Guild Ship Invites

[The_Brave2]

Alright, I know this is a hot topic for many guilds, that they wont allow anyone onto their guild ship for any reason, atleast this is the case on Khyber.

My question for theese guilds is... why?

No, This isnt coming from the person making their first greensteel and doesnt have their own airship, Just wondering why if someone asks nicley to come aboard your airship you just flat out say no?

Been seeing this trend while starting up groups, someone would be like 'can I get an airship invite please' and 1-2 people in the group would say 'sorry, against guild policy'

Now, I'v asked a few of the people that do this and they havent been able to give me a better reason than 'my guild doesnt allow it'

My understanding of it is that people 'worked' hard for their airship and they dont want to allow people that didnt work for it onto the ship... Now this I just dont understand, when you invite people onto your airship its not like they use up some reasource on it, they dont crowd it up.. not like there is space issues and people are blocking shrines just to aggravate people... Its not like it takes alot of work to get some one a guild ship invite, so... what gives?

Yes, people randomly PMing you to get an airship inv to 'alter of X' is annoying as heck, but hell, if they ask nicely and your not busy.. why not?

Looking forward for peoples justifications for this... would like some of the guild leaders that put policies like this in effect to put their imput.

[krackythehoodedone]

Good Point

I belong to two guilds on my server both about the same level.

One has a policy of inviting everyone aboard all the time

The other has a more restrictive policy.

Both have a caveat that if someone or some guild really upsets the Leader or offends the Guild then they are not welcome (which is IMO perfectly reasonable)

I personally thought that the restrictive policy was rather selfish and elitist and didnt promote the values of teamwork and co-operation which are important aspects of the game.

I did mention this to the Guild Leader and to his credit he did relax the rules somewhat. However it is the will of the majority of this guild that they are the rules.

Sometimes you have to except the ''will of the people'' isnt always your way. I could have left the guild but they are such a great bunch that one small difference of opinion is a small price to pay.

The sort of arguements i have heard have been along the lines of ''this is a guild privilege for guild members'' ''We are getting inundated with spams asking for invites to craft'' and ''our guild is so big the ship has reached capacity and guildies are being turned away because it is full with guests''

[Hambo]

I would say the most obvious answer would be that the guilds in question make heavy use of guild chests and use them for non-trash items.

Anyone invited to an airship can access all the amenities on said airship, and they don't want their stash cleaned out.

[thwart]

I don't have a dog in this fight as no one has ever asked me for a guild invite. However, I see this as the guild's perogative. If you ask nicely and they say no ... that's it. They do not owe you an explanation or a good reason behind their policy. If you want access to their airship ... ask for an invite to the guild.

Take what I just said with a grain of salt though. I solo and am the leader of a guild of solo players. We have no policies, we just do our own thing. Frankly, if I see something on guild chat ... I am surprised!

[Pape_27]

I would say the most obvious answer would be that the guilds in question make heavy use of guild chests and use them for non-trash items.

Anyone invited to an airship can access all the amenities on said airship, and they don't want their stash cleaned out.

iirc, guild chests cannot be accessed by non guild members.

[MrkGrismer]

iirc, guild chests cannot be accessed by non guild members.

That depends on whether they are currently bugged or not. Last I checked they were bugged and could be accessed, but it might have been fixed.

In addition to the guild chest thing, if the guild is on the 'largeish' size they may not want to have the guild ship 'capacity' filled by non-members in such a case that a guild member wishes to use the... facilities.

For instance:

A Stormglory Tempest can have only 50 passengers at one time. If the guild's membership is in the thousands it would be relatively easy for the guild to have 50 members online at the same time, thus making the possibility of locking each other out more real. Add random numbers of 'guests' and the possibility of a lockout goes up.

[Dysmetria]

Alright, I know this is a hot topic for many guilds, that they wont allow anyone onto their guild ship for any reason, atleast this is the case on Khyber.

My question for theese guilds is... why?

It doesn't matter what their reason is. If you want on their airship, join their guild and contribute towards it like they all did.

I'd much rather know why some do allow it. 5 of us are waiting at the quest entrance for a 6th, they join and ask for an airship invite. Someone says yes, and that is another few minutes the rest of us are stuck waiting, while they get buffs. Then they often die and lose those buffs in the first few minutes of the dungeon zerging ahead cause they feel like gods with their buffs.

[somenewnoob]

I am a big fan of inviting people to my guild's ship. Especially when I'm playing my cleric and trying to keep everybody alive.....knowing everybody has 20 resists of every element lets me save a few sps!

I understand why people wouldn't want to invite since they worked for it, but IMO when you are grouping you should do anything in your power to help the group succeed on a quest, and to me that includes ship invites if needed. It annoys me when people ask for an invite, come prepared, you don't need ship buffs, if somebody offers take it, but if not be self sufficient.

[The_Brave2]

It doesn't matter what their reason is. If you want on their airship, join their guild and contribute towards it like they all did.

I'd much rather know why some do allow it. 5 of us are waiting at the quest entrance for a 6th, they join and ask for an airship invite. Someone says yes, and that is another few minutes the rest of us are stuck waiting, while they get buffs. Then they often die and lose those buffs in the first few minutes of the dungeon zerging ahead cause they feel like gods with their buffs.

Imo it does matter what the reason is, because quite frankly the instance you are suggesting isnt the one im talking about, im not talking about inviting some1 when they need to get to the quest quickly, im talking about the 3rd or 4th member asking for a ship invite, which is completly reasonable.

Ship buffs make a HUGE difference while leveling and at Cap.. the +2 damage +2 to hit among other things add a nice boost, but the effictiveness of ship buff isnt what we are debating here, im simply asking for a good reaosn to simply not allow anyone on your ship at all.

As for the comment about '50 member compacity' sounds a bit outrageous, quite frankly it takes what? 2-3mins to get ship buffs then you're on your way to the quest, its not like they are going to sit on your ship for hours to spite you when you did something nice for them.

Not all guilds WANT random people asking to join their guild all the time, most of the good guilds are exclusive and it is those guilds that I have seen not allowing people to their ship.

So.. baisicly your view point is 'I worked for it, its mine' heh. IF no one shared in DDO it would be a Sad game indeed.

[protokon]

a few reasons:

1. There is no reason why you need to access my ship for any reason, other than convenience buffs/altars. If you need those buffs in order to succeed, you should find one of those large guilds that auto-accept applications. I've played a few permadeath characters that do not allow ship buffs / twinking and to be honest, the game is still pretty easy.

2. Honoring 'ship invite pl0x' tends to slow the party down. a lot. close friends I've never had a problem inviting because they tend to use it to grab the exp shrine then port to the quest faster. other people will wander around the ship for 5-10 minutes, beat the dummy down, use the auctioneer, do some banking, next thing you know we are moving on to another quest.

3. I've personally witnessed a few minor 'griefings' in which people will run in and steal the training dummy after a lowbie has beat on it for several minutes, then walk away without helping him to beat it down again. Typically we have enough members online that a high lvl toon will prep it for people when they need to, but that doesnt stop this from happening still.

4. ship capacity. My guild has over 70 active individual members, and up to 30-40 people online at a time. now what happens when 10 of them are on lowbies and invite there group to the ship? it quickly becomes full and no one who actually belongs to the guild can get on until someone leaves.

I never said I was refusing them my ship buffs. I just said I was refusing access to my guild's ship.

[thwart]

Imo it does matter what the reason is, because quite frankly the instance you are suggesting isnt the one im talking about, im not talking about inviting some1 when they need to get to the quest quickly, im talking about the 3rd or 4th member asking for a ship invite, which is completly reasonable.

Ship buffs make a HUGE difference while leveling and at Cap.. the +2 damage +2 to hit among other things add a nice boost, but the effictiveness of ship buff isnt what we are debating here, im simply asking for a good reaosn to simply not allow anyone on your ship at all.

As for the comment about '50 member compacity' sounds a bit outrageous, quite frankly it takes what? 2-3mins to get ship buffs then you're on your way to the quest, its not like they are going to sit on your ship for hours to spite you when you did something nice for them.

Not all guilds WANT random people asking to join their guild all the time, most of the good guilds are exclusive and it is those guilds that I have seen not allowing people to their ship.

So.. baisicly your view point is 'I worked for it, its mine' heh. IF no one shared in DDO it would be a Sad game indeed.

Then why is it that wealthy people don't give me some of their money? Put another way, when you see someone in the harbor begging for plat, do you give it to them? If not, does that make you selfish because of your "I worked for it, its mine" attitude?

Again, I am a solo player. I formed a guild because I thought the buffs would be handy. A small group of like minded folks have helped the guild reach 27th level (almost 28th). The buffs are handy but not game changing. Just like the modest plat my characters have ... I have earned it by questing. So, join a guild and get the buffs. I really don't think guilds owe you an explanation for not allowing you to use their airship.

[Gkar]

On a different server but...

Just wondering why if someone asks nicley to come aboard your airship you just flat out say no?

Been seeing this trend while starting up groups, someone would be like 'can I get an airship invite please' and 1-2 people in the group would say 'sorry, against guild policy'

It depends...

If they ask when the group is full I'll say no because I don't have the time for people to go take 5 minutes to buff at that point. I started buffing when I joined the group, I'm at the door, I will not support you delaying the party.

If they send me a blind tell politely asking, I'll refuse. Why? Because in the beginning we were nice, word got around, and we were getting flooded by people asking - including when we were off trying to quest. I don't need that constant tells, so no. Well actually not quite no... If I'm not in quest I generally offer the invite for 1 LDS. Once someone said yes, mostly I get silence or reportable language back.

Now if we are grouped up, and if it an appropriate time to buff, then I'll happily send an invite.

Part of DDO is to help your fellow players, and just to flat out refuse some1 ship buffs from your ship if just plane stingy and rude...

Actually that just makes you selfish and rude. You have no right to that which someone else earned. It's hearing comments like those that make people want to give anyone who asks the finger.

[smyter]

I think if you cut all the bull to the side, it comes down to 1 thing:

"We worked hard to build the favor so that I can be better than you, you are not going to ride my coat-tails to put you on par with me and mine"

This is such a **** thing to do. The goal of a party should be to have a successful and fun quest. The resistance shrines, as mentioned before, are one of the best things when it comes to this. Denying people the better shrines is taking mana out of your pool. All because of what? Pride?

I think one of the best things about my guild finally getting to 30% shrines is the fact that we can share them. All the other shrines make the party as a whole more effective. They are gimping themselves by being this way.

But, maybe that is what they are going for. These are the same people that announce kill count throughout a dungeon.

Nonetheless, it is their prerogative. I do like the fact that guilds have some sort of ownership in this game.

[The_Brave2]

a few reasons:

1. There is no reason why you need to access my ship for any reason, other than convenience buffs/altars. If you need those buffs in order to succeed, you should find one of those large guilds that auto-accept applications. I've played a few permadeath characters that do not allow ship buffs / twinking and to be honest, the game is still pretty easy.


Its not that people need the ship buffs, its a nice boost to any player tho. Ship buffs are an INSANE boost at low levels and should be taken advantage of

2. Honoring 'ship invite pl0x' tends to slow the party down. a lot. close friends I've never had a problem inviting because they tend to use it to grab the exp shrine then port to the quest faster. other people will wander around the ship for 5-10 minutes, beat the dummy down, use the auctioneer, do some banking, next thing you know we are moving on to another quest.

Possibly I am bias because of the way I run quests, I'll take a few people and short man baisicly anything at low levels, so you get a few people wandering around your guild ship, most people will grab buffs, port and get to the quest quicker than running from where ever they are.

3. I've personally witnessed a few minor 'griefings' in which people will run in and steal the training dummy after a lowbie has beat on it for several minutes, then walk away without helping him to beat it down again. Typically we have enough members online that a high lvl toon will prep it for people when they need to, but that doesnt stop this from happening still.

Valid reason, but I still counter that most people have some common decency, imo you should base your guild policies on a few people.

4. ship capacity. My guild has over 70 active individual members, and up to 30-40 people online at a time. now what happens when 10 of them are on lowbies and invite there group to the ship? it quickly becomes full and no one who actually belongs to the guild can get on until someone leaves.

10 people on lobies + 20 or so people in their groups, im my experience any1 from a high level guild leveling a lowbie with any experience only has an additonal 1-2 people in their group. Even then, the people in those groups arent all going on the ship at once, the instance you sugest is 10 ppl all logging at the same time to their lowbie, getting in seperate groups, and all inviting people in their party to the airship at the same time, highly unlikley.

I have NEVER experienced a 'ship full' bug at all... ever. I dont see it being a problem.

Most people spend 2-3mins on a ship then about an hour questing before they go back, in that hour 70 people, times 3mins for each person for an hour = 1,400 people could use your ship during that time. even randomly inviting people to your ship would you have an issue hitting that number.

I never said I was refusing them my ship buffs. I just said I was refusing access to my guild's ship.

I fail to see a difference.

Seeing as people keep bringing up maximum ship passengers, can any1 attest to encountering a ship full bug on a high level guild ship? Seems like a Hypothetical problem imo, thoughts?

[littlewing]

pfft, i don't see the big deal, Ive sent many invites out on request, Ive also got quite a few to come over to our guild because of the ship.
no, i don't actively recruit people that are already in a guild , but if they want to dump their old guild for mine, who am i to argue?


i myself couldn't stay in a guild with such an anal retentive policy

[Leatherneck]

Imo it does matter what the reason is, because quite frankly the instance you are suggesting isnt the one im talking about, im not talking about inviting some1 when they need to get to the quest quickly, im talking about the 3rd or 4th member asking for a ship invite, which is completly reasonable.

Ship buffs make a HUGE difference while leveling and at Cap.. the +2 damage +2 to hit among other things add a nice boost, but the effictiveness of ship buff isnt what we are debating here, im simply asking for a good reaosn to simply not allow anyone on your ship at all.

As for the comment about '50 member compacity' sounds a bit outrageous, quite frankly it takes what? 2-3mins to get ship buffs then you're on your way to the quest, its not like they are going to sit on your ship for hours to spite you when you did something nice for them.

Not all guilds WANT random people asking to join their guild all the time, most of the good guilds are exclusive and it is those guilds that I have seen not allowing people to their ship.

So.. baisicly your view point is 'I worked for it, its mine' heh. IF no one shared in DDO it would be a Sad game indeed.

A better question to you would be why does it matter? If it is their policy that is their right to enforce it amongst their members.

[The_Brave2]

A better question to you would be why does it matter? If it is their policy that is their right to enforce it amongst their members.

My question is why would they? not like im lobying to change their guild policy, its their right, but I want a good reason why they are being stingy

[Dolphious]

I am a big fan of inviting people to my guild's ship. Especially when I'm playing my cleric and trying to keep everybody alive.....knowing everybody has 20 resists of every element lets me save a few sps!

I understand why people wouldn't want to invite since they worked for it, but IMO when you are grouping you should do anything in your power to help the group succeed on a quest, and to me that includes ship invites if needed. It annoys me when people ask for an invite, come prepared, you don't need ship buffs, if somebody offers take it, but if not be self sufficient.

How is that any worse than waiting for anyone, your royal highness included, to get ship buffs? And while there is probably some correlation between guild level and player skill it's extremely modest (much more modest than the notable correlation between huge d-bags and lvl 70+ guilds).

[LordMond63]

The only two arguments which ring true at all to me are issues with non-members being able to access the guild chest and possibly exceeding the maximum number of people allowable on the ship (or 'using the facilities') at one time.

As a member of a guild, I am bound to play according to their rules. If one of those is No Non-Guildies To Be Invoted On The Ship, then that is the policy I will follow. Neither of the guilds to which I belong as any such restriction, so I have no problem inving folks to use our various altars/shrines/npcs. If the boosts they get from our airship enable us to finish a quest in a more efficient manner, I'm all for that.

[Dolphious]

A better question to you would be why does it matter? If it is their policy that is their right to enforce it amongst their members.

That's a silly straw-man, who said that it's not their right?