Feedback: Barbarian 101 (Work-in-Progress)

[FordyTwo]

Howdy,

Below is an early version of the template for Barbarian 101. Written for newly-starting DDO free players, we've opted for a dwarf Two Handed Fighter (THF) template with a 28pt build. The skill, feat and enhancement selections are designed to output solid damage with reasonable survivability (for a new player).

Is there a factual mistake somewhere that we haven't shaken out? Do you have suggestions on a more ideal skill, feat or enhancement progression? Please share!

What to do: Give use constructive criticism and feedback!

What not to do: Derail Barbarian 101 feedback with off-topic posts or inflammatory comments.

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==Every New Barbarian Should Know …==

• (Got advice? Please share in a comment below!)

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==Template: Two Handed Weapon Dwarf Barbarian==

This template is a great starting point to create a melee powerhouse with lots of hit points (and even more damage output).

Note: While these templates typically avoid equipment suggestions, for the Two Handed Weapon variant it's suggested that a greataxe or greatsword is used in conjunction with the Improved Critical: Slashing feat.

===Ability Point Buy===

Dwarf will be our racial choice for the +2 Constitution (CON) and various defensive bonuses.

• STR: 18
• DEX: 14
• CON: 16
• INT: 8
• WIS: 8
• CHA: 6

• Ability Point Buy: Point grants at levels 4, 8, 12, 16 and 20 all go to STR.

===Skills===

• Tumble: Invest two skill points into Tumble, a skill that comes in handy but cannot be used without 1 Rank trained.

• Balance: Barbarians are constantly on the front lines of battle, so keep Balance maxed to ensure a speedy recovery upon a knockdown.

• Jump: Having a total score of 10 in Jump (which barbarians can easily meet with their high strength) is enough to get you across chasms and traps -- especially with help from Jump-enhancing spells and potions. You can choose to invest ranks in jump if you don't want to be dependent on magical items.

• Spot: A skill useful for its ability to help you detect hidden enemies. Invest any spare skill points here as you level.

• Intimidate: Use of Intimidate can help even without any invested ranks because it increases the amount of threat generated with every attack for a short period of time.

===Feat Order===

• 1) Toughness: This feat adds survivability by increasing hit points by +3 at level one, and +1 hit point for each additional level. More importantly, Toughness opens up "Toughness Enhancements," opening the way to further hit point bonuses as you earn Enhancement points.

• 3) Power Attack: Able to be toggled on and off, Power Attack mode trades up to 5 of your attack bonus for equal extra damage on melee attacks. Using a two-handed weapon in this build makes Power Attack mode more appealing: the feat offers double bonus damage when using two-handed weapons.

• 6) Cleave: Activate this ability to attack one or more enemies within a forward-facing arc.

• 9) Improved Critical: Slashing: This feat greatly increases the likelihood of your attacks dealing critical damage by increase the "critical threat range" of any slashing weapon you use. This means axes and swords, more or less – weapons that deal bludgeoning, piercing, ranged or thrown damage will not benefit from this feat.

• 12) Two Handed Fighting: Increases the damage of glancing blow attacks when wielding a two-handed weapon by 10%. Also grants a 3% chance for weapon effects to trigger on glancing blows. A glancing blow is a free, additional attack that only two-handed weapons are capable of doing.

• 15) Improved Two Handed Fighting: Increases the damage of glancing blow attacks (See "Two Handed Fighting" feat above for more info) when wielding a two-handed weapon by an additional 10% on top of the Two Handed Fighting bonus. Also increases the chance for weapon effects to trigger on glancing blows by an additional 3%.

• 18) Greater Two Handed Fighting: Increases the damage of glancing blow attacks when wielding a two-handed weapon by another 10% on top of the previous Two Handed Fighting feats. Also increases the chance for weapon effects to trigger on glancing blows by an additional 3%. At this point, your barbarian will have a 50% total chance to produce glancing blows (the base is 20%).Optionally, grab Stunning Blow at level 1 (but remember you'll lose the extra Toughness enhancement line):

• Stunning Blow: This potent feat allows you to stun enemies for 6 seconds and increase all the damage they take from you and your allies by 50% for the duration of the effect. Having higher strength increases the chances of a success.

==Enhancements ==

The enhancements suggested in this section have been chosen to build upon the barbarian's damage-output and damage reduction traits.

All enhancements below effectively upgrade the barbarian Rage ability, making it even more potent than vanilla Rage.

The rundown on Rage enhancements: Extend Rage increases the Rage ability's duration, Extra Rage adds additional Rage uses between rests, Hardy Rage increases Constitution (CON) while Rage is active (adding more hit points) and Power Rage increases Strength (STR) while Rage is active (adding more damage per attack). Extend/Extra Rage is usually sufficient at Tier 2, but you can take Tier 3 if you find it helps.

Simply put, the below enhancements transform a raging barbarian into stampeding death-machine.

• Barbarian Extend Rage I - II
• Barbarian Extra Rage I - II
• Barbarian Hardy Rage I - II
• Barbarian Power Rage I - IV

Attack & Damage enhancements: Power Attack I–III will bolster Power Attacks extra damage at the cost of lowered accuracy; the high Strength (STR) of barbarians, decent weapons, and good Base Attack Bonus more than negates a slight loss of accuracy. As a dwarf, it's a good idea to invest a bit into boosting accuracy and damage with greataxes, a solid weapon-of-choice for most of DDO.

• Barbarian Power Attack I - III
• Dwarven Axe Attack I
• Dwarven Axe Damage I

Defensive enhancements: Dwarven Spell Defense makes you more resistance to spells, boosting all your saves by one against spells. Willpower grants you an additional +1 Will save when raging, a useful bonus when going up against magically-inclined baddies.

• Barbarian Willpower I
• Dwarven Spell Defense I

Survivability enhancements: Barbarians rely on hit points (HP) and damage reduction (DR) to survive any attacks enemies might land before their demise. Ideally, a barbarian drops all opponents to the ground before they get a chance to attack. In the event a kobold or two slips past, it's a good idea to have the extra hit points (HP) offered by the below enhancements.

• Racial Toughness I - II
• Barbarian Constitution I
• Barbarian Toughness I – II
• Dwarven Constitution I

Damage Reduction (DR) enhancements: Damage Reduction is a great choice for barbarian enhancements, lowering the amount of overall damage received, resulting in longer survivability.

• Barbarian Improved Damage Reduction I - II

The rundown on Frenzied Berserker: An ever-important barbarian enhancement line, Frenzied Berserker adds to the damage multiplier on critical hits while raging, two-handed weapon glancing blows have a greater chance to add magical effects (such as flaming, etc), you may spend 10 hit points to use Supreme Cleave – and most importantly, you can spend 20 hit points to enter a Death Frenzy (at rank III).

Think of the frenzy (unlocked via Frenzied Berserker I) and Death Frenzy (Frenzied Berserker III) as an optional "Super Mega Ultra Rage" mode. Damage Boost is an enhancement that does two things for a barbarian using this template: activates for increased damage, and meets the requirements for Frenzied Berserker.

• Barbarian Frenzied Berserker I - III
• Barbarian Damage Boost I - IV

Barbarian capstone enhancement: A player must take 20 levels of the barbarian class to obtain the capstone enhancement, but it's worth the investment. A barbarian who takes Barbarian Might receives +2 STR, and when wielding two-handed weapons receive increased glancing blow damage and an increased chance of applying weapon special effects on glancing blows. By the capstone point in DDO magically-infused weapons are something of a regularity, and Barbarian Might – combined with other elements of this template – ensures their magical effects occur as frequently as possible.

• Capstone: Barbarian Might

In case of Stunning Blow (optional enhancement): As mentioned above, you can boost the DCs of your tactical feats like Trip and Stunning Blow as a barbarian if you actually decide to take Stunning Blow instead of toughness. Use the 6 AP you spent in toughness enhancements above (which you no longer have access to without toughness) to boost the DCs of all your tactical feats using the following enhancement.

• Dwarven Tactics II

[Bombalo]

Why wouldn't you take Improved Crit: Slashing at level 9 and improved two handed at 12? I thought for max DPS you would want to pick up Imp Crit as early as possible?

[oberon131313]

The odd point into dex and wis seems a bit off to me. I think you were trying to point out those stats as "save" stats, but leaving them as odd is useless unless you get tomes. I personally would change it to be one or the other.

[FrozenNova]

Stunning blow, not great cleave.
Great cleave is laughably obsolete given that barbarians recieve a free whirlwind attack with no cooldown at level 12.
Admittedly on a human stunning blow is not quite up there with the dwarf, horc or 'forged varients, but is nonetheless important.

[Lord_of_13]

I would drop the random point of WIS and put it into DEX. The extra two points of CON cost 4 points and could be used to raise DEX to 14 as well, but that's arguable since pure Barb AC is questionable even in the lower/middle levels. If 16 CON is really needed... and you can afford 1 less feat... go Dwarf with better stats (the CHA penalty is clearly irrelevant). And the skill point you lose comes from Listen.

As for feats, swap out Great Cleave for Stunning Blow. 'nuff said.

As for skills, dump Listen. Get UMD - even as a cross-class skill with a crappy CHA modifier, you should be able to use race-restricted and some alignment restricted items.

The enhancements are rather up to personal choice, but...
- Extra Rage I and II are plenty; no need to waste 3 AP for a 3rd rage.
- Same with Extend Rage - limit it to Extend Rage II. Already you have freed 6 AP.
- Grab Barbarian Willpower II and III. That uses up 5 AP; 1 freed AP now left.
- Get Trap Sense I. The bonus to your saves is rather nice, and you'll be very happy when you don't have a rogue in your party.

Also, minor typo: You say "Ability Point Buy: Point grants at levels 4, 8, 12 and 16 all go to STR." but it should be "Ability Point Buy: Point grants at levels 4, 8, 12, 16 and 20 all go to STR." Along comes the nitpick that in the section titled "Feat Explanation" you are really doing "Enhancement Explanation".

[edragoon148]

The odd point into dex and wis seems a bit off to me. I think you were trying to point out those stats as "save" stats, but leaving them as odd is useless unless you get tomes. I personally would change it to be one or the other.

I agree with this point, I would recommend the two extra points be kicked to intelligence for an extra skill point per level. As a side note that goes hand in hand with that recommendation, UMD is a viable and highly recommended skill for all classes. The ability for a barbarian to scroll fire shield before entering combat or use scrolls for utility purposes is great.


Additionally, this is of course my opinion and feedback would be appreciated, but many of the Barbarians I play with at endgame find no use in the Two-Handed Fighting feats. The glancing blow damage isn't worth investing 3 feats to obtain and many players often forego this feat line for Toughness feats. I agree with the aforementioned lack of use in Great Cleave as well.

EDIT: Given the responses, explanation, and raw data I've been provided with, I realize my recommendation to disregard THF feats was silly and misinformed. They are highly recommended.

[t0r012]

• Ability Point Buy: Point grants at levels 4, 8, 12 and 16 all go to STR.

And 20

Also a minor thing but I got a little confused reading the feats before I realized that the exPlination was given prior to the feat. So you may want to consider a small format change to clarify.

One last thing , that I feel s very important. I should skip using THW or THF abbreviation as you did in the begining. It is For new players who will see those letters and wonder what language your speaking.

[stainer]

I would switch out great cleave for stunning blow. I think it would be more useful to any player. You might want to mention that Dwarf, Horc and WF are nice variants for a barbarian at some point. You might also talk about respeccing your enhancements for power/hardy rage to free up AP when you end up with an uneven str/con when raged.

[Tyrantico]

I'd personally go with Listen or Spot, but not both (I prefer Spot, even at half ranks, but YMMV). UMD at half ranks is still useful enough to consider - with decent gear you can get high enough to bypass race or alignment restrictions, which is nice for a new player. If you're not going full-minmax "STR/CON and nothing else," you might as well drop your spare points into INT for skills... but really, on a non-Dwarf fleshy, the extra HP from max CON sure would be nice. Also, I'd drop Great Cleave in favor of Stunning Blow, even in the post-autocrit era; you already get Supreme Cleave from FB, so may as well add the CC wrinkle instead.

[t0r012]

Much clearer on the feats now , thanks

[FordyTwo]

Thanks for all the feedback so far!

Changes made:

• Moved point buys out of DEX and WIS, into INT.
• Switched Listen for UMD.
• Improved Critical Slashing is now at 9; Improved Two Handed Fighting is now at 12.
• Replaced Great Cleave with Stunning Blow
• Clairified "THF" with usage of "Two Handed Fighting (THF)".
• Added mention of level "20" point buy into STR.
• Bolded Feats, Skills and Enhancements to reflect final version.
  

[Ralmeth]

Overall it looks good. I just have a few comments / suggestions:

Stat distribution
This looks good (i.e. maxing strength and 16 con), however I would start intelligence at 10 and drop dex and wisdom to 8 for 1 extra skill point per level.

Race
As this is a 101 guide I recommend keeping it simple and going with one race such as human. I wouldn't include 1/2 orc or warforged as these both need to be purchased or earned with favor and opens the question of how a new person should build these.

Level Up Points
This is minor, but you also gain a level up point at 20th level and this should also go to strength.

[t0r012]

Some advice for new barbs that is good for any meleebut even better for barbs with a run speed bonus ;

Get to and kill the casters first!

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You are using a big two handed weapon when things start to get dangerous you can use your reach to your advantage. Use your reach and back away from your target
I got in trouble with a solo run of haberdasher elite the other day with a shiny new barb and I just kited the scorps around, backpedeling and swinging. Made sure only one was in reach of me at a time and made the situation much more manageable.

[Maatogaeoth]

Am I the only one that finds the formatting in the enhancement area to be weird?

Power Attack I – III will add additional damage at the cost of accuracy, although accuracy is not typically an issue facing barbarians due to their high strength, decent weapons, and good Base Attack Bonus.

• Barbarian Power Attack I - III

Gain an additional +1 Will save when raging, a useful bonus when going up against magically-inclined baddies.

• Barbarian Willpower I

A once-famous but now-unknown barbarian said, "More strength GOOD!" It's a wise saying that lives to this day among barbarian players in DDO.

• Human Adaptability Strength I

You have comments about the enhancement before the enhancements in question. I had to read the area a couple times for it to start making sense. Maybe they've all been done this way and I didn't read them through well enough...

[RandomKeypress]

Not sure if there's room in the enhancements list, but human healing amp makes keeping the barbarian up easier on the healer. As they are often the 'tank', this is a good thing.

Things Barbarians should know.
Rage is the barbarian signature ability - use it often. When rage ends, the barbarian is exhausted. While they may seem dauntingly expensive to begin with, potions of lesser restoration will remove that exhausted effect and are well worth carrying.

Barbarians can struggle to solo dungeons, but having a cleric or favoured soul hireling can help immensely. Almost all will happily cast lesser restoration on you when your rage ends, saving money on restoration pots.

Weapon choices:
Barbarians generally specialise in two-handed weapons (TWF). Try to ensure you have a falchion, greataxe or greatsword for most enemies, a maul or a greatclub for some undead and a throw-away weapon for tackling oozes.
Barbarians do not generally have high dexterity, making their chance to hit with a bow or crossbow fairly low. When ranged attacks are needed, throwing axes or daggers are often a barbarian's best choice.

Intimidate is a useful skill for barbarians. They often need to pull the attention of an enemy to prevent damage to less tough friends and intimidate is excellent for doing this.

That's all I've got atm.

[Arel]

I don't know what the enhancements add up to right now, but I would definitely suggest at least mentioning Human Healing Amp as a good enhancement to think about, especially at early levels. Barbs tend to bock most damage with their face, which make them mana sponges for healers. And earlier on, when said clerics/FvSs don't have a ton to work with...

[Luckness]

Point of preference: For a human build, 5 skill points per level seems like overkill for a barbarian. I'd be happy to max out Intimidate, Balance, and UMD, put 1 into Tumble and the rest into Spot. And the Spot is a luxury. Between naturally high strength and the Jump spell from either clicky or a caster, ranks in jump are not worth giving up the benefits of 2 Charisma (Intim/UMD) or 2 Wisdom (Will save) or 2 Dexterity (Reflex save). If you can't live without Jump, though, and have no tomes, the points in Int make sense.

Speaking of intimidation, it is a great waste not to skill intimidation on your barbarian. Without even considering the fact that in many parties the barbarian makes the natural "tank" (damage soaker) and that some Intimidation skill could help with that, the Intimidation skill is the way the barbarian provides one of its only party buffs / debuffs. The barbarian is the only class that applies the "shaken" effect when intimidating. "A Shaken creature takes a -2 penalty on Attack rolls, Saving throws, Skill checks, and Ability checks." This effectively gives all your casters 2 better on their DC and gives the melee 2 better on their AC. It increases the odds of landing a Stunning Blow also.

Gameplay notes:
- Something about always being raged (early and often)
- Something about getting to the casters first, fast
- Something about using your speed to take less damage by being in front of fewer enemies (because your armor quickly becomes insufficient to block blows)

The barbarian is a dedicated melee class, without the ability to contribute much else such as buffs or spells. However, that does not excuse the barbarian from coming to the adventure prepared. When they become affordable, a barbarian should have a supply of consumables such as Cure Serious Wounds potions (for self heals), Lesser Restoration potions (for dealing with the fatigue of raging), blindness cure potions (a blind barbarian does no damage), and even haste and rage potions (when maximum damage is needed). Even though you will not be able to get high UMD to use scrolls easily on a pure barbarian, you can use any spell that comes on gear (a "clicky") and should look out for any you might loot or find cheaply.

Use Magic Device (UMD): A barbarian gets more skill points per level than a fighter and has no excuse not to get some UMD skill. Even at 11 ranks in UMD, it is one of the most valuable skills in the game. Through gear and buffs that increase your charisma and skills, it is not hard to reach around 20 UMD skill, the threshhold for equipping alignment and race-restricted items. For example, using a +6 Charisma item (+2), a heroism potion (+2), first rank human versatility (+2), and an item to increase UMD such as the golden cartouche (+3) will get you there. That allows you to use True Law and True Chaos weapons or Pure Good weapons without meeting the requirements or equipping armor that is usually restricted to another race, which includes some of the best randomly generated items in the game.

Stunning Blow: A barbarian contributes to crowd control the way he knows best, with his fists. This feat allows the barbarian to make an attempt to stun a nearby opponent for a few seconds, making it safe for that monster to be beat on without retaliation. The difficulty check (DC) for landing stunning blow successfully is based on strength. Because a barbarian with rage is one of the highest strength characters in the game, this is a very good way for the barbarian to contribute to the efficient dispatch of enemies.

[karl_k0ch]

The barbarian is a dedicated melee class, without the ability to contribute much else such as buffs or spells. However, that does not excuse the barbarian from coming to the adventure prepared. When they become affordable, a barbarian should have a supply of consumables such as Cure Serious Wounds potions (for self heals), Lesser Restoration potions (for dealing with the fatigue of raging), blindness cure potions (a blind barbarian does no damage), and even haste and rage potions (when maximum damage is needed).

Lots of useful stuff, +1 for that, Luckness.

A minor note: The only potions which can be used while raging are the potions sold by the guild vendor in House K.

[Arkadios]

Suggestion: Feats; I think you have all the right ones, however a better order IMO (and what i've used) would be

1) Toughness
1) Stunning Blow
3) Power attack
6) Cleave
9) Imp. Critical (Slashing, etc.)
12)THF
15)iTHF
18)gTHF

[DragonMageT]

A helpful suggestion to new players would be a listing of your ideal gear selection by slot and where to get those items (crafted, raid gear, greensteal, and even epic items if you wish).

Give the new players a general road map of what they need at endgame and where to find them.

Half Orc THF would also be nice to see since it has the highest DPS by race and requires a little more
work in the enhancement points

Nice work!