"Greater Evil Outsider Bane is Better"

[TheDearLeader]

I've heard this before when linking a +5 Holy Burst Silver of GLOB to people.

"Oh yeah, that's nice, but GEOB would be better."

I fail to understand the logic behind this statement.

GLOB takes a LDS, GCOB takes a Demon's Blood. GEOB takes... both.

So if you're crafting for a TWF character, and want to acutally, gasp, bust DR? You can either craft appropriate to the Outsider, and spend 2 LDS and 2 Demon Bloods, or craft "better", spend 4 LDS, 4 Demon Bloods... and do the same damage.

What's the incentive exactly for GEOB? Same to-hit, and damage, and if you want to maximize DPS, you better be busting DR, so you're going to be using the appropriate metal type.

Thoughts?

[QuantumFX]

The only time Greater Evil Outsider Bane would be considered a better investment is on Holy Handwraps of GEOB for a Shintao monk. And that’s only because of inventory issues. (You could still go Axiomatic Burst of GCOB and Holy of GLOB if you wanted SUPERUBERDUPER DPS!)

[kernal42]

You've obviously made the right crafting decision. The only people who should prefer GEOB are:
Shintao Monks
Archers

However, if Lammania is considered, you can toss (via ally or scroll) Cold Iron onto your HBSGEOB rapier and use that same weapon vs. Lailat.

Not worth the trouble for the slot consolidation, probably.

-Kernal

[DaSawks]

There is this theory going around that most of the endgame bosses are Evil Outsiders. Meh.

[rimble]

nt

[QuantumFX]

Archers

Good call. I would also add crossbow users as well.

However, if Lammania is considered, you can toss (via ally or scroll) Cold Iron onto your HBSGEOB rapier and use that same weapon vs. Lailat.

I think, at that point, I would rather get an elemental weapons buff. (Shock for Devils, Acid for Demons.)

[TheDearLeader]

There is this theory going around that most of the endgame bosses are Evil Outsiders. Meh.

They are also either Chaotic or Lawful, as well, and have Metallic DR components that need bypassed accordingly. Meh.

[~spathic]

That the GCOB also helps against the eladrin and occasional djinn, which the GEOB would not. Not really that important a point for the few flagging quests you'll encounter them, but a little more value added for the GCOB.

[Malky]

The only downside of GLOB is that it doesn't affect tieflings (and dream scourges too but that's less of a concern).

With GEOB being 20ish levels above GLOB... well i'm using GLOB as well atm

[TheDearLeader]

The only downside of GLOB is that it doesn't affect tieflings (and dream scourges too but that's less of a concern).

With GEOB being 20ish levels above GLOB... well i'm using GLOB as well atm

Actually, GLOB does affect Tieflings. I have confirmed this on multiple occasions, but I suggest that you go and do the same for your own benefit. The Dream Scourges are also damaged by GLOB.

KotC enhancement based "Bane" damage does not damage Tieflings - apparently they do not fall under the whole "Fiendslaying" thing. However, the ToD Set Bonus damage does affect Tieflings, as does normal bane types.

So... sorry, your downside is invalid.

[JollySwagMan]

Was the item link solicited?

[TheDearLeader]

Was the item link solicited?

This isn't any one particular occasion, but normally, yes. What brought me to the forums was that I'd heard this circular logic of trying to defend GEOB as "better" than GLOB multiple times.

[Thoradin]

Glad you posted this forum I have been wondering about this for a couple days and may have found my answer.. there ARE some bosses in epics and raids that when you inspect them are simply listed as "evil outsider". Not chaotic or lawful so i assume that you would specifically need GEOB instead of GCOB or GLOB. And unless i am mistaken the GEOB will hit any of the same critters that the GCOB/GLOB will hit. In short, it would seem that the GEOB cuts back on inventory spaces needed AND hits some things the other 2 will not.

If I am mistaken please feel free to let me know before I craft my stuff

[TheDearLeader]

Glad you posted this forum I have been wondering about this for a couple days and may have found my answer.. there ARE some bosses in epics and raids that when you inspect them are simply listed as "evil outsider". Not chaotic or lawful so i assume that you would specifically need GEOB instead of GCOB or GLOB. And unless i am mistaken the GEOB will hit any of the same critters that the GCOB/GLOB will hit. In short, it would seem that the GEOB cuts back on inventory spaces needed AND hits some things the other 2 will not.

If I am mistaken please feel free to let me know before I craft my stuff

You are mistaken, I'll hook you up with why.

When you're living life as an outsider, you live it in two ways.

You're not just an Evil Outsider - you're a Lawful/Chaotic Outsider, as well. There are currently no Neutral Evil Outsiders in DDO.

These "bosses" you speak up - let me go out on a limb here:
Arraetrikos - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Horoth - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Suulomades - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Turigulon - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Laitlat - Demon, Chaotic Evil Outsider
....

The list goes on. These "end game bosses" are either Devils, or they are Demons. They will either be hit by Lawful, or Chaotic, Outsider Bane, as well as Evil Outsider Bane.

Ah, but this only tells half the story. We also have the "damage reduction" feature in Dungeons and Dragons.

Arraetrikos - Devil, Silver + Good
Horoth - Devil, Silver + Good
Suulomades - Devil, Silver + Good
Turigulon - Devil, Silver + Good
Laitlat - Demon, Cold Iron + Good

So, when you're crafting weapons, you'll have two sets - Holy (Burst) + Silver for Devils, and Holy (Burst) + Cold Iron for Demons. Why? Because you want to bust DR. So, no "Inventory Space" is preserved here - you will have two unique weapons/weapon sets.

So then, we can safely assume you will have these two different kids of weapons for the different types of Evil Outsiders currently in game. Well... if each type of weapon is already specifically crafted to counter one enemy type, why not also make that Bane Suffix affect just that type?

GEOB is almost as expensive as individually crafting both a GLOB and GCOB, and because it does not assist you with the "DR" component, it provides no additional benefit to you as a player.

[Thoradin]

LOL thanks.. yes i am aware of DR breaking and lawful vs chaotic etc... I thought I simply saw "Evil Outsider" on a final boss in an epic the other day when inspecting and was not 100% sure on how common this was.. or how common it may be with the new lamma content coming out. It sounds as if i am definately better off crafting the seperate GLOB and GCOB so thanks for the input save me some time money and effort lol

EDIT/AFTERTHOUGHT: I will resume my inspecting and if I figure out which epic it was I will let you know. My main concern was crafting the seperate weapon sets only to THEN find out i also had to craft the GEOB on top of it or perform subpar in certain epics/raids.

[TheDearLeader]

LOL thanks.. yes i am aware of DR breaking and lawful vs chaotic etc... I thought I simply saw "Evil Outsider" on a final boss in an epic the other day when inspecting and was not 100% sure on how common this was.. or how common it may be with the new lamma content coming out. It sounds as if i am definately better off crafting the seperate GLOB and GCOB so thanks for the input save me some time money and effort lol

If it says "Evil Outsider", it is either Lawful, or Chaotic, and will be affected by the appropriate bane type. Inspect that same creature again, and it will probably also say that it's creature type is Devil, or Demon. That can assist you in figuring out how to bypass it's DR. Of course, so can the Wiki, for most named mobs.

[Thoradin]

Good deal and thanks again

PS- anyone tell you that you have amazing response time? ; )

[TheDearLeader]

Good deal and thanks again

PS- anyone tell you that you have amazing response time? ; )

I can't sleep, and nothing else is going on at this time on night. -.- Might as well try and help someone do more damage for the cheapest resource investment.

Yeah, if you figure out what mob it was, let me know. Among "Epic" Evil Outsiders, it could be Lailat, Malicia, Turigulon, Baktor, Inkrakos, Garos, Kron'zek, Bloodplate, Razorarm, Conjoined Abishai Devastator (and his five "parts"), or that Demon at the end of Epic Into the Deep.

[gloopygloop]

Greater Evil Outsider Bane can help you keep the same weapon in your hand when you're killing an assortment of Evil Outsider trash. There aren't many places where you have to fight both Lawful Evil Outsiders and Chaotic Evil Outsiders, but it does happen from time to time, so there is at least some advantage there.

I don't think it's enough of an advantage to justify the extra expense, but it does exist.

Also, making just one set of HBSoGEOB weapons is enough to do everything you need outside of ADQ since nothing outside of ADQ has a big number on its DR/Good+Cold Iron, so that can save you some room in your golf bag of weapons if you're tight on space. Sometimes "good enough" really is good enough.

[Thoradin]

yeah i could have sworn it was either malicia or the conjoined as thats what ive been doing alot of the last few days lol.. but if i get a verification ill post