U11 Deadliest Warrior?

[Nick_RC]

A THF helf is still capable of out dpsing a THF horc fighter as long as you have your damage boost handy.

After a lot of thinking and number fiddling, I'm going to give helf a try and give up horc for a bit on my guy. Reason:

Say I choose 120 as my front number dmg on horc. A half elf version will do 13 points of dmg less per swing (6 PA 4 str 4 dmg = 13 dmg the helf doesn't have). so 120 -13 = 107 for helf, 25% of 107 = about 27 points of dmg when damaging boosting.

So, 27 + 107 = 134 dmg boosted front number on helf versys the 120 the horc was landing.

So a helf that normally does 13 points of dmg less than a horc does about 14 points of dmg more when boosted. MUCH higher burst dps potential.

Additionally, with the changes upcoming to hate tanks such as stalwarts and DoS I see myself main tanking less and utilizing the 3d6 backstab dmg from rogue dilettente more. If you count the backstab dmg from rogue dile, horcs aren't even competition.

Additionally, reaching the 13 dex to qualify for rogue dile also nets a better reflex save which is always nice.

Also, losing 4 str by going to helf is offset by the lack of a power attack line so= +1 extra net to hit.

Only real loss is the =4 str generates a -2 DC to tactics which I'm really not thrilled about.

However, this is a painfully close call for me to make.

Dont do it yet mate. Knowing you and the guys you run with you'll be running the new raids on epic. I think the sustained dps of the horc will be better in the raids unless they tame down epic from what it is on llama at the moment. I think helf will be better in easy stuff but horc ftw in long tough content.

N

[Cetus]

Dont do it yet mate. Knowing you and the guys you run with you'll be running the new raids on epic. I think the sustained dps of the horc will be better in the raids unless they tame down epic from what it is on llama at the moment. I think helf will be better in easy stuff but horc ftw in long tough content.

N

Yea, the sustainability of it all has been screwing with my decision but given that there are probably going to be more suitable maintanks out there now with the stalward and defender lines changed the static 3d6 static SA dmg might be useful.

Either way I'll be running content first on horc, then TR later when its clearer.

Cet

[Choopak]

Yea, the sustainability of it all has been screwing with my decision but given that there are probably going to be more suitable maintanks out there now with the stalward and defender lines changed the static 3d6 static SA dmg might be useful.

Either way I'll be running content first on horc, then TR later when its clearer.

Cet

Good point on changes for tanks, DoS and StD will be more common, so that 3d6 extra will matter! Cause that 3d6 will also benefit from the 25% damage from boost. Still, H-O seems superior on long runs (3 more boosts), but H-E wins in shorter/ easier fights a la Shroud (when shrines are abundant)
**** it's a tough call! in the end it's all about Beauty or the Beast, lol!

[grodon9999]

**** it's a tough call! in the end it's all about Beauty or the Beast, lol!

Which one is beauty?

[ayspam]

Dont do it yet mate. Knowing you and the guys you run with you'll be running the new raids on epic. I think the sustained dps of the horc will be better in the raids unless they tame down epic from what it is on llama at the moment. I think helf will be better in easy stuff but horc ftw in long tough content.

N

Certainly a tough decission, as you know I ve been chewing on this the last few weeks. Helf won, simply due to the fact that Horc females have big f**in astronaut heads.

[Miow]

Da deadliest will still be and will always be da casters!

[grodon9999]

Certainly a tough decission, as you know I ve been chewing on this the last few weeks. Helf won, simply due to the fact that Horc females have big f**in astronaut heads.

makes sense, a paper-bag fits much better on a helf's head.

[Cetus]

Good point on changes for tanks, DoS and StD will be more common, so that 3d6 extra will matter! Cause that 3d6 will also benefit from the 25% damage from boost. Still, H-O seems superior on long runs (3 more boosts), but H-E wins in shorter/ easier fights a la Shroud (when shrines are abundant)
**** it's a tough call! in the end it's all about Beauty or the Beast, lol!

In theory HORC gets 3 more boosts, but it was virtually impossible for me to fit in all 3. It'll be a difference of 2 in my case. Its a very painful call.

[jandhaer]

Ive moaned alot about release notes so far BUT....This is one of the changes im most excited about.

FINALLY there is a valid argument of why NOT to go Horc as a melee other then flavor. The fact that you can go for a sprint or marathon runner depending on how/who you play with can find a race thats completely valid and matches your play style.


Ill give credit where its do...
EXCELLENT work Devs

[Choopak]

After reading all your posts, and some more threads , here's what i summarize so far:
Half-orc barb will be the overall most DPS with THF, vs any kind of fort and longer quests. They have more HP, phenomenal STR and are just plain ugly! BUT, they are so boring to play...

Now if like me, you like the fighter approve, haste boost, and now, damage boost, feat to the wazzu and a bit of tactics; keep reading...

Half-orc fighter THF do 13 damage/ hit (thanks to Durnak for calc) but lack that burst damage capability. So on long quests, or with few shrines, they come ahead do to base damage being higher.
Half-elf fighter THF will be awesome at burst DPS, eclipsing even the mighty barb, with haste AND damage boost.

In the end, for me: half-elf wins!!! Here's why...
Most of the quests/ raid have usually plenty of shrines, so your boosts are there when it count: vs red names and bosses. Now only 2 pose a problem: EDQ and TOD elite. At least 1 more in U11, the one with the artificers... so it's 3 maybe 4 quests... ALL the rest you'll have plenty of boosts (more with Kensai set from TOD which you should wear anyway) and how many is that? 10-15 quests/ raids... look a lot more beneficial to me... And since it's been confirm that rogue dilitante extra damage benefit from the damage boost (so +3d6 +25% more) i'm even more incline toward Hal-Elf.
Lastly, Half-elf also bring more healing amp, and as show in a couples of posts, HP will become more important than ever, no more 400 HP drow ranger wannabe tanks in U11, you'll need to be fat like Nick said (like the term, hehe) so more healing amp = more chances for survival.

Thanks everyone for inputs and opinions, keep them coming, still not U11 yet, LOL

[Choopak]

Only 1 thing scare me now: the nerf bat!
Turbine been's real good at swinging the nerf bat, and as soon as those cry babies (aka barb) will complain about the "uberness" of damage boost + haste boost, the bat gonna hit. How hard i don't know, but we all know it can be pretty hard (barb PL, wings for FvS anyone) and then what?
Half-elf will fall back into the back rows, and melee will be dominate, once again, by half-orc and their mothers.
Hopefully, they'll take as much time as it took for barb PL...

[Cold_Stele]

Barb PL feat was a bug. It was clearly not working as intended and indentified as such by a dev, though not fixed for two(?) years.

Whatever it was, it wasn't a nerf (and I do have toons affected by it).

As Barbs (and FvS) also benefit from the Damage Boost changes I don't foresee any complaints there.

Haste+Damage boost is still inferior to HOrc IMO. It also makes an unpopular pay to play race appealing.

I don't see a nerf happening ever.

[Choopak]

Barb PL feat was a bug. It was clearly not working as intended and indentified as such by a dev, though not fixed for two(?) years.

Whatever it was, it wasn't a nerf (and I do have toons affected by it).

As Barbs (and FvS) also benefit from the Damage Boost changes I don't foresee any complaints there.

Haste+Damage boost is still inferior to HOrc IMO. It also makes an unpopular pay to play race appealing.

I don't see a nerf happening ever.

Hope you're right Cold_Stele, hope you're right... you analysis is sound dho... and you're also right about barb PL: it's was broken! Still took them 2 years to fix...
Now can you elaborate on how Half-orc is superior? I read a bunch of posts, and for barbarian they all agree: H-O is the best. As for fighter... most seems to go toward H-E, except for a few reasons (which i posted in my summary), and most seems to go for full fighter for capstone (a couple like the split with barb, either 18/2, or 12/8)
Would really like to read what you have to say about it...