Sorc, Wiz, or FvS

[Aashrym]

I've been using the wf wizard build and its a nice change of pace. The only problem I have is with the wizard is I run out of sp really fast. It seems im using too much sp too fast, any mission that is kinda long like waterworks I run out quick using my fire spells and healing in between battles.

Master's touch and the best weapon you can find works as mentioned in the post above. Other things to keep in mind:

1) You don't need to keep your meta's on all the time. This increases efficiency on damage spells.
2) You should have at least the eternal wand from Korthos from the tutorial. It can still work for you in waterworks if you have nothing else.
3) Turn in collectibles and you will get more wand to burn thru, even tho they are not eternal.
4) Echoes can still provide at least something if you have issues after looking at using a melee weapon and the first 3 suggestions.

Hope that helps.

[Drekisen]

Lower levels of Wiz....Charm Person and Command Undead are your best friends.....cheap and very efficient CC.

Nuking is not really an option...not enough SP.....but those two spells make most of the lower level quests trivial. Once you hit level 5 you also get Suggestion which opens up even more possibilities to what you can charm and is on a set timer, without recurring saves.

Wizards get a lot of feats too, and you get one free feat exchange, you might consider using Augment Summon for the first few levels, and if you really like it keeping it permanently. It really does makes Charmed minions, summons, and hirelings a lot more durable.

[The_Brave2]

Lower levels of Wiz....Charm Person and Command Undead are your best friends.....cheap and very efficient CC.

Nuking is not really an option...not enough SP.....but those two spells make most of the lower level quests trivial. Once you hit level 5 you also get Suggestion which opens up even more possibilities to what you can charm and is on a set timer, without recurring saves.

Granted, charm may see usefull at first, but imo it will just slow down your game, nothing is going to kill stuff quicker than picking up the ol' greataxe with masters touch and beating the snot out of everything while using your SP pool to repair yourself.

[lockmasterg]

Ok thanks for the advice. I have the masters spell so ill try that out. When do you start to transition from melee dmg to more spell oriented?

[The_Brave2]

Ok thanks for the advice. I have the masters spell so ill try that out. When do you start to transition from melee dmg to more spell oriented?

I tend to see the change at about lv.7 when you get firewall, scorch is a huge DPS spell, start using that around 5 and you should have plenty of SP. turn off your metas and shoot some 6SP Scorch's off while meleing, HUGE dps. Its all about efficent combination of spell and mele at lower levels, quite frankly I keep the greataxe equiped untill after iv completed deleras for that extra little damage boost.

Only way to keep the greataxe/sword equiped tho is to have some superior inferno clickies, if you cant afford them, go to house J and buy some greater inferno pots from the pot vender, I beleive they are realitivly cheap and VERRY usefull.

[Drekisen]

Granted, charm may see usefull at first, but imo it will just slow down your game, nothing is going to kill stuff quicker than picking up the ol' greataxe with masters touch and beating the snot out of everything while using your SP pool to repair yourself.

I play the game for fun....not XP/minute....sorry.

[The_Brave2]

I play the game for fun....not XP/minute....sorry.

sorry if my way of having fun is different than yours.

[Phidius]

Granted, charm may see usefull at first, but imo it will just slow down your game, nothing is going to kill stuff quicker than picking up the ol' greataxe with masters touch and beating the snot out of everything while using your SP pool to repair yourself.

Charm/Beating the snot are not mutually exclusive.

The best use for Charm Person/Suggestion is when you're being gang-banged - you're taking 2 mobs out of the battle with one spell (the one you charm, and the one it fights).

Usually, when faced with a pack of 5-6 mobs, the charmed one will still be alive with a sliver of hit points - easy to break the charm and kill it.

Just make sure you target the melee mobs, and wack the casters

[Drekisen]

Charm/Beating the snot are not mutually exclusive.

The best use for Charm Person/Suggestion is when you're being gang-banged - you're taking 2 mobs out of the battle with one spell (the one you charm, and the one it fights).

Usually, when faced with a pack of 5-6 mobs, the charmed one will still be alive with a sliver of hit points - easy to break the charm and kill it.

Just make sure you target the melee mobs, and wack the casters

In the lower levels I charm the casters actually, unless you're doing a hard or elite at level...on normal the casters are usually not hard to charm and cause a ton of pandemonium.

Plus I have noticed that those Kobold Shamans are the meanest of all the kobolds......they are usually the hardest to hit as well.

Now when it comes to the Hobs.....I usually go for the CR6 ones...I forget their exact name.....they usually fall prey to charm......and they hit pretty darn hard. In actuality Arcane casters are not that hard to charm....they have high INT or CHA not WIS.....unless they have Force of Personality built in or are some kind of hybrid.

[Drekisen]

sorry if my way of having fun is different than yours.

I wasn't assuming that the OP's version of fun was the same as yours.

[GeoBob]

I have the UMD to use harm scrolls. Barely and with equipment swaps. I wish I could just buy them.

Thats just the difference then isnt it? For a PM wiz, you would have to farm harm scrolls and have to have the UMD and gear to use them. But, you probably wouldnt get that UMD until lvl 17 or 18. Where an AM WF would be able to buy recon scrolls from the Portable Hole, or probably many other scroll vendors. I always carry around a stack of 100 so im not relying on that cure serious, but on your harm scrolls, you really have to conserve them due to not being purchasable. I can't rule out which is better, but imo, learning spells, and getting to know them, is a lot easier as an AM WF.

[likuei]

Several people who have responded to this thread do not like to play characters that see ALL casters as support classes and would like it to stay that way. Save the heartache you will experience by being SEEN as support character, just play a max STR, max CON dwarf melee class.

[supp3nhuhn]

With the low sp costs that combat spells have now you can start nuking right off the boat in korthos. Just dont use metamagics.

[voodoogroves]

Charm/Beating the snot are not mutually exclusive.

The best use for Charm Person/Suggestion is when you're being gang-banged - you're taking 2 mobs out of the battle with one spell (the one you charm, and the one it fights).

Usually, when faced with a pack of 5-6 mobs, the charmed one will still be alive with a sliver of hit points - easy to break the charm and kill it.

Just make sure you target the melee mobs, and wack the casters

Charm and move on while they fight amongst themselves is many times MUCH faster than chipping away at their HP stack.

OP: All of them are fun, and all of them can melee early. Clerics and FVS can also remain useful in melee throughout their careers (somewhat trickier to do w/ wiz/sorc for newer players).

[SpearKicker]

I just reached lvl 7th with my first arcane character yesterday (a WF AM). I took spell focus evocation, for the almost free magic missiles. The way I go through quests, usually soloing, until yesterday, was using a Greataxe and grouping mobs for a Maximized+Empowered Acid Blast. It really kills almost all mobs at range in normal at least. A friend that runs quests sometimes with me like to call it a "mass disintegrate". For single target, or finishing that mobs that dont die at the acid blast I use the magic missile form de enhancement line, or just melee. Usually I dont miss SPs between shrines.

But, as said, my experience with arcanes is almost zero. I am willing to try this charm person/monster and suggestion approach suggested above. The nice thing of being a wizzy is that you can test all different playstyles, ist it! Thanks for sharing this strategy!

By the way, I plan to change the SF Evocation for SF Conjuration or Enchantment when I reach higher levels. Took the first early just to have more low cost damage spells at beggining.

EDIT: forgot to mention that until now I just heal myself with guild pots and wands. I dont carry yet a reconstruct spell prepared, and I am not missing it yet.

[Drekisen]

I just reached lvl 7th with my first arcane character yesterday (a WF AM). I took spell focus evocation, for the almost free magic missiles. The way I go through quests, usually soloing, until yesterday, was using a Greataxe and grouping mobs for a Maximized+Empowered Acid Blast. It really kills almost all mobs at range in normal at least. A friend that runs quests sometimes with me like to call it a "mass disintegrate". For single target, or finishing that mobs that dont die at the acid blast I use the magic missile form de enhancement line, or just melee. Usually I dont miss SPs between shrines.

But, as said, my experience with arcanes is almost zero. I am willing to try this charm person/monster and suggestion approach suggested above. The nice thing of being a wizzy is that you can test all different playstyles, ist it! Thanks for sharing this strategy!

By the way, I plan to change the SF Evocation for SF Conjuration or Enchantment when I reach higher levels. Took the first early just to have more low cost damage spells at beggining.

EDIT: forgot to mention that until now I just heal myself with guild pots and wands. I dont carry yet a reconstruct spell prepared, and I am not missing it yet.

You won't get it until level 11....you can scroll it at level 9 tho....but there is a chance you will fail using it at both level 9 and 10......at level 11 scrolling Recon will be auto-succeed.

[Aashrym]

Thats just the difference then isnt it? For a PM wiz, you would have to farm harm scrolls and have to have the UMD and gear to use them. But, you probably wouldnt get that UMD until lvl 17 or 18. Where an AM WF would be able to buy recon scrolls from the Portable Hole, or probably many other scroll vendors. I always carry around a stack of 100 so im not relying on that cure serious, but on your harm scrolls, you really have to conserve them due to not being purchasable. I can't rule out which is better, but imo, learning spells, and getting to know them, is a lot easier as an AM WF.

For the amount that I use harm scrolls it isn't that bad. The aura does a lot of healing and keeping moving prevents a lot of damage. I also use defensive spells and CC spells as needed.

Using scrolls and spamming scrolls are two different things. The PM aura is like an extremely high regeneration and works wonders at low cost. The scrolls are a back up to the aura and occasional burst. Before scrolls I used inflict wands which are very easy to farm now that they come with collectible turn in.

[Aashrym]

Charm and move on while they fight amongst themselves is many times MUCH faster than chipping away at their HP stack.

I'll do that if the group wants to use that tactic but it don't like it. I like to kill things instead. That's also why I'm really annoyed that we can removed death immunities on mobs but not charm immunities.

Realistically the only thing the tactic does it provide a faster completion with a lower xp reward for the quest. Faster xp/min for players who want to do that but that only goes so far anyway because double TR's tend to need those XP bonuses so have incentive to not use the charm and dash, and running epics the party is just giving up scroll drops for no xp anyway.

If we see more crafting done using teabag drop ingredients that have been in the game forever we have another incentive to farm low level ingredients for crafting.

Instead of the blanket immunities that still exist we should be looking at incentives not to charm and run by. The funny thing is that even with a short charm we can still just let the charms grab aggro and run thru so that system only hurts the players who want to stay and fight.

That's my sidenote peeve you reminded me of. I blame you and you should know better by now, lol.


@the OP: WF wizard if you have it is good for learning on. (I'm staying on topic )