Leaving DDO because of setting

[Xionanx]

It's got nothing to do with not seeing magic for what it is. It's simply that a lot of people find too much technology mixed with high fantasy distasteful. There's a reason why Ebberron ( and settings like it ) rank so low in popularity amongst PnP players.

Actually, I think that as far as "Campain" settings go its a mixed bag. When I DM'd I ran my OWN campaign setting, and actually every DM I ever played under did the same thing, not once did I ever see them pick up a particular campaign setting and say "were playing XXX setting" and usually we mixed and matches races and classess from all the different settings for our campaigns.

I dont think "Players Prefer" is the right concept your looking for, I think "Players are more familiar with" is more like it. And why is that? The multitude of books and games based on those settings compared to alternate settings. People have already built a mental image of what those settings are about and god forbid anyway attempt to "Alter" those images.

Which is WHY eberron was CHOSEN back in the day. This question came up REPEATEDLY in interviews and was even prominent in the BETA FAQ. They wanted to be free of all the preconcieved notions and built in lore of those other settings. They didn't want players expecting to run into elminister standing around in some town, and for that I AM ETERNALLY GRATEFULL!!!

Just look at "other" MMO's out there where the "lore" is so built in that players expect to fight side by side with thier "favorite" heros and take on the same villians that popped up the stories. (STO/DCUniverse/StarWars/Etc..) are fine examples of this. Which, I might add is why the NEW star wars game is going to be set in "The Old Repuplic" era, so people dont expect to see "Vadar/Luke/Han/Bobafett".

The "Technology" in eberron is know where near as bad as Planescape or Spelljammer yet people LOVE the Planescape setting.

Bah... I think most people cant see the forest for all the trees in blocking the view.

[bandyman1]

Actually, I think that as far as "Campain" settings go its a mixed bag. When I DM'd I ran my OWN campaign setting, and actually every DM I ever played under did the same thing, not once did I ever see them pick up a particular campaign setting and say "were playing XXX setting" and usually we mixed and matches races and classess from all the different settings for our campaigns.

I dont think "Players Prefer" is the right concept your looking for, I think "Players are more familiar with" is more like it. And why is that? The multitude of books and games based on those settings compared to alternate settings. People have already built a mental image of what those settings are about and god forbid anyway attempt to "Alter" those images.

Which is WHY eberron was CHOSEN back in the day. This question came up REPEATEDLY in interviews and was even prominent in the BETA FAQ. They wanted to be free of all the preconcieved notions and built in lore of those other settings. They didn't want players expecting to run into elminister standing around in some town, and for that I AM ETERNALLY GRATEFULL!!!

Just look at "other" MMO's out there where the "lore" is so built in that players expect to fight side by side with thier "favorite" heros and take on the same villians that popped up the stories. (STO/DCUniverse/StarWars/Etc..) are fine examples of this. Which, I might add is why the NEW star wars game is going to be set in "The Old Repuplic" era, so people dont expect to see "Vadar/Luke/Han/Bobafett".

The "Technology" in eberron is know where near as bad as Planescape or Spelljammer yet people LOVE the Planescape setting.

Bah... I think most people cant see the forest for all the trees in blocking the view.

And I agree with a lot of your points. The thing being;

Myself and nearly all of those DMs I've played with bought materials from FR, DL, DS, Ravenloft, ect, and used some of those ideas and materials to enrich our homebrewed campaigns. Even then, we ignored those things that weren't to our taste. That's why Ebberron is so far behind in sales. It wasn't just people being turned off by the world, it was the tech being so prevelant and ingrained that it pretty much made the materials useless even to the pickers and choosers. It's funny you should mention Spelljammer, as it suffered from a lot of the same problems. Look at how popular that setting was.

Planescape materials were useful for planer quests. And that's exactly what I've seen most peeps use the material for, completely ignoring Sigil, ect.


You can continue to believe Ebberron was " chosen ". It was, but not by the group of people you seem to think.

/shrugs

[Ivid]

Nostalgia. There's a certain sentiment that the first is always best.

Long Live Greyhawk!

[Matuse]

Eberron setting is going fullout twinkey now, and the game (whihc I haven't played in a year) is lame.

This is the part where you became invalid.

You haven't played in a year, but you're quitting now? Whatever dude.

I'd say we'll miss you, but first anyone would have to know who you are.

So we won't.

[MsEricka]

Buh bye

oh ya, and -1. If you haven't played in a year and you're just coming back to whine about quitting publicly it's just trolling.

[budalic]

It's got nothing to do with not seeing magic for what it is. It's simply that a lot of people find too much technology mixed with high fantasy distasteful. There's a reason why Ebberron ( and settings like it ) rank so low in popularity amongst PnP players.

Need citation.

From my experience, Eberron is at least as pupular as any other published setting, except for Forgotten Retards (which is more popular, but you're exposing yourself to risk that at least one of characters in game will be drow ranger).

[Jerevon]

So, Steampunk huh? I didn't even know what Steampunk was until I read this thread, and then went to Wiki Steampunk to read the background on that. Ok, cool, but Eberron is not Forgotten Realms and it can go in whatever direction they want to move it in, as far as I'm concerened. If this looks like Steampunk to you, so be it. Because, honestly at at thing point in the game I don't care. Is it true that the D&D license is up for renew in about a year and a half or so?

Anyway, when I first saw the Artificer in the eyes of the Eberron setting, the first thing that poped into my mind was "The Golden Compass". Sounds good, as long as they don't go overboard with the techno stuff and the old school sword swinging is still there and strong.

[bandyman1]

Need citation.

Lets look at what Wizards has to say about it;



Eberron is a campaign setting for the Dungeons & Dragons role-playing game, set in a period after a vast destructive war on the continent of Khorvaire. Eberron is designed to accommodate traditional D&D elements and races within a differently toned setting; Eberron combines a fantasy tone with pulp and dark adventure elements, and some non-traditional fantasy technologies such as trains, skyships, and mechanical beings which are all powered by magic.

Eberron was created by author and game designer Keith Baker as the winning entry for Wizards of the Coast's Fantasy Setting Search, a competition run in 2002 to establish a new setting for the Dungeons and Dragons game. Eberron was chosen from more than 11,000 entries, and was officially released with the publication of the Eberron Campaign Setting hardback book in June 2004. The campaign setting book was written by Baker, Bill Slavicsek, and James Wyatt.

In June 2005 the Eberron Campaign Setting book won the Origins Award for Best Roleplaying Game Supplement of 2004.

A new version of the Campaign Setting was released in June and July 2009 to bring the setting to the new 4th Edition of Dungeons and Dragons. Released were a Player's Guide, a Campaign Guide and an Adventure. No more 4th edition Eberron releases are planned.





I'll let you figure out just why that is.

/shrugs

[kitsune_ko]

I do have to agree with some of what the OP is saying.

Warforged are supposed to be armored constructs; but they do bear a very striking resemblance to something from Isaac Asimov.



The robot even has a Docent mounted in the right spot...

And I am still wondering why my guild airship has a "warp drive" installed belowdecks.

I do not care much for all the "High Technology" in DDO either; but I do live with it. But The Devs do make it hard for me sometimes.

I agree with him that there are more then a few quests/raids that are basically "Enter Factory; stop production".

And that also kills part of what is DnD for me; because mass production of anything becoming commonplace along with a mass transit system means that they moved fairly far into industrialization; which bumps Ebberon up to around at least the mid 1800's in terms of societal and technological development.

Much like how the English "Gentleman Adventurers" died out when the world became more easily accessable to everyone though the standardization, accessability, ease and lower cost of trasportation; I just have a very hard time meshing that a society with mass transportation, mass production capabilities and a high level of technology/Magic seems completely unable to deal with any problems in any way other way then hiring roving bands of adventurers and hoping for the best.

This is where Ebberon fails from traditional DnD. In most traditional adventures you were the only solution to the problem because there is no existing intercontinental/interplanar transportation systems to access outside help from. You used what you had locally, which just so happens to be the pack of adventureres riding/walking though town.

With mass transit and communication; this is just unlikely. If you had an undead problem needing to be dealt with; you do not grab somone walking by and say "Hey, can you deal with this?" you would send a letter/message to the nearest Church of Whatever; and say "Hey I really need some clerics!".

Same as if someone finds a super-secret lair of epic evilness; they would not just send 6 random people they find in there to deal with the problem; they would inform the authorities, would would contact the best people available to them for the job, which with access to a wide-ranging mass transit system, would give you a very large population of specialists to draw from indeed, and they would also most likely get one of these manufacturing plants to grind out a few dozen iron golems, and then send them all in together to deal with it.

I am not planning on quitting DDO anytime soon, but personally I could live with a lot less of the "Magic as Advanced Technology" that is being constantly added. It certainly lessens the appeal of DDO to me.

*EDITE*

And this is from Wiki; and why most of us would burn DMs alive on a pile of 4e books if they inisisted on using them

"Warforged in Fourth Edition

As of the release of the 4th Edition Dungeons and Dragons Monster Manual in June 2008, Warforged became an official part of the core Points of Light Campaign Setting, and by extension an encouraged part of all campaign settings (such as Greyhawk, the previous core campaign setting, and The Forgotten Realms).

The 4th Edition player's guide for Eberron also features a paragon path called the Self-Forged, which is for creatures that strive to make themselves like Warforged by replacing parts of their bodies with magical metal prosthetics, becoming fantasy-themed cyborgs."

Warforged and Cyborgs in non-Ebberon setings... sheesh..

[budalic]

A new version of the Campaign Setting was released in June and July 2009 to bring the setting to the new 4th Edition of Dungeons and Dragons. Released were a Player's Guide, a Campaign Guide and an Adventure. No more 4th edition Eberron releases are planned.

I'll let you figure out just why that is.

/shrugs

Do you realise you just make yourself look stupid?

Even if you add Neverwinter Campaign Guide (which techincally isn't tied to Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting and Player guide) to FR books - number of total setting books in 4e is: FR - 4 books; Eberron - 3 books; Dark Sun - 3 books. 4E has 3 books for EACH setting published, apart from that ******** Neverwinter Campaign Setting (there are separate Neverwinter and FR games... go figure*) tie-in for new game.

Also, given that WotC reprinted only FR, Eberron and Dark sun from previous editions, it seems to me that they expected those to make most money - and that they will be popular.

*As in, you'll get more use from Eberron Player Guide than from Neverwinter Campaign Guide book in an official WotC-sanctioned Living Forgotten Realms game.

EDIT: Completely rewritten post. Was too unreadable.

[Vellrad]

I wish they could stop translating FR to Polish, and finally translate Eberron.
I also wonder why they stopped publishing 4ed after PHB and DMG

[Ystradmynach]

Any sufficiently advanced magic is indistinguishable from technology.

[Mister_Peace]

So this is a problem, and when they had marketing for:
" You need to be ninja so you can fight better with zombie/pirates " ?
You said ok ?

ahahahahahahahaha
+1

[irivan]

For my 2 Cents, I too am not super thrilled about this being Eberron, I personally somewhat despise the theme of the world, but i do like the combat system, its what has kept me here, it is DnD, just not in the setting I would most like to play in, if i had my choice, the realms i would choose would be in this order.

1. Forgotten Realms
2. GreyHawk
3. DarkSun
4. RavenLoft
5. DragonLance
6. PlaneScape (City of Doors would be an interesting place)
7. Al-Quadim
8. Mystara
9. Lankhmar
10. Eberron

So as you can see Eberron would be my last choice, the other worlds listed are just so much more rich, i especially like and appreciate the Planer system in all the other systems more, although Eberron has modified and come around to that more recently. Forgotten Realms is far and away, more unique, thousands of stories to draw upon, know personalities that would be fun to interact with (not adventure with, but as quest givers, etc), Races like Elves and the Drow would not be bastarized and conquered by the giants, Dwarves while cool in Eberron, are much cooler in FR, it is just so much more in so many ways, down to the unique city state cultures, From Icewind Dale, Waterdeep, and Baldurs Gate, to Amn.

I think one day some one is really going to get this game right, i think that Turbine got in the ballpark, but i mean multiple cities, the proper campaign settings, the right edition, and a really really deep amount of work on quest design and game mechanics that will allow for flight, wall climbing, passwall, you name it....

when that happens i suspect that will be the game that i will be playing.

For now i will play this, primarily because there is nothing else that i have wanted to play, but the real danger for Turbine is, how long can they keep me here with all of the limitations to races, classes, game mechanics, etc...

When will WOTC now that they have their license back, commission some one to do what i am talking about?

Time will tell.

[Uska]

For my 2 Cents, I too am not super thrilled about this being Eberron, I personally somewhat despise the theme of the world, but i do like the combat system, its what has kept me here, it is DnD, just not in the setting I would most like to play in, if i had my choice, the realms i would choose would be in this order.

1. Forgotten Realms
2. GreyHawk
3. DarkSun
4. RavenLoft
5. DragonLance
6. PlaneScape (City of Doors would be an interesting place)
7. Al-Quadim
8. Mystara
9. Lankhmar
10. Eberron

So as you can see Eberron would be my last choice, the other worlds listed are just so much more rich, i especially like and appreciate the Planer system in all the other systems more, although Eberron has modified and come around to that more recently. Forgotten Realms is far and away, more unique, thousands of stories to draw upon, know personalities that would be fun to interact with (not adventure with, but as quest givers, etc), Races like Elves and the Drow would not be bastarized and conquered by the giants, Dwarves while cool in Eberron, are much cooler in FR, it is just so much more in so many ways, down to the unique city state cultures, From Icewind Dale, Waterdeep, and Baldurs Gate, to Amn.

I think one day some one is really going to get this game right, i think that Turbine got in the ballpark, but i mean multiple cities, the proper campaign settings, the right edition, and a really really deep amount of work on quest design and game mechanics that will allow for flight, wall climbing, passwall, you name it....

when that happens i suspect that will be the game that i will be playing.

For now i will play this, primarily because there is nothing else that i have wanted to play, but the real danger for Turbine is, how long can they keep me here with all of the limitations to races, classes, game mechanics, etc...

When will WOTC now that they have their license back, commission some one to do what i am talking about?

Time will tell.

Doesnt matter what world they use after this it will be 4E game and a lot of people including myself wont like that no matter what the world is as for myself and some others 4E isnt dnd

[mmitch5]

Well you are living but many are coming too ..
In my 25 years of role plying in computer I have nether experienced such a good game so
Think about it before

[bandyman1]

Do you realise you just make yourself look stupid?

Even if you add Neverwinter Campaign Guide (which techincally isn't tied to Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting and Player guide) to FR books - number of total setting books in 4e is: FR - 4 books; Eberron - 3 books; Dark Sun - 3 books. 4E has 3 books for EACH setting published, apart from that ******** Neverwinter Campaign Setting (there are separate Neverwinter and FR games... go figure*) tie-in for new game.

Also, given that WotC reprinted only FR, Eberron and Dark sun from previous editions, it seems to me that they expected those to make most money - and that they will be popular.

*As in, you'll get more use from Eberron Player Guide than from Neverwinter Campaign Guide book in an official WotC-sanctioned Living Forgotten Realms game.

EDIT: Completely rewritten post. Was too unreadable.

You're right, you're right.

I'm so sorry. I mean, of course we shouldn't read anything into the fact that they have no plans to release anything else for Eberron. That would be counter-intuitive, huh?

[Denegrator]

Hmm, there's a distinct lack of Mechanised spiders terrorising the wild frontier, and a super squeeky clean family friendly rap about the wild wild west. dammit, where is Will Smith when Selma Hayek needs saving???

I'd hardly call DDO steampunk op, but then again, I'd say it's about as close to steampunk as Will Smith is to being a credible actor, which is to say not at all.

[budalic]

You're right, you're right.

I'm so sorry. I mean, of course we shouldn't read anything into the fact that they have no plans to release anything else for Eberron. That would be counter-intuitive, huh?

Dammit, this is first time I wish there was no word filter here.

They have no plans to release anything else for ANY setting. That makes your argument pointless.

Research before you post. Thank you very much.

EDIT: To make it more clear - 4E rule is 1 year - 1 setting - 3 books for that setting. They broke that rule this year, they made Neverwinter Campaign Setting (because of the new Atari game) with only 1 book. And yes, Neverwinter Campaign Setting has nothing to do with FR books, apparently. Go figure.

[Pomdude]

I have been playing since I was 2. I am now 7 and I like this game. The big bad robots are nice to spank with my big weapon.
The nasty things in caves die with my blasted (sorry Mummy) fireballs.

I get to see naked female elves (sorry Daddy) and big hairy dwarves doing it to spiders whilst waiting for my Guild to make a decision to run a quest.

I get to have fun and not take life too seriously. I chat a lot to people who I have never met but seem like a decent bunch. I care for new people and embrace them into a world I enjoy. It takes me away from rl and I smile a lot when playing it. (Sorry Op.)

I played DnD when I was 1, even had the pleasure of playing a game hosted by the great Gary Gygax, I know what DnD is. I know what this is. I like what I like if I didn't I would lea.... (Bedtime - gn all)