"Greater Evil Outsider Bane is Better"

[TheDearLeader]

I've heard this before when linking a +5 Holy Burst Silver of GLOB to people.

"Oh yeah, that's nice, but GEOB would be better."

I fail to understand the logic behind this statement.

GLOB takes a LDS, GCOB takes a Demon's Blood. GEOB takes... both.

So if you're crafting for a TWF character, and want to acutally, gasp, bust DR? You can either craft appropriate to the Outsider, and spend 2 LDS and 2 Demon Bloods, or craft "better", spend 4 LDS, 4 Demon Bloods... and do the same damage.

What's the incentive exactly for GEOB? Same to-hit, and damage, and if you want to maximize DPS, you better be busting DR, so you're going to be using the appropriate metal type.

Thoughts?

[QuantumFX]

The only time Greater Evil Outsider Bane would be considered a better investment is on Holy Handwraps of GEOB for a Shintao monk. And that’s only because of inventory issues. (You could still go Axiomatic Burst of GCOB and Holy of GLOB if you wanted SUPERUBERDUPER DPS!)

[kernal42]

You've obviously made the right crafting decision. The only people who should prefer GEOB are:
Shintao Monks
Archers

However, if Lammania is considered, you can toss (via ally or scroll) Cold Iron onto your HBSGEOB rapier and use that same weapon vs. Lailat.

Not worth the trouble for the slot consolidation, probably.

-Kernal

[QuantumFX]

Archers

Good call. I would also add crossbow users as well.

However, if Lammania is considered, you can toss (via ally or scroll) Cold Iron onto your HBSGEOB rapier and use that same weapon vs. Lailat.

I think, at that point, I would rather get an elemental weapons buff. (Shock for Devils, Acid for Demons.)

[Epitome]

Good call. I would also add crossbow users as well.



I think, at that point, I would rather get an elemental weapons buff. (Shock for Devils, Acid for Demons.)

Deadly blades when they get it fix for sure!

[rimble]

nt

[DaSawks]

There is this theory going around that most of the endgame bosses are Evil Outsiders. Meh.

[TheDearLeader]

There is this theory going around that most of the endgame bosses are Evil Outsiders. Meh.

They are also either Chaotic or Lawful, as well, and have Metallic DR components that need bypassed accordingly. Meh.

[~spathic]

That the GCOB also helps against the eladrin and occasional djinn, which the GEOB would not. Not really that important a point for the few flagging quests you'll encounter them, but a little more value added for the GCOB.

[Indoran]

There is this theory going around that most of the endgame bosses are Evil Outsiders. Meh.

ok 1. not a theory 2. they also are lawful or chaotic and each requires a different material in the base item. Go meditate on what you just learned.

[Malky]

The only downside of GLOB is that it doesn't affect tieflings (and dream scourges too but that's less of a concern).

With GEOB being 20ish levels above GLOB... well i'm using GLOB as well atm

[TheDearLeader]

The only downside of GLOB is that it doesn't affect tieflings (and dream scourges too but that's less of a concern).

With GEOB being 20ish levels above GLOB... well i'm using GLOB as well atm

Actually, GLOB does affect Tieflings. I have confirmed this on multiple occasions, but I suggest that you go and do the same for your own benefit. The Dream Scourges are also damaged by GLOB.

KotC enhancement based "Bane" damage does not damage Tieflings - apparently they do not fall under the whole "Fiendslaying" thing. However, the ToD Set Bonus damage does affect Tieflings, as does normal bane types.

So... sorry, your downside is invalid.

[Malky]

Actually, GLOB does affect Tieflings. I have confirmed this on multiple occasions, but I suggest that you go and do the same for your own benefit. The Dream Scourges are also damaged by GLOB.

KotC enhancement based "Bane" damage does not damage Tieflings - apparently they do not fall under the whole "Fiendslaying" thing. However, the ToD Set Bonus damage does affect Tieflings, as does normal bane types.

So... sorry, your downside is invalid.

Tested now, and indeed it does affect both which is a very good piece of news to me since i went the Silver GLOB / Cold Iron GCOB way as well. ddowiki might need an update since it lists both tieflings and dream scourges as being evil outsiders but not lawful.

[JollySwagMan]

Was the item link solicited?

[TheDearLeader]

Was the item link solicited?

This isn't any one particular occasion, but normally, yes. What brought me to the forums was that I'd heard this circular logic of trying to defend GEOB as "better" than GLOB multiple times.

[JollySwagMan]

This isn't any one particular occasion, but normally, yes. What brought me to the forums was that I'd heard this circular logic of trying to defend GEOB as "better" than GLOB multiple times.

Fair enough - I was going to suggest that perhaps it was a snarky response to unsolicted item linkage

As that's not the case, and this thread is more a result of players demanding a link from you, I can certainly appreciate why you would make this thread! Consolidating the evil/lawful outsider DR information like you have in this thread (which I am guessing might be linked along with the item?) is also quite helpful, kudos.

[Thoradin]

Glad you posted this forum I have been wondering about this for a couple days and may have found my answer.. there ARE some bosses in epics and raids that when you inspect them are simply listed as "evil outsider". Not chaotic or lawful so i assume that you would specifically need GEOB instead of GCOB or GLOB. And unless i am mistaken the GEOB will hit any of the same critters that the GCOB/GLOB will hit. In short, it would seem that the GEOB cuts back on inventory spaces needed AND hits some things the other 2 will not.

If I am mistaken please feel free to let me know before I craft my stuff

[TheDearLeader]

Glad you posted this forum I have been wondering about this for a couple days and may have found my answer.. there ARE some bosses in epics and raids that when you inspect them are simply listed as "evil outsider". Not chaotic or lawful so i assume that you would specifically need GEOB instead of GCOB or GLOB. And unless i am mistaken the GEOB will hit any of the same critters that the GCOB/GLOB will hit. In short, it would seem that the GEOB cuts back on inventory spaces needed AND hits some things the other 2 will not.

If I am mistaken please feel free to let me know before I craft my stuff

You are mistaken, I'll hook you up with why.

When you're living life as an outsider, you live it in two ways.

You're not just an Evil Outsider - you're a Lawful/Chaotic Outsider, as well. There are currently no Neutral Evil Outsiders in DDO.

These "bosses" you speak up - let me go out on a limb here:
Arraetrikos - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Horoth - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Suulomades - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Turigulon - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Laitlat - Demon, Chaotic Evil Outsider
....

The list goes on. These "end game bosses" are either Devils, or they are Demons. They will either be hit by Lawful, or Chaotic, Outsider Bane, as well as Evil Outsider Bane.

Ah, but this only tells half the story. We also have the "damage reduction" feature in Dungeons and Dragons.

Arraetrikos - Devil, Silver + Good
Horoth - Devil, Silver + Good
Suulomades - Devil, Silver + Good
Turigulon - Devil, Silver + Good
Laitlat - Demon, Cold Iron + Good

So, when you're crafting weapons, you'll have two sets - Holy (Burst) + Silver for Devils, and Holy (Burst) + Cold Iron for Demons. Why? Because you want to bust DR. So, no "Inventory Space" is preserved here - you will have two unique weapons/weapon sets.

So then, we can safely assume you will have these two different kids of weapons for the different types of Evil Outsiders currently in game. Well... if each type of weapon is already specifically crafted to counter one enemy type, why not also make that Bane Suffix affect just that type?

GEOB is almost as expensive as individually crafting both a GLOB and GCOB, and because it does not assist you with the "DR" component, it provides no additional benefit to you as a player.

[Fejj]

You are mistaken, I'll hook you up with why.

When you're living life as an outsider, you live it in two ways.

You're not just an Evil Outsider - you're a Lawful/Chaotic Outsider, as well. There are currently no Neutral Evil Outsiders in DDO.

These "bosses" you speak up - let me go out on a limb here:
Arraetrikos - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Horoth - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Suulomades - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Turigulon - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Laitlat - Demon, Chaotic Evil Outsider
....

The list goes on. These "end game bosses" are either Devils, or they are Demons. They will either be hit by Lawful, or Chaotic, Outsider Bane, as well as Evil Outsider Bane.

Ah, but this only tells half the story. We also have the "damage reduction" feature in Dungeons and Dragons.

Arraetrikos - Devil, Silver + Good
Horoth - Devil, Silver + Good
Suulomades - Devil, Silver + Good
Turigulon - Devil, Silver + Good
Laitlat - Demon, Cold Iron + Good

So, when you're crafting weapons, you'll have two sets - Holy (Burst) + Silver for Devils, and Holy (Burst) + Cold Iron for Demons. Why? Because you want to bust DR. So, no "Inventory Space" is preserved here - you will have two unique weapons/weapon sets.

So then, we can safely assume you will have these two different kids of weapons for the different types of Evil Outsiders currently in game. Well... if each type of weapon is already specifically crafted to counter one enemy type, why not also make that Bane Suffix affect just that type?

GEOB is almost as expensive as individually crafting both a GLOB and GCOB, and because it does not assist you with the "DR" component, it provides no additional benefit to you as a player.

Thank you for clearing this up. Terrific information

[rendet]

You are mistaken, I'll hook you up with why.

When you're living life as an outsider, you live it in two ways.

You're not just an Evil Outsider - you're a Lawful/Chaotic Outsider, as well. There are currently no Neutral Evil Outsiders in DDO.

These "bosses" you speak up - let me go out on a limb here:
Arraetrikos - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Horoth - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Suulomades - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Turigulon - Devil, Lawful Evil Outsider
Laitlat - Demon, Chaotic Evil Outsider
....

The list goes on. These "end game bosses" are either Devils, or they are Demons. They will either be hit by Lawful, or Chaotic, Outsider Bane, as well as Evil Outsider Bane.

Ah, but this only tells half the story. We also have the "damage reduction" feature in Dungeons and Dragons.

Arraetrikos - Devil, Silver + Good
Horoth - Devil, Silver + Good
Suulomades - Devil, Silver + Good
Turigulon - Devil, Silver + Good
Laitlat - Demon, Cold Iron + Good

So, when you're crafting weapons, you'll have two sets - Holy (Burst) + Silver for Devils, and Holy (Burst) + Cold Iron for Demons. Why? Because you want to bust DR. So, no "Inventory Space" is preserved here - you will have two unique weapons/weapon sets.

So then, we can safely assume you will have these two different kids of weapons for the different types of Evil Outsiders currently in game. Well... if each type of weapon is already specifically crafted to counter one enemy type, why not also make that Bane Suffix affect just that type?

GEOB is almost as expensive as individually crafting both a GLOB and GCOB, and because it does not assist you with the "DR" component, it provides no additional benefit to you as a player.

Great summary you wrote up. Easy to understand and clear. Too bad this info will get buried in a thread while the harber know it alls continue to spread their miss-information Keep fighting the good fight!