you get your first 2 truly useful offensive spells: Slay Living and Flame Strike. Th game is sooo much more fun with those, that I think you can wait to get raise dead as a spell later.


Then again, I like the insanity of paying attention to combat, health bars and spell targeting at the same time. Some people will have more fun playing a pure healbot

[SirValentine]

At level 9 you get your first 2 truly useful offensive spells: Slay Living and Flame Strike. Th game is sooo much more fun with those, that I think you can wait to get raise dead as a spell later.

Slay Living, yay!

But I think you misspelled "Divine Punishment" as "Flame Strike" for some reason. :-)

[Sarisa]

Quicken is essential at end game. Even with 60-70 Concentration, I can still get it broken regularly just by normal melee hits in hard/elite end game content and epics. Quicken lets you still cast without having to worry about concentration checks.

Quicken is also essential for Mass Heal. Mass Heal, unless you're extremely well equipped (meaning a LOT of rare raid loot, along with burning a lot of points in Efficient Metamagic enhancements) is the most SP efficient healing spell you have. Yes, it will "overheal", but it also is incredibly efficient on your SP.

Concentration is still important, however, as Scrolls cannot be Quickened. Scroll healing is a near-essential SP saving measure in many raids.

[jaegarnel]

Quicken is essential at end game. Even with 60-70 Concentration, I can still get it broken regularly just by normal melee hits in hard/elite end game content and epics. Quicken lets you still cast without having to worry about concentration checks.

Quicken is also essential for Mass Heal. Mass Heal, unless you're extremely well equipped (meaning a LOT of rare raid loot, along with burning a lot of points in Efficient Metamagic enhancements) is the most SP efficient healing spell you have. Yes, it will "overheal", but it also is incredibly efficient on your SP.

Concentration is still important, however, as Scrolls cannot be Quickened. Scroll healing is a near-essential SP saving measure in many raids.

Agreed.

Speaking of the new quests (since that's what I've been playing most recently), on elite a paladin of blades can hit for about 80-90 dmg, so you'll nearly always fail a concentration check.
You really, really don't want that heal spell to be interrupted, most of the time. Not only is it wasted sp, but it can also mean death to a party member if the mobs' damage output is high.

Quicken is also very useful for mass heal, which is your best healing spell in most raids. The cast time is way too slow without the feat.

Also, just because you have quicken doesn't mean you always have to use it. Personally I keep some unquickened cure spells for quests that are either easy or where I'm unlikely to be hit. That way I save 10 sp per spell.

Maxing concentration is just as important, because using heal scrolls in raids is a very important sp conservation method. You can, for instance, keep a Horoth tank up in ToD mostly with heal scrolls, which saves your sp for when things go wrong.
Again, you don't want that scroll to be interrupted by a hit from an Orthon.


To the OP, you should actually take both maximize and empower healing, because both are very useful.
You need empower healing to qualify for the radiant servant PrE, and it affects heal/mass heal, so it's your best meta for healing.

Maximize is nearly as essential, it makes your bursts and many of your offensive spells like blade barrier and divine punishment much better.
Empower is nice to have as well, but not nearly as useful.

[trog_star]

running a lvl 20 cleric, pure caster.
i dont play ToD, HoX or Vod as my lag makes me an unreilyable healer, i's not uncommon for me to still be healing a party 20 secs after harry is dead

Allways have your highst level raise slotted, parties will expect it of you
keep a stack (yes a stack) of raise scrolls and heal scrolls on you quickbar
make dam sure you have a superior potency weapon equipped, pretty much all the time

quicken - forget soloing ADQ2 without
empower healing
shield masttery - Forget soloing ADQ2 without this too
maxamise spell
highten - swapping for empower as soon as i get an apropiate shard
toughness
Spell Pen
Greater Spell pen

i think thats it.
A well played and equipped cleric is pretty dang powerfull and dam near unkillable.
mind you the blocking DR 21/ helps allot

[Habreno]

running a lvl 20 cleric, pure caster.
i dont play ToD, HoX or Vod as my lag makes me an unreilyable healer, i's not uncommon for me to still be healing a party 20 secs after harry is dead

Allways have your highst level raise slotted, parties will expect it of you
keep a stack (yes a stack) of raise scrolls and heal scrolls on you quickbar
make dam sure you have a superior potency weapon equipped, pretty much all the time

quicken - forget soloing ADQ2 without
empower healing
shield masttery - Forget soloing ADQ2 without this too
maxamise spell
highten - swapping for empower as soon as i get an apropiate shard
toughness
Spell Pen
Greater Spell pen

i think thats it.
A well played and equipped cleric is pretty dang powerfull and dam near unkillable.
mind you the blocking DR 21/ helps allot

And how is all this relevant?

[trog_star]

And how is all this relevant?

try reading the OP

*edit
Questions were asked about resing from scrolls Vs spell slots, do both

Questions were asked about Max Vs Empower, there is room for both