Artificer: Meh..

[Grace_ana]

What I've found is that arties are way overpowered at early levels, and then they rapidly get more in line at mid levels. I was able to basically pike my way through quests up to level 5 or so by watching my puppy run around and kill everything. Then all of a sudden, oh no we're all dying auuuugggghhhh. Had I had twinked gear (I'm playing an arty with just what I pick up along the way) I'd probably be sailing until about lvl 10 or so. I'd prefer to see the abilities match more with the level so it is a bit tougher in the early levels. Otherwise, what we end up with is arties in mid-levels that don't really know how to play their class effectively and are a mess in groups ("Dude, I will totally take this mob myself, no worries *zerg and die* *** hjeal me!!!!!!!), or people that play them from the beginning and get bored.

Still not thrilled that they can do traps as a class skill. I'd prefer that they can do them, but maybe not until a certain level or that they need to take a feat or enhancement line for them. I think that would keep the balance with rogues much better.

[Aashrym]

My take on Artificers:

- They are essentially ranged bards. If you expect them to be omgikillyouall, sorry, roll a sorcerer or fvs instead.

- If you DONT spend a chunk of your mana buffing your party (at the very least 1 weapon infusion per party member) then you're being about as useful as the bard who doesn't sing songs. Yes, you still will contribute your own DPS, and you could use your mana to toss some heals or whatever, but you're seriously missing the point.

- A lot of people will seriously miss the point and not do that weapon infusion thing

- Arties have very poor crowd control, at least until capstone. Anytime you are facing enemies you can't kill by the time they're in melee range with you, you are in trouble, or when facing an enemy spell caster that will crowd control YOU while also blasting you while you try to avoid his melee friends and you desperately try to get the **** pet to intimidate so you can try to finish off the pesky caster. After capstone you have moderate CC.

This class solos well. It does not solo nearly as well as a warforged wizard, sorcerer, or favoured soul, nor is it anywhere near as powerful. It IS more powerful than a bard however it does not have it's crowd control abilities. (which are seriously underused by a lot of people anyway)

I question whether people who "walked all over easily in korthos gear" were always doing quests 1 or 2 levels over them on elite (thus walking all over vale quests on elite at level 14, f.ex) or were instead running the game on normal at level or higher than quest level, which is something ANY class can do.

I was doing quests under 1 or 2 under level at first, but it was hard to keep under level on quest chains with the XP bonus. I think I would like to start that again without the XP bonus that's been going on and only use auto fire at low levels to see how much of a difference it makes.


Using a repeater kicks @$$ at level 1 regardless of who is actually using it right now so I think there might be some overlap in opinions on artificers that should really be redirected at repeaters. Separating the two is complicated IMO because it is a good freebee at level 1 for artificers.


The difference between the artificer, bard, and sorc I made for comparison was phenomenal because the bard and sorc did not have repeaters, did not have the damage output, and while the sorc could do a decent job with Niac's the repeater was doing better. The bard had a choice at first level of self healing with SP or some form of CC, or a utility/buff spell. 1 song and 1 spell and 1 feat in comparison is really apparent on what can be done between a bard and an arti. I started a rogue too going TWF but that doesn't work well at low levels anyway.


Lack of crowd control was noticeable compared to arcane casters. I relied a lot on buffs and moving, fusillade is skookum. Getting held or stunned sucks but is pretty easily fixed by going WF instead of human. Insightful reflexes made for a decent reflex save. WF immunities and insightful reflexes puts arti's up there well enough.


Resist energy at first level too, but a 1-minute duration didn't exactly do much without some timing.


I found the group healing by throwing potions worked well once I had some potions. Mass healing ability at level one is rather strong given the cost of twinking cure light wounds potions. Of course strong healing at low levels is almost an oxymoron given nearly anyone can do it with a wand.


I think there is some crowd control in some of the spells but I did not explore those really. I was more into playing with the crossbow and buffs. No focus on the few spells but they look like some can compare with cleric / fvs CC spells. I was concerned the DC's would end up lower and with the cost of single target buffing I would rather not also be trying to use those spells, except maybe as additional damage sometimes.


Delera's I was doing hard at level and the damage reduction while using the Korthos repeater was noticeable, as well as lacking crits, but I supplied my repeater with flaming bolts that I created and I had access to the flaming turret by then. Between the occasional turret and the bonus damage on the repeater from augments, rune arm, enhancements, feats, and fire damage on the bolts with the rate of fire I was still walking all over the quest chain.


Higher levels and the competition with damage, CC, and instant killing and this class seems fine. Lower levels and this class feels like a high level caster with the repeater.


I would like to note that I did not feel like I actually had a lot of spells while leveling up. That was another reason I was focusing on the crossbow. I didn't see anywhere in the game to buy the unique scrolls so I inscribed what dropped and I didn't seem to have a lot of slots available. I saw that as a limiting factor in addition to he mostly single target nature of he infusions.


Just a few more opinions tossed in there.

[sigtrent]

For high level it will have to find a niche. Nothing wrong with blade barrier of course but shallow SP means less potent than other BB artists.

It's no tank and its no healer and its not peak DPS, so Support is what it does in mainstream ddo vet play (aka zerging high challenge quests).

For casual play or PD or Static its a great class offering a pretty all in one package + great use of consumables. It works best with a slow and steady kind of approach to encounters using the turret as a trap and kiting focus and using ranged to leverage survival and time = kills.

Played well, there may be some strong DPS in the class, but It's going to take some time, gear and thinking about combos to make it work out. The infusions plus the right greensteel repeater, plus pet, plus aoe, plus rune arm could add up to something kind of beefy, but its going to take work and coordination not need in a raging barbarian that is a lot more focused in how it cranks damage.

I think its best traits are if you like being support and jack of all trades and aren't so much an elite grinder. Well geared an artificer is very resourceful and will always be helping the party if not dominating it.

I suspect we will see lots for a while, but in the end they will be as rare or more rare than bards... but there is some chance we will find the magic keys to a very nasty kind of build.. slim chance but I think it takes some time for these things to shake out.

[moorewr]

I've been puzzling out their raid role, and I have similar concerns to the OP's..

I do think they'll be allowed in the raid for damage prevention buffs. I need to study the details but I can see ablative armor on the peeps, and of course radiant forcefield on the tank.

Ranged dps, if it is enough to be effective, often causes meshing problems with melees, as it pulls mobs away from them. I recall an early Tower run with a certain arcane archer-spec bard... of course, if it isn't effective, that problem doesn't come up, but the ranged player might well feel useless.

I was beginning to suspect the rune arm was marginal. I think it needs to be seen whether you can make a viable TWF or THF melee artificer on the one hand, and whether you can really generate a useful dps yield with an IPS-spec repeater build.

The pet is .. well, a demo of tech for other pets and summons. I can see them having some marginal use.. at least to pin down some of the mobs I'm kiting to pew pew.

In sum: a niche role; less generally useful than a bard but with some burst dps potential.

[Seikojin]

Actually, I think the arty is just fine as is, minus the bugs. I think they aren't OP, or underpowered. They, much like bards, are pretty good up to a point, but never are meant to solo end game content. No class is 'supposed' to be able to solo everything.

I think they are exactly what I thought they would be, plus a rune arm. Item buffers with pets. I think the abilities they offer are great, wish some had aoe versions, but that can be down the line.

I think Turbine did a really good job for a new class out of the box. Bugs always exists, but balance wise, this class is just fine.

[Aashrym]

Actually, I think the arty is just fine as is, minus the bugs. I think they aren't OP, or underpowered. They, much like bards, are pretty good up to a point, but never are meant to solo end game content. No class is 'supposed' to be able to solo everything.

I think they are exactly what I thought they would be, plus a rune arm. Item buffers with pets. I think the abilities they offer are great, wish some had aoe versions, but that can be down the line.

I think Turbine did a really good job for a new class out of the box. Bugs always exists, but balance wise, this class is just fine.

I disagree. Arti's are incredible at low levels. I think how much that matters in the grand scheme of things might not be so much. No one builds a character planning on playing level 1-12 so where they start out is not as important as where they end up.

I don't think they are fine for the content they will be in but how much does that really matter later on if Turbine leaves them as is. I'll give my feedback and most likely play one live either way. I've been waiting for them for some time.

[moorewr]

I was considering the end-game buffs..

Artificers will be welcome in those raids for Deadly Weapons. This is the golden ticket.

They'll be useful to buff puppies.

Radiant Forcefield on tanks - depending on details of duration and cooldown.

Positive Energy Infusion - if it stacks with everything - at least on tanks.

Depending on effect type, Toughen and Reinforce Construct for WF tanks.

[Aashrym]

I was considering the end-game buffs..

Artificers will be welcome in those raids for Deadly Weapons. This is the golden ticket.

They'll be useful to buff puppies.

Radiant Forcefield on tanks - depending on details of duration and cooldown.

Positive Energy Infusion - if it stacks with everything - at least on tanks.

Depending on effect type, Toughen and Reinforce Construct for WF tanks.

Maybe, so long as they actually buff. Otherwise they might not be so welcome. Just like bards, build them any which way but in the long run they are accepted for the buffs; versatility doesn't always mean much.

[moorewr]

Maybe, so long as they actually buff. Otherwise they might not be so welcome. Just like bards, build them any which way but in the long run they are accepted for the buffs; versatility doesn't always mean much.

That's a given - you may be a battle cleric/fvs, but you still have to heal raids. You may be an evasion melee warchanter (mine is!) but you'd better sing for your beer money.