Fabricator's Bracers testing

[grodon9999]

I don't see many stalwarts wearing icy though junk and that was the point. I'd rather go Gloves-helm-cloak for three piece tanking on a stalwart. The bracers are really just a wasted slot. Non tod I'd swap boots in for gloves. Course I already run fairly high healing amp on my tank already enough to where heal scrolls top me off so the 30% is overkill.

We've got at least 10 in guild right now in various stages of development.

Big difference regarding amp is I'm a high 80s AC tank (damned chattering ring), you're a low 90s. That 30% healing amp is huge. I also tank epics stuff all the time where I'm pretty much an evasion-barbarian so the high HP and healing amp makes it easier for my hjealers.

As for Lit II's niether of the new raids are gonna be good for lit II's. They don't break dr and stuff is highly resistant to lightning. I believe they have 50% absorb from testing. Min II is the only shroud weapon that will break dr of LOB. The titans in Master artificer req addy for dr also.

Does he have lightning resistance? The Artificer can cast the spell for Adamantite DR bypass. Though with the short life-spans tanks will likely have I suspect you're better off just keeping the Mineral IIs in your hands.

Holy Burst Adamantite of Great Construct banes for all my mooks is next on my crafting list.

The big thing thoug is if you are having issues fitting in gear then Icy's may be something to look at for a pajama wearing tank.

I guess it depends on the toon, I just haven't found a better option on mine that doesn't include icys.

[LeLoric]

We've got at least 10 in guild right now in various stages of development.

Big difference regarding amp is I'm a high 80s AC tank (damned chattering ring), you're a low 90s. That 30% healing amp is huge. I also tank epics stuff all the time where I'm pretty much an evasion-barbarian so the high HP and healing amp makes it easier for my hjealers.



Does he have lightning resistance? The Artificer can cast the spell for Adamantite DR bypass. Though with the short life-spans tanks will likely have I suspect you're better off just keeping the Mineral IIs in your hands.

Holy Burst Adamantite of Great Construct banes for all my mooks is next on my crafting list.



I guess it depends on the toon, I just haven't found a better option on mine that doesn't include icys.

Not saying the amp isnt huge and when I can swap the boots in I go with the gloves but in TOD's I go with charged and like I said with other amp sources available I get topped off with heal scrolls most of the time.

Lord of blades has what appears to be lightning absorb 50% similar to what golems now have along with a lightning resist. This negates all smaller lightning hits and halves the big strikes. His dr is adamantine/good. Yeah the holyburst addy gcb is the way to go here. Sad cause I just made my boys all chaotic burst addy's of GCB for marut fights and portal beaters.

[maddmatt70]

I would say that concerning the new raids the tanking ability has shifted more from the pajama wearers to the high hp shield toting stalwarts with shield mastery feats. Not that the pajama wearers can't do it but the defender's will be the better choice often.

Yeah I was afraid the devs would do that. There is this segment of the forum population and in game people who feel that only characters in full suit of armor covered from head to toe should be able to get ac/be able to get good defense. I disagree with that and think that there is room for the ac pajama wearing types. My rogue is dex based and not the optimum level split from a dps standpoint so I have made some serious dps sacrifices for him, but what have you.

[grodon9999]

Yeah I was afraid the devs would do that. There is this segment of the forum population and in game people who feel that only characters in full suit of armor covered from head to toe should be able to get ac/be able to get good defense. I disagree with that and think that there is room for the ac pajama wearing types. My rogue is dex based and not the optimum level split from a dps standpoint so I have made some serious dps sacrifices for him, but what have you.

You haven't made nearly the DPS sacrifice of a guy holding a shield!

I like the shield mastery stuff absorbing the grazes that nail us on a 13+, that's the balance. Things is you really can't build a SUSTAINABLE AC above what can work on the current Elite Horoth on a toon that actually has any decent threat. DEX based really ain't an option.

[maddmatt70]

You haven't made nearly the DPS sacrifice of a guy holding a shield!

I like the shield mastery stuff absorbing the grazes that nail us on a 13+, that's the balance. Things is you really can't build a SUSTAINABLE AC above what can work on the current Elite Horoth on a toon that actually has any decent threat. DEX based really ain't an option.

Well the above is just not true. My current rogue is pretty solidly at the threshold on elite Horoth with a bard song really as only outside buff (counts ship and yugo pots of course), but I figure with a little bit more gear (including new stuff) and a lesser reincarnate I can get 5-10 ac without any real gimpage. Junts was throwing some numbers at me a while back about how when he swapped to his two hander on his shield tank he was competing with me on my twf ac build from a dps standpoint.

As far as threat is concerned sounds to me like both you and Leloric should experiment a bit with threat builds. You probably guess that I do not run with a bunch of shoddy melee. These guys I run with can throw it down. Any build with pally righteousness has a chance at holding aggro (if you saw my guildy Dark-Star's post he came up with an alternative to pally levels with the hate armor/midnight greeting dex concept). I did not dump strength on my rogue she hits about 30 str so not absolutely horrendous, etc. Anyway this is a side conversation.

[grodon9999]

Well the above is just not true. My current rogue is pretty solidly at the threshold on elite Horoth with a bard song really as only outside buff (counts ship and yugo pots of course), but I figure with a little bit more gear (including new stuff) and a lesser reincarnate I can get 5-10 ac without any real gimpage. Junts was throwing some numbers at me a while back about how when he swapped to his two hander on his shield tank he was competing with me on my twf ac build from a dps standpoint.

Junt's pally can hit 84 AC THFing with an ESoS. That's okay for normal and hard Horoth, he needs the shield for elite. If we' taking things up a notch where Elite Horoth is the new "easy" boss that 84 ain't gonna cut it.

As far as threat is concerned sounds to me like both you and Leloric should experiment a bit with threat builds. You probably guess that I do not run with a bunch of shoddy melee. These guys I run with can throw it down. Any build with pally righteousness has a chance at holding aggro (if you saw my guildy Dark-Star's post he came up with an alternative to pally levels with the hate armor/midnight greeting dex concept). I did not dump strength on my rogue she hits about 30 str so not absolutely horrendous, etc. Anyway this is a side conversation.

Pallies get divine righteousness so you have more leeway with how much DPS you can give up while still maintaining aggro. Fighters don't have that option.

[Astraghal]

I don't know if DoS/Stalwart stances are currently working but is it even possible for a Fighter to hold aggro with just 10% and 20% incite items plus the 50% hate increase from the stance and nothing else?

Is Intimidate a reliable way make up the difference?

Edit: I thought I saw in some posted screen shots that the other half of the Fabricator set is a ring.

[maddmatt70]

Junt's pally can hit 84 AC THFing with an ESoS. That's okay for normal and hard Horoth, he needs the shield for elite. If we' taking things up a notch where Elite Horoth is the new "easy" boss that 84 ain't gonna cut it.

Yeah you use the shield when you tank and use the two hander when you are not. That was what Junts was saying to me and if the ac threshold is less he uses the two-hander seems to make sense. 95% of the game you would never want to use a shield on an S&B tank currently.

Pallies get divine righteousness so you have more leeway with how much DPS you can give up while still maintaining aggro. Fighters don't have that option.

yeah man there is a nice build put out by monkey archer that you should look at. Dex based 12 fighter 6 pally 2 monk. It has a similiar ac to my rogue grumblegut but more strength and hp (think its 750ish hp) , it does have lower reflex saves and not rogue trap skills of course. You should also take Dark-Star's build seriously I think that concept with the Chaos Robe is a nice find and will work. Dark-Star is an old ac expert from way back - heck it is a shame he does not currently have an ac character been on him to do so for a while now..

[LeLoric]

I don't know if DoS/Stalwart stances are currently working but is it even possible for a Fighter to hold aggro with just 10% and 20% incite items plus the 50% hate increase from the stance and nothing else?

Is Intimidate a reliable way make up the difference?

yes and yes

With the fighter it depends on the amount of dps you are putting out too.

With pally the 100% from divine righteousness makes it even less an issue.

[grodon9999]

I don't know if DoS/Stalwart stances are currently working but is it even possible for a Fighter to hold aggro with just 10% and 20% incite items plus the 50% hate increase from the stance and nothing else?

Is Intimidate a reliable way make up the difference?

yes, if the melees take off their extra threat generation stuff and/or spam diplo (even if they have no ranks).

[LeLoric]

Well the above is just not true. My current rogue is pretty solidly at the threshold on elite Horoth with a bard song really as only outside buff (counts ship and yugo pots of course), but I figure with a little bit more gear (including new stuff) and a lesser reincarnate I can get 5-10 ac without any real gimpage. Junts was throwing some numbers at me a while back about how when he swapped to his two hander on his shield tank he was competing with me on my twf ac build from a dps standpoint.

As far as threat is concerned sounds to me like both you and Leloric should experiment a bit with threat builds. You probably guess that I do not run with a bunch of shoddy melee. These guys I run with can throw it down. Any build with pally righteousness has a chance at holding aggro (if you saw my guildy Dark-Star's post he came up with an alternative to pally levels with the hate armor/midnight greeting dex concept). I did not dump strength on my rogue she hits about 30 str so not absolutely horrendous, etc. Anyway this is a side conversation.

I play with junts I am in his guild. The big issue is both you and him run divine righteousness which really makes threat non existant. My 18 ftr/2 rog s/b stalwart and my 13 rog/6ftr/1 monk lack righteousness. I still run threat gear and stack threat modifiers but it becomes hard when dealing with max geared dps characters to keep aggro all the time. Efang will shore up any threat issues I had with the stalwart however. The rog build is a different story I have him pretty much maxed on threat modifiers without going pally as I run 25% stance boost, brute fighting, 10 and 20% hate from items.

[Astraghal]

I forgot to include 15% from the set bonus. So including the other threat bonuses I already mentioned, would a TWF Fighter with Khopesh/Dwarven Axe, be able to hold aggro?

I take it from the above comments that Intimidate is unreliable still.

[grodon9999]

yeah man there is a nice build put out by monkey archer that you should look at. Dex based 12 fighter 6 pally 2 monk. It has a similiar ac to my rogue grumblegut but more strength and hp (think its 750ish hp) , it does have lower reflex saves and not rogue trap skills of course.

See that I could get behind. I've considered the 6 pally splash on Meat for his 34/36 point lives but right now the 9 points of damage a swing out-weighs the need for Divine righteousness.

You should also take Dark-Star's build seriously I think that concept with the Chaos Robe is a nice find and will work. Dark-Star is an old ac expert from way back - heck it is a shame he does not currently have an ac character been on him to do so for a while now..

I'd have to see it in action to be sold.

[LeLoric]

I forgot to include 15% from the set bonus. So including the other threat bonuses I already mentioned, would a TWF Fighter with Khopesh/Dwarven Axe, be able to hold aggro?

I take it from the above comments that Intimidate is unreliable still.

Intim is far from unreliable. Works great with a shield. Not quite as much without but still can help.

I can keep aggro wiuth s/b over maxed out dps toons on my stalwart. It's touch and go with thing like chains from suulu or pws from horoth causing lost threat but it's still pretty reliable. As I stated earlier Efang changes will pretty much render this a non issue however.

[grodon9999]

I forgot to include 15% from the set bonus. So including the other threat bonuses I already mentioned, would a TWF Fighter with Khopesh/Dwarven Axe, be able to hold aggro?

I take it from the above comments that Intimidate is unreliable still.

Absolutely. MyDDO some of these animals, my stalwart holds aggro over them while they are going all-out. This was from an elite ToD a few month back when he was the Sulu tank.

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/94/run1i.jpg/

[Thrudh]

I don't know if DoS/Stalwart stances are currently working but is it even possible for a Fighter to hold aggro with just 10% and 20% incite items plus the 50% hate increase from the stance and nothing else?

Is Intimidate a reliable way make up the difference?

I can usually hold aggro with just the 15% Stalwart Defender ToD set, and the 33% SD stance (I only have 12 levels of fighter). Give me 10 seconds of haste boost before you jump in though please.

Occasionally, I have a real maxed out DPS guy in my PUG groups who grabs aggro, and I have to use intimidate once.

[Ravoc-DDO]

...
Crafted +2 dodge Trinket/w lg guild slot
...

Don't mean to derail here, but where do you get a craftable trinket with guild slot?

[Mister_Peace]

Does he have lightning resistance? The Artificer can cast the spell for Adamantite DR bypass. Though with the short life-spans tanks will likely have I suspect you're better off just keeping the Mineral IIs in your hands.

When you die, your weapons lose their buffs?

[maddmatt70]

Don't mean to derail here, but where do you get a craftable trinket with guild slot?

I believe it is possible. There is such a thing as an unbound trinket (one of my guildies has one) and there is no reason you can not find a guild slotted trinket. I have not seen one, but they likely exist. This all being said there is something wierd about the trinket loot tables. I pulled a btc craftable trinket which is worthless on a non crafter. I have no idea why it was btc.

[Diyon]

I believe it is possible. There is such a thing as an unbound trinket (one of my guildies has one) and there is no reason you can not find a guild slotted trinket. I have not seen one, but they likely exist. This all being said there is something wierd about the trinket loot tables. I pulled a btc craftable trinket which is worthless on a non crafter. I have no idea why it was btc.

It was possibly bound to character because you got it before they made the BtC->BtA shift?