Cannith Combat Infusion

[Xenostrata]

Sucks.

The proc rate is ridiculously low for a 10 second buff. I ran shroud on Jial with this thing on, and it procced 4 times in total - Twice in phase 1, and once each in phases 2 and 5. Did some quick math, and the portals were going down after on average 40 swings. That means, not including trash, the thing procced twice off of ~600 swings - or a third of a percent proc chance.

So, suggestions -
1. Increase the proc chance, by a lot. Not enough to keep it up as a permanent buff, but enough to make the ability actually worth something. Maybe 2% (given an average attack speed of 100 swings per minute, that means about 1/3 of the time you will have the buff).
2. Increase the duration (again, by a lot). Up it to 1 minute. Given the same attack speed, you will end up with on average 3 procs every 10 minutes - around the same amount as #1, except that if they proc before the duration of a previous buff is over then you lose time. I like this one most, since I would much prefer fewer, longer durations of boost than more shorter duration buffs.
3. Increase the duration AND the proc chance, but have the buff come with a negative side effect (kind of like Blood Rage, except less complicated and frustrating). Looking for something to fit the theme, I came up with the following -

• -10% healing amp (or some appropriate amount) as the body is temporarily given construct strength improvements
• Stun at the end for 6 seconds as your body returns to normal
• -5 to-hit during the effect due to overfocus, and -10 for a minute after the effect from withdrawal
• Addiction: if the person does not receive a second hit from the Infusion within 10 minutes of the last one, they suffer from -10 constitution and strength until they are Healed, rested, or given another infusion.

Anyway, this ability needs some serious help. I didn't play on Lamannia, but I've heard that it was much more powerful there, and that might've been the reason that Turbine nerfed it into obsolescence. Maybe try to return some usefulness to this one?

[weewoo0]

basically on lam it procced enough that you could use it for boss fights and it would stay on almost 100% of the time (monk att speed) however on live it was nerfed with the giant screaming shillelagh of epic nerfage to the point where it'd be on for maybe 10% of the time(still monk att speed. so other classes might not have a hope at keeping it up)... oh well. back to the jidz tet'ka

[Xenostrata]

basically on lam it procced enough that you could use it for boss fights and it would stay on almost 100% of the time (monk att speed) however on live it was nerfed with the giant screaming shillelagh of epic nerfage to the point where it'd be on for maybe 10% of the time(still monk att speed. so other classes might not have a hope at keeping it up)... oh well. back to the jidz tet'ka

Yeah. At a non-monk attack speed, I can keep it up for pretty much exactly 20 seconds every 10 minutes.

Total DPS increase from strength - .067 damage per swing. Woopee!

[PurdueDave]

That's pretty craptastic.

[Khurse]

Yeah, although I didn't find one on test, one of my friends did and described it as a perpetual buff.
While I believe (for the difficulty involved in finding it) that was a bit OP, the "new" proc rate makes it next to worthless.

There is a happy state somewhere between 100% and 1% proc rates.

[grodon9999]

It seemed perpetual on Lamania, now it's absolute garbage. Worthless piece of gear, not worth giving up a clot for.

[Cold_Stele]

Yup, they're awful now.

They need to move away from any link at all to attack speed tbh - my THF WF's should be able to get the same benefit as my TWF Kensai or Monk.

[noinfo]

basically on lam it procced enough that you could use it for boss fights and it would stay on almost 100% of the time (monk att speed) however on live it was nerfed with the giant screaming shillelagh of epic nerfage to the point where it'd be on for maybe 10% of the time(still monk att speed. so other classes might not have a hope at keeping it up)... oh well. back to the jidz tet'ka

Really this is just an attack version of Madstone boots that ACTUALLY benefits toons with dex and AC of course it needed to be nerfed!

Madstone boots if worn are basically a continuous buff, why not these? If worried so much about them stacking (like there is not enough stacking str buffs anyway) then make them the same type as madstone but at the moment even on a dual weilding tempest they are very ordinary. Really the only piece of loot I was interested in and this is what we get.

[somenewnoob]

I got a pair recently and planned out how I would move my gear around with them replacing Leviks......but after testing them..........they are now performing the important function of keeping a bank slot warm.

[elraido]

Make it the same proc rate and duration as madstone. It would then help paladins...

[Talias006]

I got this on my FvS and passed it to my Rng/Ftr thinking it would be better than the Howling Bracer he had.

Right now, it's a toss up as to which was less useful.
It's nice when it procs, and gives me a bit more durability as well as beefing up my melee combat.

But it's so seldom seen that I can't logically use it as a stop-gap for not having GH clickies.

Hoping for a partial buff to the proc-rate to at least make it a more feasible item for keeping in the slot.
Or maybe have multiple items that proc the same effect, so you have a generally greater chance of it working when you need it.

[noinfo]

Make it the same proc rate and duration as madstone. It would then help paladins...

I don't mind the short duration if the proc rates were there to allow continous proc during full attacking and then wind down. Anything less than that makes them useless to anyone.

They sit in the bracers slot so directly compete with claw set or Abashai set so they need to be quite useful to make people consider using them. On an AC toon they are even more of an issue for those who may slot their +2 dodge item there.

[Xenostrata]

Yup, they're awful now.

They need to move away from any link at all to attack speed tbh - my THF WF's should be able to get the same benefit as my TWF Kensai or Monk.

I can see this being an issue, but would be fine with it so long as it couldn't proc on glancing blows or offhand strikes. The only real difference then would be attack speed and doublestrike, and I see no reason not to give monks a minor DPS boost over the others (should be fairly miniscule).

I should note that in my calculation for proc chance, I assumed that it WOULDN'T proc on glancing blows. If it does, then the proc rate is actually closer to a fifth of a percent instead of a third of a percent.

[noinfo]

Yup, they're awful now.

They need to move away from any link at all to attack speed tbh - my THF WF's should be able to get the same benefit as my TWF Kensai or Monk.

Yep either they should double the % proc for 2 handed or have it proc on glancing. Either way they still need to have the proc rate increased significantly to even bother slotting the item. At the moment these are place holders not level 18 loot. Great concept, the developer who came up with the idea did very well, but the proc rate just way way too low. I would have thought the concept would be that while continually attacking and hitting they should be almost permanently infused.

[Kinerd]

I was just going to post a thread on this today, thanks for saving me the trouble.

My findings are 76 buffs out of 5858 hits (not swings, more on this later) for a 1.3% process rate. I want to stress that this is a preliminary finding that requires a lot more data before being reliable, because as will be demonstrated very small changes in process rate have a dramatic difference on how much of the time the buff is active. I have personally witnessed the buff activating on the main and off hand of a single attack, as well as on the double-strike of an attack. I have not witnessed the buff activating on a miss; however, it is possible (but not likely) that I have just not seen such a low-probability event yet. I have also not witnessed the buff activating on the on-hit effects of any strike: for instance, not on the pure good or acid, but only on the main physical damage. I have not done any testing with THF, but I see no a priori reason why glancing blows would be treated differently.

.

To turn process rate into the percent of time the buff will be on, we have to do a little math. If we call the quantity x = hits per 10 seconds, then we can do:
(1 - process rate) ^ x
This is the chance that we will have no buffs activate in a 10 second period. If we subtract this from one, we have the chance that at least one buff activated in the 10 second period. Now, it's also important to point out that the first 10 seconds of fighting do not have the benefit of any previous activations. To illustrate by example: at 12 seconds of fighting, any buff that activated from 3 seconds to 11 seconds is still active, but at 2 seconds only buffs that activated from 0 to 1 seconds are active. After this first 10 seconds, though, any other 10-second block of continuous fighting is identical.

.

We can go two ways with the above equation. We can solve that equation for x if we have a desired percent active time (set as P):
(1 - rate) ^ x = (1 - P)
x * ln (1 - rate) = ln (1 - P)
x = ln (1 - P) / ln (1 - rate)
The two limits for P give trivial results, which makes sense. To have the buff active 0% of the time, your hits per 10 seconds would have to be 0, which is another way of saying you aren't attacking. To have the buff active 100% of the time, your hits per 10 seconds would have to be infinite, because no matter how fast you attack there would always be a possibility that a finite number of hits would result in 0 buffs.

We can also go the other way, using a known value for x. We have to do a little bit of dimensional analysis for this:
x (hits per 10 seconds) * 6 (10 seconds per minute)
19/20 (hits per attack) * 2.05 (attacks per animation)

This works out to animations per minute, which we can obtain from Vanshilar's thread here. I have used 2.05 because my testing was on a tempest 3 exploiter. If your character was a 20 rogue with GTWF and Opportunist, you would use 1.83, and so on. If we used the 15% alacrity TWF number of 102.2 animations per minute, we get a value for x of 33.17. We go back to our earlier formula and we have:
1 - (1 - .013) ^ 33.17 = .352 = 35.2%
In other words, the buff will be active 35.2% of the time that the user is in continuous combat. For said rogue using Haste Boost IV, the value would be 35.9%. For a Prodigy-type (12 ranger 7 rogue 1 monk unarmed, and with Quickdraw why not), the value would be 38.8%. This is perhaps a more useful way to analyze the equation, as nothing gets more attacks per time than the last build described.

I want to revisit an earlier point about the sensitivity of these results to the precision of the process rate measurement. If the process rate was .015, or a mere two thousandths higher, the active rate for my exploiter increases to 39.4%, or over four percent higher. If it was fully .02, the active rate increases to 48.8%.

.

Now, keeping all this in mind, I would hold off deciding whether the item is great or junk until we know the stats of the Gauntlets.

[laeris]

Equip them on maxed attack speed toons: problem solved

If you're equipping them on your THF melee and sacrificing the claw set, you're doing it wrong

[redspecter23]

I've found them to be, at best, situational swap in items for my unarmed toons. The situation has to be one where I'm swinging almost constantly, not chasing anything, and would get a noticeable benefit from extra damage and hp. This has led me to use it under the following circumstances:

1. EVoN 6 dragon fight.
2. EDQ ball method
3. Shroud part 4 and 5, especially on higher difficulties

This is not the sort of gear I bother using on trash or mobile bosses. You lose so much time moving from mob to mob that a 10 second duration just erodes away too quickly.

I agree that either a higher proc rate or longer duration are in order. With the current proc rate, a 30 second duration would be great.

[Rawel_San]

If you could keep it up it would beat out the epic claw set by far dps-wise. We don't know what the gauntlet's
have on them but the set bonus is +2to-hit/+2to-dam with the +4str, +4 con that's an extra +4 to-hit over the
claw set on something you can farm in about an hour and an extra +2 to con over the epic claw set. You also get
25% stacking fort which is not something to sneer at. And that's not counting whatever the gloves bring to the
table. I can't help but feel that even if you could only keep it up for 50% of the time you would pretty much be
better off with them then claw set and that's assuming the gloves are really bad.

[noinfo]

If you could keep it up it would beat out the epic claw set by far dps-wise. We don't know what the gauntlet's
have on them but the set bonus is +2to-hit/+2to-dam with the +4str, +4 con that's an extra +4 to-hit over the
claw set on something you can farm in about an hour and an extra +2 to con over the epic claw set. You also get
25% stacking fort which is not something to sneer at. And that's not counting whatever the gloves bring to the
table. I can't help but feel that even if you could only keep it up for 50% of the time you would pretty much be
better off with them then claw set and that's assuming the gloves are really bad.

If your relying on the +4 con to keep you alive (+2 over claw) then you will have about 9 seconds max to live as these are situational even more so then level 14 madstone which give much nicer bonuses all round. Now you can argue that these are signifcantly easier to farm and its true but then the GH clickie in amarath is as well over the XC one.

Even if the gloves are not junk the claw sets 30% healing amp is just massive and the +4 damage from set bonus will mean that many would not trade a static +2 con over the situational +4 that may be good in tanking situations especially when relocation of heavy fort comes into it. It will be better for some builds and not others thats the nature of it. As it is now it is of no real benefit to anyone even a windstanced monk.

[Kinerd]

If you could keep it up it would beat out the epic claw set by far dps-wise. We don't know what the gauntlet's
have on them but the set bonus is +2to-hit/+2to-dam with the +4str, +4 con that's an extra +4 to-hit over the
claw set on something you can farm in about an hour and an extra +2 to con over the epic claw set. You also get
25% stacking fort which is not something to sneer at. And that's not counting whatever the gloves bring to the
table. I can't help but feel that even if you could only keep it up for 50% of the time you would pretty much be
better off with them then claw set and that's assuming the gloves are really bad.

Nobody can (expect to) keep the buff up 50% of the time, though. The ceiling I see is 48.4% of the time, and most builds would be well below that. With that said, I am also not convinced the Epic Claw set is dramatically better than the Fabricator set.

Fabricator
(4 Str, 4 Con, 4 Dex, 5% double strike, ) * 40% - Combat Infusion
Incite 20% - bracers
+2 to hit and damage, 25% fort - set
??? - gloves
Total: +2.8 to hit, +2.8/2.4 TWF damage or +3.2 THF damage, Incite 20%
+ 0.8 Reflex save, 2% double strike, 25% fort, ???

Epic Claw
6 Str, 30% Healing Amp - gloves
2 Exc. Con, Heavy Fort - bracers
+4 damage, Incite 20% - set
Total: +0 to hit, +4 damage, Incite 20%
+ 30% Healing Amp, 2 Exc. Con, slot consolidation with Heavy Fort and 6 Str