Oh come on Turbine!

[wolflordnexus]

I looked the other day virtually every non stat non skill Item above level 75 has purified shards it's a bit ridiculous.

[Victorhammer]

I think all this twinking of the crafting system is going the wrong way and will cause trouble down the road if Turbine ever wants to increase the games level cap. Right now they are providing this game play area above level 20 to keep the high end players happy. But at what cost to game function? Are they boxing themselves into a corner that will make higher than level 20 material impossible to implement? I think they already headed that way with green steel items. and that is causing headaches now with the canith crafting. Also the ML systems does not seem to mesh well with the random loot generator. Getting both to work together seems to require a complete rewrite of major code. Thus we come back full circle to being boxed in by trying to provide higher than level 20 content out of context with the D&D theme.

I think a lot of the gripes and complaints players have about the power level of canith crafted weapons has to do with the ability to make these easier than Green Steel when they can have more power. IMHO the best way to fix a lot of these issues is to fix and implement a standard ML system across the board maybe even for Green Steel that would have a hard cap limit at level 20. That means a person can not construct a ML 21 or higher weapon until the level cap in the game goes above level 20. But then what about all of the old weapons people already made? Well there is the rub isn't it. That is what I mean about boxing themselves in. Now if Turbine wants to add higher level content to the game it will be unbalanced right out of the box by all the content like epic level quests that already exsist. At some point it will be prohibitive to even try to make material above level 20 work into this game do to the coding already in place for epic quests and gear.

The fix for this from day one would have been to not allow the game to get bastardized at and above level 20.
Part of that would be not to allow ML 21+ weapons/gear to be made period.
The other part would be a universal ML system for all gear whether made/bought/found in game.

But the cat is already out of that bag and how to put it back in is what is generating all of the fuss.
Be careful players where you push Turbine to with the crafting system. You might just cut us off from ever having higher game content if we are not there already.

[ImFour20]

i can sense many of these threads will start popping up more and more

elemental resist 30 is a pretty powerful effect. get over it

[shadow_419]

Source : Dev Tracker/Lammania Dev Tracker

I cite a Book, I'm not always going to tell you what page. That's right.

Oh, and : I get paid to write papers, too. I don't get paid to post on the forums.

Thank you for clearing up the confusion. You're not a Dev since you aren't getting paid to post. You're just getting paid to do everything else?

There is advantage to Cannith Crafting - however, there wasn't supposed to be any incentive behind deconstructing our random loot and spending hours in a crafting hall, rather than questing, in the first place.

Source : Dev Tracker/ Lammania Dev Tracker

[puget]

No. Greensteel crafting is, and has always been raid loot. It may not be the same as regular raid loot, but it indeed fills a raid loot role in this game.

Cannith crafting does not. I would say that they remain exclusive. No one with maxed cannith crafting can make you a stone skin clickie. Nor a Displacement Clickie. Nor exceptional statistics. They are different animals, keep them in different pens.

This is exactly my point. If a player wants that GS gear, they had better grind it out right?

The EXACT SAME CONCEPT should be the model for cannith crafting. Nobody should be able to get the shards to get the gear without putting in the grind.

I was completely ready, and happy with cannith crafting when first released. But the they had to toss unbound shards into the mix, so now, anyone and everyone can get the shards to make the gear without having to do anything but make a trade.

Unbound shards have caused the imbalance issue in cannith crafting to be immense, and the devs will forever be wasting development time trying to balance it, rather than just get rid of the unbound shards/raid ings from cannith crafting. Unbound shards, and attempting to balance them so the market is not flooded with ubertastic unbound shards to make great bound gear without having to level your crafting has resulted in increased demands for ings, especially raid ings.


This crafting should be just like GS crafting, you want to get the gear from it, then get ready for a grind.

I could even get behind the purified eberron shards,now that i know they did not go with the format I was under the impression they were originally going to do with the trade ins for them, I was ignorant on that when I started this thread, but I still feel that they are completely over relying on them to add them to SO MANY recipes. This will take other items out of circulation that are very much sought after by some players, meh...except for the +1 tomes, those imo are pretty much a dump it, save it, give it away, sell it, do whatever with it item and is a good way to see them actually have a better purpose than a stats point (which is nice too, but is replaced by any higher tome you gobble up)

[puget]

Thank you for clearing up the confusion. You're not a Dev since you aren't getting paid to post. You're just getting paid to do everything else?

There is advantage to Cannith Crafting - however, there wasn't supposed to be any incentive behind deconstructing our random loot and spending hours in a crafting hall, rather than questing, in the first place.

Source : Dev Tracker/ Lammania Dev Tracker

He is actually right. I did do quite a bit of searching. Maybe you should as well. EDIT: "he" being dearleader, not the quoted post.

[shadow_419]

He is actually right. I did do quite a bit of searching. Maybe you should as well. EDIT: "he" being dearleader, not the quoted post.

I don't get paid to make sure comments on the forum are factual.

Edit: btw since you already did the searching, mind posting a link? This was all that was asked for.

[toughguyjoe]

This is exactly my point. If a player wants that GS gear, they had better grind it out right?

The EXACT SAME CONCEPT should be the model for cannith crafting. Nobody should be able to get the shards to get the gear without putting in the grind.

I was completely ready, and happy with cannith crafting when first released. But the they had to toss unbound shards into the mix, so now, anyone and everyone can get the shards to make the gear without having to do anything but make a trade.

Unbound shards have caused the imbalance issue in cannith crafting to be immense, and the devs will forever be wasting development time trying to balance it, rather than just get rid of the unbound shards/raid ings from cannith crafting. Unbound shards, and attempting to balance them so the market is not flooded with ubertastic unbound shards to make great bound gear without having to level your crafting has resulted in increased demands for ings, especially raid ings.


This crafting should be just like GS crafting, you want to get the gear from it, then get ready for a grind.

I could even get behind the purified eberron shards,now that i know they did not go with the format I was under the impression they were originally going to do with the trade ins for them, I was ignorant on that when I started this thread, but I still feel that they are completely over relying on them to add them to SO MANY recipes. This will take other items out of circulation that are very much sought after by some players, meh...except for the +1 tomes, those imo are pretty much a dump it, save it, give it away, sell it, do whatever with it item and is a good way to see them actually have a better purpose than a stats point (which is nice too, but is replaced by any higher tome you gobble up)

I have a suggestion. If you hate the cannith crafting system so much, why not just ignore it. Pretend it doesn't exist. Pretend it's the quest "Dreams of Insanity" Most players don't even know where that quest is now a days. Make cannith crafting your "Dreams of Insanity"

[puget]

I have a suggestion. If you hate the cannith crafting system so much, why not just ignore it. Pretend it doesn't exist. Pretend it's the quest "Dreams of Insanity" Most players don't even know where that quest is now a days. Make cannith crafting your "Dreams of Insanity"

Also, I hate raiding and grouping, so I do not group/raid.

Cannith crafting was supposed to be something for players to get fairly decent (not the best mind you, please do not put words in my mouth again) but yet well below the best gear. The best gear being raid/epic/GS gear.

Now, you see all the players with GS gear, advocating the GLoB weapons, because they are essentially better than GS weapons. Go figure. (I may not even have GLoB right, since cannith crafting is my first experience in 3 years playing this game with anything more than adding +1 ac/1-4 crit damage on things in the stone of change).

Do you not see anything wrong with this picture? Did you buy your GlOB shard, is that why you are so upset at my opinion? Nothing would change for you, they won't take it back if they 'fix' cannith crafting.

Cannith crafting should have been, should be, and should REMAIN BtA period. This unbound shard thing, and then having to balance those unbound shards by creating MORE junk to have to get to balance it, is just getting a bit ridiculous.

That is where I stand. Your opinion may differ, but you seem to have a problem with not trolling, and actually giving good input to the conversation.

[Drekisen]

http://ddowiki.com/page/Purified_Ebe...shard_Fragment

According to the wiki, A +1 tome can be traded for 4 fragments....most likely the cheapest route to go....unless you're swimming in epic tokens.

That chart is weird.....+1 tomes are easy to come bye, and +2's are not that hard to get either and both of them yield the same or more fragments than stuff that costs RL money or is way harder to come by.

This crafting system fits in well with the current content they have been putting out, it makes no sense at all.

[puget]

That chart is weird.....+1 tomes are easy to come bye, and +2's are not that hard to get either and both of them yield the same or more fragments than stuff that costs RL money or is way harder to come by.

This crafting system fits in well with the current content they have been putting out, it makes no sense at all.

not mentioning the color here specifically......


How does the current cannith crafting fit in well? I cannot buy up an es ton of GS mats and trade them to you, and expect you to bring me back a litII heavy pick can I?

Yet you can do this with cannith crafting, which in my PERSONAL opinion, makes no sense to me. If someone else can craft me my unbound shards so I can make myself a couple heavy picks of GLoB (what does GLoB mean anyway, I forgot) Then why can't the same people take an ess bunch of GS ings to make me a litII heavy pick of whatever else they can add to it?

[Drekisen]

not mentioning the color here specifically......


How does the current cannith crafting fit in well? I cannot buy up an es ton of GS mats and trade them to you, and expect you to bring me back a litII heavy pick can I?

Yet you can do this with cannith crafting, which in my PERSONAL opinion, makes no sense to me. If someone else can craft me my unbound shards so I can make myself a couple heavy picks of GLoB (what does GLoB mean anyway, I forgot) Then why can't the same people take an ess bunch of GS ings to make me a litII heavy pick of whatever else they can add to it?

Whoa, I think you completely missed what I was saying, I said it fit's in well with the current content they released, which is based off of Xoriat lore, which is the plane of Madness.......get what I am saying now?

[Thorzian]

the crafting system as it sits is just stupid. why sugarcoat it? crafting level cap never should have been over 100. bound to character never should have happened, and at the end of it all every lootable prefix and suffix power in the entire game should have been craftable.. on any item!

raid/epic loot would still outperform crafted loot based on the 2 powers/crafted item mechanic. 1 prefix and 1 suffix. some raid/epic gear have 6-8 different powers. nevermind the outrageous crafting materials. large devil scales? ebberon essences (of any kind)? it's like building a road around a mountain when there's already a tunnel.

[puget]

Whoa, I think you completely missed what I was saying, I said it fit's in well with the current content they released, which is based off of Xoriat lore, which is the plane of Madness.......get what I am saying now?

Not even inn the slightest, and I feel extremely safe in assuming you do not get my point either, and I ALSO feel extremely safe in assuming you have not read the entire thread.

But I would like to thank you for..........your opinion.

[Gremmlynn]

Which also removes any player that doesn't have/cannot afford to get the packs they drop in. That was why I was saying make those ings unbound, same as taps, shreds, funk....etc. etc..Or make them unbound rare drops from chests in the zones as unbound instead of quest chain end rewards.

You missed the point, they are not the same as those other ings. Their whole purpose is to get players to buy those packs. As for players that can't afford the packs, grinding TPs for them is a more than fair alternative.

The thing to remember here is that, for Turbine, the primary purpose of the game is to make a profit entertaining players. That they even think of those of us who don't contribute to that profit is unexpectedly generous. for myself, I see those mystical items as contributing to that goal, though would rather see them as vendor items in sold in those areas or even in the crafting hall to anyone who owned the respective pack. While some of the things they actually added as rare ingredients, I disagree with. The purified shards are fine, as they or some of the trade-ins can be gotten by anyone anywhere. The high level drops I like less as they tie crafting to high level adventuring, something not everyone is interested in. The high end favor awards are the worse as they tie crafting to elite high level completions, something not everybody is even capable of.

[puget]

You missed the point, they are not the same as those other ings. Their whole purpose is to get players to buy those packs. As for players that can't afford the packs, grinding TPs for them is a more than fair alternative.

The thing to remember here is that, for Turbine, the primary purpose of the game is to make a profit entertaining players. That they even think of those of us who don't contribute to that profit is unexpectedly generous. for myself, I see those mystical items as contributing to that goal, though would rather see them as vendor items in sold in those areas or even in the crafting hall to anyone who owned the respective pack. While some of the things they actually added as rare ingredients, I disagree with. The purified shards are fine, as they or some of the trade-ins can be gotten by anyone anywhere. The high level drops I like less as they tie crafting to high level adventuring, something not everyone is interested in. The high end favor awards are the worse as they tie crafting to elite high level completions, something not everybody is even capable of.

I can agree to your point here, which is also why I feel that the quest end rare ingredients should e unbound, so that those players that have no desire to use the item, and has the pack mind you can at least AH the items, and the F2P players could buy the item, and make then gear they really think they want with it. THAT is a win-win for both P2P and F2P.

But that is just my opinion on the issue.

[blkcat1028]

I agree completely that unbound crafting is a bad idea, but some of the points made in this thread are a little off target.

There is nothing that can be crafted that will be better than a dual shard gs weapon. I crafted a +4 HB+silver+GLOB axe that absolutely rocks against Harry, but when I take it to Gianthold, it's worthless. My litII axe, on the other hand, is awesome just about anywhere. Cannith crafting cannot compete with the overall utility of green steel.

I also agree that the crafting system should afford ALL players with an opportunity to make some decent gear, but I'm having a hard time seeing where it fails to do just that. Yes, they have introduced some "interesting" ingredient requirements for some of the recipes, but so far I haven't anything that a casual player couldn't obtain.

Purified shards are obtainable by trading a +1 tome or eberron dragonshards, both of which drop frequently and they (the purified shards) are also dropping in F2P content.

The favor reward marks are dropping as random, unbound loot in chests... check the AH, they're already listed.

Soul gems have always been available in the AH. They're just more expensive now. This is the addition that I'm most concerned about because it tips the scales in the favour of Arcane casters at the expense of most other players.

Devil scales and demons blood are both unbound and available in the AH, expensive as @%#*, but available .

If you want to trade the eberron shards for the XP pots then that's your prerogative, but If you want to craft an item that requires a purified shard then you have a choice to make.

The point is that there are choices that enable anyone to craft the items they want.

One of the things that amazes me is how much focus is put on the crafting of weapons and zero on the crafting of items. I replaced my ring of GFL with a FF ring of IFL with a medium guild slot. I add the guild augment crystal of health and now I don't have to worry about switching my greater bold trinket and my mummified bat. Very useful when you constantly forget which one you have in. I hate hitting the lava in the Twelve.

[Gremmlynn]

Not even inn the slightest, and I feel extremely safe in assuming you do not get my point either, and I ALSO feel extremely safe in assuming you have not read the entire thread.

But I would like to thank you for..........your opinion.

A swing and a miss.

Hint, that poster is more or less agreeing with you that the system is moving in a direction that makes very little sense.

I see it that way too. It seems to me that the devs are in full panic damage control mode. Best they take a step back and a deep breath then reevaluate everything before making any more changes to the system. They should also be prepared to bite the bullet and revert or even completely reset things if that's what it takes to fix, rather than just patch, the system.

Though I rather doubt they will be allowed to do that by the powers that be.

[Gremmlynn]

I can agree to your point here, which is also why I feel that the quest end rare ingredients should e unbound, so that those players that have no desire to use the item, and has the pack mind you can at least AH the items, and the F2P players could buy the item, and make then gear they really think they want with it. THAT is a win-win for both P2P and F2P.

But that is just my opinion on the issue.

The problem is that while it would be win-win for P2P and F2P it's designed to be win for Turbine by getting players to throw some, or some more, money their direction. Those ingredients are not there to spark the economy. They are not there to promote questing. They are there for one reason, to promote the sale of adventure packs by tying the crafting system to pack ownership. IMO, it's best to not even take them into consideration when thinking about the systems balance as all they are is "you must own this pack to make this shard" flags.

[blkcat1028]

The problem is that while it would be win-win for P2P and F2P it's designed to be win for Turbine by getting players to throw some, or some more, money their direction. Those ingredients are not there to spark the economy. They are not there to promote questing. They are there for one reason, to promote the sale of adventure packs by tying the crafting system to pack ownership. IMO, it's best to not even take them into consideration when thinking about the systems balance as all they are is "you must own this pack to make this shard" flags.

I have apparently missed something here. Could you please tell me which shard you are talking about?