eChrono - overboard?

[mystafyi]

But the last run I did was only 4 pots for me, none I think for the other fvs or cleric. Mainly due to the new UI making heal so difficult for no ****ing reason.

maybe turbines reason is to make healers drink moar pots.... /tinfoil

[Moltier]

eChoro? 300 heal scrolls? mana pots? :O
Find new strategies. eChrono is still a joke once you learn the quest. You dont need any expensive resources there. Not even heal scrolls.
Whats you need there is 1 good tank, 2 healers and 1 good caster. Rest can be anything, but of course its good to have a bard.
The hardest part is the bank fight. There you need a coordinated team.
2nd fight is still a joke (now the fight may last 1 min long...). A good cc required here, if you just rush down like we do.
The final boss require a good tank, and a good cc caster. If that two provided, a single lazy healer can do the job, while the other divine(s) dot the boss.

The other raids are the same. We were too lazy before the update. Now we have to be carefull, conserve mana. A few weeks from now, and teams/pugs will adapt, and we will be back to the 0 pot epic raids.

[Khellendros13]

eChoro? 300 heal scrolls? mana pots? :O
Find new strategies. eChrono is still a joke once you learn the quest. You dont need any expensive resources there. Not even heal scrolls.
Whats you need there is 1 good tank, 2 healers and 1 good caster. Rest can be anything, but of course its good to have a bard.
The hardest part is the bank fight. There you need a coordinated team.
2nd fight is still a joke (now the fight may last 1 min long...). A good cc required here, if you just rush down like we do.
The final boss require a good tank, and a good cc caster. If that two provided, a single lazy healer can do the job, while the other divine(s) dot the boss.

The other raids are the same. We were too lazy before the update. Now we have to be carefull, conserve mana. A few weeks from now, and teams/pugs will adapt, and we will be back to the 0 pot epic raids.

So true and I feel the same for Chrono. Hopefully I can run it tonight and see what the fuss is about

[TheDjinnFor]

If this is the new norm in epics and elite raids, what is the actual point of grinding out eSoS, especially given that it's now more of a pain to do so?

Being a 5d6+10 (avg 27.5) weapon really makes up for a lot in comparison to, say, a 2d4+9 (avg 14) falchion. The +13.5 base damage goes a long way, because it increases glancing blow damage and is also multiplied into crits.

Whereas the falchion gets an extra +19.6 damage per swing through holy burst and greater bane (2d6 + 3d6 + 2d6*(6/20) = +19.6), the ESoS makes up for most of it with it's bigger base damage alone, even at 75% fort (13.5 =~ 14.85 with the ESoS crit profile against 75% fort). Factor in the boost to glancing blows, and its ahead. Factor in the marginally superior crit profile, and it grows farther the higher your damage bonus is.

The ESoS is only a bad raid boss choice if you can't break DR.

[Khellendros13]

Being a 5d6+10 (avg 27.5) weapon really makes up for a lot in comparison to, say, a 2d4+9 (avg 14) falchion. The +13.5 base damage goes a long way, because it increases glancing blow damage and is also multiplied into crits.

Whereas the falchion gets an extra +19.6 damage per swing through holy burst and greater bane (2d6 + 3d6 + 2d6*(6/20) = +19.6), the ESoS makes up for most of it with it's bigger base damage alone, even at 75% fort (13.5 =~ 14.85 with the ESoS crit profile against 75% fort). Factor in the boost to glancing blows, and its ahead. Factor in the marginally superior crit profile, and it grows farther the higher your damage bonus is.

The ESoS is only a bad raid boss choice if you can't break DR.

That's the conclusion I came to when a few were saying Esos is worse than lit2 vs Velah or the Abashai boss.
However if they have the electric weakness from a sorc going on...it will probably be too close to worry about.

I did Echrono last night, pugged about 6 or 7 spots. Went in with 3 healers but 1 of them DC'd before the bank, and we got a guildie on her sorc for the end fight.

Yea it was a bit harder, a lot more incoming damage on Bloodplate and Razor, but we finished fine without any pots being harmed even when both healers went down due to being too close to the action on Razor.

End fight was a bit more interesting, I have never been completely debuffed before.

Stop crying wolf !

[Dark_Helmet]

Good.

Epic raids should be hard.

That's why they are EPIC.

Epic raids should be EPIC! Hard is hard.

I agree that EPIC should take some resources for the untwinked. They needed a boost to make them challenging - I just can't run them to judge.


The issues I have is for the casual players trying to do raids at level. For example, the Reaver on normal (level 14) will disintegrate for 380 HPs. Following the sample builds from the Devs, you won't have that many HPs at level 14. I did some testing and saw him do 4 beams in a matter of about a minute. If you die, you are then out for the rest of the raid. Even the shroud puts you into a box for only a round.


They just went for the easy button, yet again, to appease a smaller portion of the audience. Each raid needed to be examined before they scaled them and tested using their sample characters (untwinked, low con ).

[twiliteslayer02]

We need healing DoT's.. or would it be HoT heals?? either way anything better that 1d3 hps per sec.


Just an idea.

[grodon9999]

All we need is a drop in the fortification to 50% so rogues aren't useless and the changes to the (older, haven't seen the House C ones yet) Epic raids are fine.

[Fancy_A_Fling]

My suggestion is bring more DPS. Just cause you have some with Red scale, and some with ESoS means nothing. You need strategy and MOAR DEE PEE ESS! My gimp fighter has ESoS and Claw set and puts out decent damage all around, i STILL wouldnt bring him to Echrono. No longer a Puggable raid unless you wanna sip pots unless u have people lowering its fort for the ESoS to actually do damage. at 80% fort hes almost immune to those big ol crits that do 850 + damage when in full on dps mode, so youll do 130 on average shot. (comparing any toon to my barb ) which tanked Echrono with no disaster's but a tiny fire dragon that killed our healers when he was at about 2% hp and we just finished it off anyways ( silverflame pots ) . Yes he hits hard. No its not a mana pot source. Get crafting. Holy Burst silver Falchion of Greater evil outsider bane = new echrono beater. IMO and that comes from a full twinked Barb. Esos is amazing... against 0% fort, or even 50% fort. but not nearly as good as some think against 80% fort. ALSO big key is to drop its fort ( imp sunder , jade strike etc ). Its VERY possible though. I also agree. Epic should be considered EPIC.

[patang01]

Good.

Epic raids should be hard.

That's why they are EPIC.

So SP chugging is considered Epic?

[Feralthyrtiaq]

I don't do Epics, don't heal Hard/Elite/Epic raids, don't need a single piece Epic Gear to get entertainment, enjoyment or challenge out of this game.

Ignoring "Endgame" = Instant Happiness in DDO for me. Gluck with your maor challenging raids and hope some A-Type personality people who want moar challenging healing scenarios roll up healers in the future.

Will keep my sanity by avoiding MA and LoB too.

[grodon9999]

I don't do Epics, don't heal Hard/Elite/Epic raids, don't need a single piece Epic Gear to get entertainment, enjoyment or challenge out of this game.

Ignoring "Endgame" = Instant Happiness in DDO for me. Gluck with your maor challenging raids and hope some A-Type personality people who want moar challenging healing scenarios roll up healers in the future.

Will keep my sanity by avoiding MA and LoB too.

Why? Did MA last night on normal in a pug (our leader did REALLY know the raid though and did an EXCELLENT job explaining stuff) and it was a lot of fun and NOT an SP-pot bloodbath. You'll be missing out one fun not being open to try the new stuff.