Remove Renown Bonus - Implement Decay

[Dysmetria]

No, that's not right.

How is it not right? As guild level increases, the decay amount increases. Regardless of whether you are large or small.

As the guild member size increases, the decay also increases. But the more people you have, the more people there are to gain renown to offest that penalty.

The simple fact of this matter is that larger guilds are more likely to have slackers that do not get much if any renown from week to week. If they policed their members like the small power guilds they could rise to the guild level cap eventually as well.

[gloopygloop]

I am writing this as a member of a large guild.

/not signed. You have NO understanding of how guild renown actually works.

My guild is currently stalled in the mid 60's. At that level, each guild member needs to earn about 350 renown per day (PER ACCOUNT, not per character) in order to pay for themselves. I certainly don't play every day, but when I do play, I pick up at least 2000 renown. I end up with at least 8000 renown per week, even on a bad week.

If all of the members of my guild did that, we would have be level 100 already.

The ONLY reason why a few small guilds have gotten to such a high level is that EVERY SINGLE player in that small guild is a full out, balls to the wall DDO machine. The ONLY reason why the larger guilds have not gotten to such a high level is that larger guilds have a significant number of characters that are dead weight in the renown department.

The small guild renown bonus is not the problem. Guild members who don't run enough quests and take renown rewards is the "problem" and I don't really see that it is a problem because I don't want guilds to require that their members play a certain amount each day in order to "pay" for their guild membership. I think that kind of attitude isn't good for the game.

[gloopygloop]

No, that's not right.

Would you like to back that statement up with something or are you just going to throw out incorrect assertions in this thread and leave them unsupported?

[DoctorWhofan]

Would you like to back that statement up with something or are you just going to throw out incorrect assertions in this thread and leave them unsupported?

Read on, I beleive he was corrected.

[LightInDark]

On a side topic, where and when do I see decay affect my guide ?. Is it on the same day each week or same time every night ? or something else ?

Is it listed somewhere or do I have to monitor guide points and watch for a change ?

[shadow_419]

On a side topic, where and when do I see decay affect my guide ?. Is it on the same day each week or same time every night ? or something else ?

Is it listed somewhere or do I have to monitor guide points and watch for a change ?

Don't take this as gospel, just my observation. Guild decay seems to hit some time mid morning (8-10AM)EST

[Dysmetria]

Read on, I beleive he was corrected.

No, that's not right.

[Dav]

Secondly, I would like to see a new threshold added; a way to remove VERY old accounts that will not count as Recent Departs.

This.

As a member of guild with many gaming chapters often someone leaves to try the next new game, try another game in another chapter, or has something in real life that prevents them from playing for a while, etc. We keep them in because usually we see them back in a month or two or three. And we have many who aren't able to play everyday, and that's fine, it's part of our "casual" style.

From my experience it seems like a 6 month threshold would be reasonable to set for remove inactive accounts without penalty.

[Thar]

I could care less if some small guild level's quick. good for them.

It's taken caffeine like over a month to get from 69 to 69.7... The decay is too much on large guilds. That is what needs to be adjusted. We loose too much every night.

[DragonTroy]

i wouldnt say they should flat out remove the renown boost. that would just hurt everyone.

wouldnt it be easier if at a certain level, 75-80 seems fair, they get less renown boost until they are eventually without it? get 4000 renown off a legendary victory really shouldnt be happening with the high level well established guilds. it should be more of a helping hand to get newer guilds started

[Schmoe]

Guild level is not a competition; it's not the next progression of PvP.

If you want a guild that reaches high levels, you need to ensure that all your members are dedicated players that will bring in a lot of renown. This policy remains true whether you are a guild of 2 or 200.

[puget]

i wouldnt say they should flat out remove the renown boost. that would just hurt everyone.

wouldnt it be easier if at a certain level, 75-80 seems fair, they get less renown boost until they are eventually without it? get 4000 renown off a legendary victory really shouldnt be happening with the high level well established guilds. it should be more of a helping hand to get newer guilds started

NO.

Why should I be penalized because of all the rude jerk blind inviting idiots forced me to start my own guild with only myself in it so I stop getting not only the rude jerk face invites, but the text in my box that seems to think it needs to notify me some rude jerkface loser has sent me said invite even though I have guild invites turned off?

EDIT: I had to waste my TP's to get said guild charter, and without that bonus, I would not even be at GL 12 after about a month to a month and 1/2. Why does it matter that small guilds are getting a bonus, I will tell you npw, most of them only started off for the same reason I listed above, if anything, they should get more renown in my opinion.

Fix decay, but leave the small guilds out of it, it is not their fault they stay small to avoid the renown hit, Just like it is the BIG guilds that keep dead weight of non logging players in their guilds that nails them with renown loss.

[Ashbinder]

A little late on the debate, but I just thought I'd mention that 6 man guilds are inefficient for renown purposes. It's better to be 7-16 members for the best rates.

Here's a table of unmodified renown needed at level 100 to maintain the decay rate.

Guild 	Renown 	Renown Decay 	Modified Daily Renown 
Size	Bonus	(Level 100)	Decay	Per Account
1	1.5	33000		13200	13200
2	1.8	36000		12857	6428
3	2.1	39000		12580	4193
4	2.4	42000		12352	3088
5	2.7	45000		12162	2432
6	3	48000		12000	2000
7	2.85	51000		13246	1892
8	2.7	54000		14594	1824
9	2.55	57000		16056	1784
10	2.4	60000		17647	1764
11	2.25	63000		19384	1762
12	2.1	66000		21290	1774
13	1.95	69000		23389	1799
14	1.8	72000		25714	1836
15	1.65	75000		28301	1886
16	1.5	78000		31200	1950
17	1.37	81000		34177	2010
18	1.255	84000		37250	2069
19	1.152	87000		40427	2127
20	1.059	90000		43710	2185
21	0.975	93000		47088	2242
22	0.898	96000		50579	2299
23	0.829	99000		54127	2353
24	0.765	102000		57790	2407
25	0.706	105000		61547	2461
26	0.652	108000		65375	2514
27	0.601	111000		69331	2567
28	0.555	114000		73311	2618
29	0.511	117000		77432	2670
30	0.471	120000		81577	2719
31	0.433	123000		85833	2768
32	0.397	126000		90193	2818
33	0.364	129000		94574	2865
34	0.332	132000		99099	2914
35	0.303	135000		103607	2960
36	0.275	138000		108235	3006
37	0.248	141000		112980	3053
38	0.223	144000		117743	3098
39	0.199	147000		122602	3143
40	0.176	150000		127551	3188
41	0.155	153000		132467	3230
42	0.134	156000		137566	3275
43	0.115	159000		142600	3316
44	0.096	162000		147810	3359
45	0.078	165000		153061	3401
46	0.061	168000		158341	3442
47	0.045	171000		163636	3481
48	0.029	174000		169096	3522
49	0.014	177000		174556	3562
50	0	180000		180000	3600

Assuming each member earns equal amounts of renown on average, a 7-16 man guild needs less than 2K per day per person before modifiers to beat the decay. Others need more.

[Milfeulle]

Small guild takes more AD for the best ship Stormglory Typhoon, which cost 400 AD.
If you have 100 members in your guild, no biggies, 4 AD from everyone, done.
If you have only 8 members in your guild, either buy 50 AD or don't bother with it.
Another problem is for small guild, all players must keep grinding, stop playing for a few days and guild level will SUFFER.
For big guild, you always have bunch of people on playing everyday.

[TheDjinnFor]

Please do not suggest such a thing. I have a small guild, and we have been stuck in the mid 30's for forever. If anything, the decay needs to be reduced. I would really like to get a bigger ship someday.

Oh, come on. Decay per day at level 39 is about 222 renown plus an extra 22.2 renown per member. Surely you can gain several times that much in a day?

[gloopygloop]

Oh, come on. Decay per day at level 39 is about 222 renown plus an extra 22.2 renown per member. Surely you can gain several times that much in a day?

...which makes me wonder why so many large guilds (including my own) are stuck in the 50's and 60's.

[Fensen]

I think the bonuses for smaller guilds are fine and I actually am in favor of removing renown decay completely. This is a game, not a career. As such, it should be fun and not another cause for daily stress. Let guilds keep what they have earned.

[puget]

I think the bonuses for smaller guilds are fine and I actually am in favor of removing renown decay completely. This is a game, not a career. As such, it should be fun and not another cause for daily stress. Let guilds keep what they have earned.

Agreed. This would make the dead weight of non logging players in larger guilds a non-issue.

[Dysmetria]

Agreed. This would make the dead weight of non logging players in larger guilds a non-issue.

Removing that dead weight or not inviting it into your guild in the first place would also make it a non-issue.

[Eladiun]

While I don't think small/medium guild bonuses should be removed they should be scaled back significantly. Decay should also be scaled back.