Artificer and Veteran Status

[Mjesko]

A dev reply would be nice...

[Havok.cry]

I was under the impression that vet would be usable when it hits live. But I could be wrong and turbine might keep it from us. Will wait and see. It takes me a bit longer than an hour to level to 4, so I won't spend a dime on it till I can use vet with it, or till my wizard is done farming gear and is ready to TR.

[Entelech]

Bah.

I've seen nothing official from Turbine on this.

The only reason that makes any sense at all is "We were too lazy to fix the boat trainers."

All the other post-hoc rationales are nonsense or worse than nonsense. Particularly troublesome is the thought that the Devs have warped the game rules because their egos demand we play the Artificer from level 1 instead or level 4. Sony Online Entertainment suffered from that particular brand of insanity back in the days of Everquest -- the players mockingly referred to it as "The Vision" -- and it, more than anything, led to World of Warcraft's success when droves of EQ players left in disgust.

[MartinusWyllt]

Don't contracts like the EULA/T&Cs also have the base assumption that any changes made would be "reasonable"?

To take an extreme...say they changed the game to "Kittens and Kobolds Online" where you could either be a Kitten or a Kobold and you had to level through PvP pillow fighting in teams of either Kittens or Kobolds.

Would not the users under this kind of change not have legal recourse?

[Havok.cry]

Don't contracts like the EULA/T&Cs also have the base assumption that any changes made would be "reasonable"?

To take an extreme...say they changed the game to "Kittens and Kobolds Online" where you could either be a Kitten or a Kobold and you had to level through PvP pillow fighting in teams of either Kittens or Kobolds.

Would not the users under this kind of change not have legal recourse?

No they would not and no it was not made with that assumption. It was made with the assumption that the people it belongs to, which is turbine, not the players, can do whatever they want with their own property, to include renting the use of it to us players.

[Cordovan]

Artificers will be required to be played from level 1 when Update 11 is released to the live servers, just as they work on Lamannia right now. As to when this will change, the best answer I can give right now is that they will be available to use Veteran Status, Lesser, and Greater + Hearts of Wood on at a later date.

[patang01]

Artificers will be required to be played from level 1 when Update 11 is released to the live servers, just as they work on Lamannia right now. As to when this will change, the best answer I can give right now is that they will be available to use Veteran Status, Lesser, and Greater + Hearts of Wood on at a later date.

Does that mean we have to start with a 28 point build?

I surely hope not.

[guzzlr]

Artificers will be required to be played from level 1 when Update 11 is released to the live servers, just as they work on Lamannia right now. As to when this will change, the best answer I can give right now is that they will be available to use Veteran Status, Lesser, and Greater + Hearts of Wood on at a later date.

Since you did not specifically mention True Hearts of wood, we will be able to TR into Artis, correct?

[MartinusWyllt]

No they would not and no it was not made with that assumption. It was made with the assumption that the people it belongs to, which is turbine, not the players, can do whatever they want with their own property, to include renting the use of it to us players.

Honestly I think it would depend on how much one would be willing to spend in legal fees...though one can't really show actual losses; I expect most EULAs where there might be be breach of "good faith" as adopted on a state-state bases through the Uniform Commercial Code are completely pointless as there's not a loss that can be clearly demonstrated...unless a software change somehow literally melted your computer.

(Just a game, of course, not suggesting anyone take any action because it is just a game.)

[kinar]

Does that mean we have to start with a 28 point build?

I surely hope not.

Not sure why you would think that those two are linked.

Veteran status = 1000 favor.
32pt builds = 1750 favor.

You can build 28pt veteran characters.
Likewise, you can build 32pt non-vetran characters (that start at level 1).

He is just saying that you will not have the option of skipping levels 1, 2, and 3 if you want those levels to be arti.

If you wanted to create an artificer build that didn't take any arti levels until after 4, you would also be free to do that as well.

[Dawnsfire]

Since you did not specifically mention True Hearts of wood, we will be able to TR into Artis, correct?

TRs worked on Lam so I assume they will work on live. Of course assuming is dangerous these days ...

[kinar]

also, I didn't read the whole thread so this might have already been pointed out...however,

My guess that the real reason behind this is because the same code/game mechanic is used for the veteran boat trainer as is used for the lr/gr trainer.

They don't want someone to be able to use 2 +5 hearts to get 10 levels of arty and then TR to be able to get the Arti past life without actually playing an arti.

This forces all the completionists to play through 2 more lives instead of 1 (although I can't imagine many completionist builds would like to leave thier character sitting on the shelf for the length of time that would take).

[Cyr]

Artificers will be required to be played from level 1 when Update 11 is released to the live servers, just as they work on Lamannia right now. As to when this will change, the best answer I can give right now is that they will be available to use Veteran Status, Lesser, and Greater + Hearts of Wood on at a later date.

I would hope that at least someone at Turbine would realize the issue with selling a game feature and then not making it work with new content. It would be kind of like selling the monk class and then having a new raid where monks could not go in it (okay that would be worse, but same concept).

[guzzlr]

I figured that was the case. Can't imagine why you wouldn't be able to TR into an Arti, but ya never know.

[Jahmin]

Artificers will be required to be played from level 1 when Update 11 is released to the live servers, just as they work on Lamannia right now. As to when this will change, the best answer I can give right now is that they will be available to use Veteran Status, Lesser, and Greater + Hearts of Wood on at a later date.

Typical turbine dumb development decision

[Cordovan]

Since you did not specifically mention True Hearts of wood, we will be able to TR into Artis, correct?

Yes, you can TR into an artificer.

Does that mean we have to start with a 28 point build?

I surely hope not.

If you have the 32 point build option unlocked, then yes, you can start with a 32 point build.

[HarveyMilk]

Artificers will be required to be played from level 1 when Update 11 is released to the live servers, just as they work on Lamannia right now. As to when this will change, the best answer I can give right now is that they will be available to use Veteran Status, Lesser, and Greater + Hearts of Wood on at a later date.

Thanks Cordovan. Can you tell us why? Is this an intentional design or is it difficult to re-work the Veteran Status boat coding?

[bradleyforrest]

Yes, you can TR into an artificer.



If you have the 32 point build option unlocked, then yes, you can start with a 32 point build.

I paid real money for the TP that I spent on Veteran Status. Telling me that I can't use something in the advertised manner is a breach of good faith. I'm now reluctant to buy anything else from the DDO store.

[kinar]

I paid real money for the TP that I spent on Veteran Status. Telling me that I can't use something in the advertised manner is a breach of good faith. I'm now reluctant to buy anything else from the DDO store.

Are you people serious?

This is an amazing attitude for something so minor (and it isn't just you)...How long does it usually take you to reach level 4 on a character? Do you simply hate Korthos that much or is it actually a significant amount of time? For most "veteran" players, you are talking about less than an hours worth of time.

People on this planet REALLY need to get thier sense of entitlement put back in check and start caring about stuff that actually matters.

[Cordovan]

Thanks Cordovan. Can you tell us why? Is this an intentional design or is it difficult to re-work the Veteran Status boat coding?

This is an intentional design decision, and not related to vet status coding. I will leave it to one of the devs to expound further, but in general the devs want people to play the new class from level 1 when the class makes its live debut.