34 point FvS (feed back please)

[Clawkin]

I'm at lv 14 and thinking about my TR.
((Updated based on feed back from the community))
Stats are no longer part of this conversation, I have decided where I will put the points, the Charisma score in the planner is up to 13 for the sole purpouse of being able to show the Paladin Dilliantte Feat along with enhancement choices. I will eat a +2 tome at lv 7 and then use my free feat swap to get it, I will use Barb Dilliantte untill then. All I seek at this point is feed back on Feats and Enhancements. I will be TRing again shortly after, and again, and again, and maybe even again.))
str-12
dex-8
con-14
Int-10 (the skill points are more worth it than having con at 15)
Wis-18
Cha-12 (no freakin way am I starting at 10, and if you really look at my enhancements you will notice I do not take ANY
Charisma enhancements. I instead chose survivability and damage)

here's the build

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.09.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 True Neutral Half-Elf Female
(20 Favored Soul) 
Hit Points: 302
Spell Points: 1922 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 14
Will: 23

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(34 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             13                    15
Dexterity             8                    10
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence         10                    12
Wisdom               18                    28
Charisma             13                    17

Tomes Used
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance              -1                     0
Bluff                 1                     3
Concentration         4                    26
Diplomacy             1                     5
Disable Device        n/a                   n/a
Haggle                1                     3
Heal                  4                    11
Hide                 -1                     0
Intimidate            1                     3
Jump                  3                    15
Listen                4                     9
Move Silently        -1                     0
Open Lock            n/a                    n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                0                     1
Search                0                     1
Spot                  4                     9
Swim                  1                     2
Tumble               n/a                    n/a
Use Magic Device      3                    14.5

Level 1 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Deity) Favored by the Sovereign Host
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Paladin
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Wizard
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Favored Soul)


Level 3 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 4 (Favored Soul)


Level 5 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Fire


Level 6 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Arcane Initiate


Level 7 (Favored Soul)


Level 8 (Favored Soul)


Level 9 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Focus: Evocation


Level 10 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Cold


Level 11 (Favored Soul)


Level 12 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 13 (Favored Soul)


Level 14 (Favored Soul)


Level 15 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Electricity
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 16 (Favored Soul)


Level 17 (Favored Soul)


Level 18 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Focus: Evocation


Level 19 (Favored Soul)


Level 20 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Deity) Favored Soul Damage Reduction: Cold Iron
Enhancement: Favored Soul Ascendency: Sovereign Host
Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
Enhancement: Favored Soul Angel of Vengeance I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Angel of Vengeance II
Enhancement: Improved Paladin Dilettante I
Enhancement: Improved Paladin Dilettante II
Enhancement: Improved Paladin Dilettante III
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Wisdom I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Smiting I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Smiting II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Smiting III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Life I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Smiting I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Smiting II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Prayer of Incredible Smiting III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Smiting IV
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Life Magic IV
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Energy of the Scion III
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wisdom I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wisdom II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Toughness I
Enhancement: Favored Soul Toughness II
Enhancement: Favored Soul Wand and Scroll Mastery I

[The_Brave2]

It is hard to tell by your build, are you planning on doing mele or evoker build? If you are going evoker based than you should drop STR and increase your CON, your HP is low. If you are doing a mele build, go WF, drop Wis. And in either case, you dont need that much starting CHA,

19 Starting to cast lv.9 spells
-6 Item
-2 Tome

Means you need 11 Starting CHA to cast. So drop CHA and add some more in CON....thoughts on dil, yea, pally seems like a good choice.

Also, I would swap Acid res for Cold res. and Swap around when you take what. Id go with Fire -> Cold -> Electric

Hope this helps

[der_kluge]

Charisma is too high. Lower it to 11. With a +2 tome, and a +6 item, you can easily achieve a 19 without spending any enhancements on it. Start with a 10, and you could cheaply invest a FvS charisma enhancement on it and achieve the same result cheaply. You only really need a 19.

Put those points into strength or con instead.

Looks like you're definitely shooting for an evoker build, with that wisdom. DPS on this guy will be quite subpar, but that's OK I guess, if you know what you're getting into. I don't have a lot of experience with Evoker builds, myself.

Also a 14 UMD is not useful. If you can't get it to 20, don't bother. Max concentration for this build. Put the rest into Jump so you can keep up with your party members.

[der_kluge]

Also, I would swap Acid res for Cold res. and Swap around when you take what. Id go with Fire -> Cold -> Electric

Hope this helps [/color]

I'm definitely a fan of the FvS Acid resistance, and it's the one I took first. Why? It's my anti-Melf's Acid Arrow choice! And it's PHENOMENAL at low levels.

[Sequell]

Charisma is too high. Lower it to 11. With a +2 tome, and a +6 item, you can easily achieve a 19 without spending any enhancements on it. Start with a 10, and you could cheaply invest a FvS charisma enhancement on it and achieve the same result cheaply. You only really need a 19.

Put those points into strength or con instead.

Looks like you're definitely shooting for an evoker build, with that wisdom. DPS on this guy will be quite subpar, but that's OK I guess, if you know what you're getting into. I don't have a lot of experience with Evoker builds, myself.

Also a 14 UMD is not useful. If you can't get it to 20, don't bother. Max concentration for this build. Put the rest into Jump so you can keep up with your party members.

I agree with everything except in red...

14 base UMD is just fine and plenty useful with some self-buffs. Lets see how high we can make that useless 14 with a little work.

14 Base Ranks
03 +6 Cha item
03 Cartouche (Deleras)
04 Greater Hero (Planar Gird from Xorian)
06 Greensteel SP item
---
30 without very much effort invested at all...plenty for any RR gear you would like to use as well as UMDing fire\cold shield scrolls for ToD kiting and such.

[The_Brave2]

I'm definitely a fan of the FvS Acid resistance, and it's the one I took first. Why? It's my anti-Melf's Acid Arrow choice! And it's PHENOMENAL at low levels.

The reason I say cold > Acid is that you usualy dont get hit hit for acid damage over 30, so a resist fixes that. as for melf's pick up some boots of corrosion for low levels.

[Clawkin]

Charisma is too high. Lower it to 11. With a +2 tome, and a +6 item, you can easily achieve a 19 without spending any enhancements on it. Start with a 10, and you could cheaply invest a FvS charisma enhancement on it and achieve the same result cheaply. You only really need a 19.

Put those points into strength or con instead.

Looks like you're definitely shooting for an evoker build, with that wisdom. DPS on this guy will be quite subpar, but that's OK I guess, if you know what you're getting into. I don't have a lot of experience with Evoker builds, myself.

Also a 14 UMD is not useful. If you can't get it to 20, don't bother. Max concentration for this build. Put the rest into Jump so you can keep up with your party members.

13 Cha is needed to take Paladin Dillantte, and Impaqt's Evoker build starts with 14 Cha as well, it's what I am currently using and I currently appreciate every SP I have. How is DPS too low? Empower, Maximize? I'm running this exact same build only in Elf form and the DPS is great. If you're refering to the 14 str instead of 12.. well I tend to smack things with my sword when I run to BB. suppose I could drop it back to 12 as it is with my current build and pump up con a little, but that still only gives me up to 15 con... kind of pointless. Maybe I should bump Int up to 10 for an extra skill point, then UMD can hit 20....

[Clawkin]

It is hard to tell by your build, are you planning on doing mele or evoker build? If you are going evoker based than you should drop STR and increase your CON, your HP is low. If you are doing a mele build, go WF, drop Wis. And in either case, you dont need that much starting CHA,

19 Starting to cast lv.9 spells
-6 Item
-2 Tome

Means you need 11 Starting CHA to cast. So drop CHA and add some more in CON....thoughts on dil, yea, pally seems like a good choice.

Also, I would swap Acid res for Cold res. and Swap around when you take what. Id go with Fire -> Cold -> Electric

Hope this helps

Yes evoker type build, I chose to take Greater spell pen instead of SF Evocation because +2>+1 and I plan to use Implosion
13-Cha is required to take Paladin Dillantte

[The_Brave2]

Yes evoker type build, I chose to take Greater spell pen instead of SF Evocation because +2>+1 and I plan to use Implosion
13-Cha is required to take Paladin Dillantte

if that is the case with the pal dil, I would drop it. SF evo and GSF evo are going to help you more than spell pen, on most content. Implosion is evocation focused so it will increase your DC by 2.

[Clawkin]

if that is the case with the pal dil, I would drop it. SF evo and GSF evo are going to help you more than spell pen, on most content. Implosion is evocation focused so it will increase your DC by 2.

My only counter argument here is that based on Impaqt's Evoker build, he's starting at 14 Cha too. I suppose that dropping cha to 1o, and str to 12, that will allow me to get con 16 and int 10. It doesn't seem like a solid trade off to me. I could see leaving Cha at 14, dropping str to 12 and then taking Int up to 10 for more skill points.. that makes sense to me....

[mute_mayhem]

My only counter argument here is that based on Impaqt's Evoker build, he's starting at 14 Cha too. I suppose that dropping cha to 1o, and str to 12, that will allow me to get con 16 and int 10. It doesn't seem like a solid trade off to me. I could see leaving Cha at 14, dropping str to 12 and then taking Int up to 10 for more skill points.. that makes sense to me....

Or you could consider dropping both STR and CHA to 12 in order to raise CON to 16...

+1 To-Hit/Damage means nothing at end game for an evoker.
+29 Spell points mean nothing at end game for an evoker.
+20 Hit points could mean the difference between saving a raid or being a soulstone.

[AtomicMew]

I strongly disagree with all of the posters here. I think it's funny that people are arguing about 14 base CON all the while missing the most GLARING weakness of this build: the lack of HEIGHTEN. Do not even bother playing a caster-based FvS without this feat. Drop the FvS past life feat and swap it in for heighten.

Also, a 14 base CON on a FvS evoker is just fine because of the enhancement bonus FvS gets. In fact, a FvS with 14 CON can end up with the same HP as a cleric with 18 CON.

That said, it wouldn't hurt to bump up CON to 16. Drop STR and or CHA. You can safely drop CHA to 11 or 12 even with paladin dill, as you can eat a tome and then use a feat swap to pick it up.

Personally, I feel that DC's (and also spell focus: evocation) are more important than spell pen: all mobs have saves, not all mobs have SR. Even implosion needs to beat a DC check to work.

Lastly, if you are really serious about playing an evoker, consider grinding out a wizard past life. That gets you +2 spell pen and +1 DC's on all your spells (with the active feat). If you are really REALLY serious, you'll want a few wizard past lives and a few sorcerer pats lives. The FvS past life is lackluster, and if you are rich, you can eat a bunch of lesser hearts to get the wizard past life instead.

[The_Brave2]

the lack of HEIGHTEN. Do not even bother playing a caster-based FvS without this feat. Drop the FvS past life feat and swap it in for heighten.

Yep, I missed the glaring absence of Heighten, Absolutely take it, that is not even going to be discussed, you NEED it.

Lastly, if you are really serious about playing an evoker, consider grinding out a wizard past life.

Yes, This along with some Sorc past lives, but with his current plan its a lot more work.

[Clawkin]

Or you could consider dropping both STR and CHA to 12 in order to raise CON to 16...

+1 To-Hit/Damage means nothing at end game for an evoker.
+29 Spell points mean nothing at end game for an evoker.
+20 Hit points could mean the difference between saving a raid or being a soulstone.

Good Point....
That leaves the question of Dilantte choice. http://ddowiki.com/page/Dilettante_feats
with stats of 12/8/16/10/18/10 the best choices are
Barb for DR 3/- Increase in Toughness and +1 con
Monk for +20% healing to self, and then +5 wis to AC if wearing robes, and +1 Wis

[Clawkin]

I strongly disagree with all of the posters here. I think it's funny that people are arguing about 14 base CON all the while missing the most GLARING weakness of this build: the lack of HEIGHTEN. Do not even bother playing a caster-based FvS without this feat. Drop the FvS past life feat and swap it in for heighten.

Also, a 14 base CON on a FvS evoker is just fine because of the enhancement bonus FvS gets. In fact, a FvS with 14 CON can end up with the same HP as a cleric with 18 CON.

That said, it wouldn't hurt to bump up CON to 16. Drop STR and or CHA. You can safely drop CHA to 11 or 12 even with paladin dill, as you can eat a tome and then use a feat swap to pick it up.

Personally, I feel that DC's (and also spell focus: evocation) are more important than spell pen: all mobs have saves, not all mobs have SR. Even implosion needs to beat a DC check to work.

Lastly, if you are really serious about playing an evoker, consider grinding out a wizard past life. That gets you +2 spell pen and +1 DC's on all your spells (with the active feat). If you are really REALLY serious, you'll want a few wizard past lives and a few sorcerer pats lives. The FvS past life is lackluster, and if you are rich, you can eat a bunch of lesser hearts to get the wizard past life instead.

This speaks to me, Thank you. I can definately drop some Doh on 4 +5 hearts and just be a sorc before I TR. time is $ to me. I will re-vamp feats later when I gan get on my PC (planner doesn't like my Macbook) I'll drop Spell Pen, greater spell pen, and FvS pastlife in favor of SF Evoke and G SF Evoke with heighten.

[Bodic]

I dont/wont heighten on my Evoker she does not need it. and it screws with heal SP's

I go higher str THF or S&B until about BB lvl then LR down to 10 str.

and whom said FvS PPL is bad its spell pen/points to get max of either you need 3x FvS just like sorc and wiz as to the active 10 SL that you can boost via PrE vs MM. I do believe more mobs ar immune to MM than SL.

also 14 base Con gets you to +500 HP with incidentals

[The_Brave2]

I dont/wont heighten on my Evoker she does not need it. and it screws with heal SP's

I go higher str THF or S&B until about BB lvl then LR down to 10 str.

and whom said FvS PPL is bad its spell pen/points to get max of either you need 3x FvS just like sorc and wiz as to the active 10 SL that you can boost via PrE vs MM. I do believe more mobs ar immune to MM than SL.

also 14 base Con gets you to +500 HP with incidentals

Try heighten, its ESSENTIAL. sorry. It does screw up mass cures, but if you general just spam mass heal in raids its not an issue, turning it on and off for solo/group play is also an option.

Dropping Heighten is NOT an option.

Also, very few things are immune to MM.

[Clawkin]

Try heighten, its ESSENTIAL. sorry. It does screw up mass cures, but if you general just spam mass heal in raids its not an issue, turning it on and off for solo/group play is also an option.

Dropping Heighten is NOT an option.

Also, very few things are immune to MM.

Ok I updated the post, I took heighten... buuut.. i've never used it so I cant say that I'm sold on it

[Matuse]

I don't see anything particularly essential about heighten.

Doesn't work on divine punishment. Doesn't work on Implosion.

Only adds +3 to Blade Barrier, only adds +2 to Destruction. Blade Barrier works FINE even hitting at half damage (which with decent wisdom, is rare by itself), and Destruction for me always has greater issues with spell resistance than saves.

This isn't a wiz/sorc trying to land Web (which at +7, would be enourmously benefited by heighten).

Heighten is extremely optional.

[The_Brave2]

Things saving for half damage for Bladebarrier on an evoker FVS is not acceptable, if this were to happen you might as well gone lotb WF mele and dumped wisdom.

Heighten is not optional