rare/equipable items to craft greater banes - no. to craft major/superior bane - YES.

[Shade]

An idea that can both revitalize the now 100% dead random loot system, and make crafting fun and worthwhile to boot at the very high/very expensive levels.

Let us make major/superior banes, at very high lvls.
Greater banes are about 70-85 now, so major can be 80-95.

Have them sit inbetween greater and epic .. say:

Greater +4, 3d6
Major, +5, 4d6
Superior, +6, 5d6 (for a later date at maybe lvl100+, or just for specific named items)
Epic is currently +8, 6d6

That would still keep our crafted loot below the levels of the better epic weapons, but allow us to surpass greensteel (at a much higher cost)

Costs would be rather high like:
2-3 random lootgen greater bane weapon of the same type (or perhaps allow a few named types as options - like giant stalker knife, etc)
even more purified eberron essences, say 10ish
various other valuable stuff like the current greater banes use: devil scales, red scales, etc.
(plus the millions of plat and hours you have to spend to grind to get to these levels)

Using lootgen weps would be nice because if you find say a crappy greater lawful outsider bane club.. now you think: meh another thing to destroy for essences..
Instead youd be like: Sweet, i can put that towards crafting an even better bane.

[Chai]

How easy does killing evil outsiders and undead need to get? The greater bane weapons with a holy burst suffix when applicable surpass most epics on the bane mob anyhow barring the eSOS.

[Kza]

Before any hard quest/raid is done, plz stop power inflation. Game not fun anymore since more or less anything just a walz in the park.

[Dunklerlindwurm]

"That would still keep our crafted loot below the levels of the better epic weapons, but allow us to surpass greensteel (at a much higher cost)"



And how many Epic Weapons with Epic Banes are in the Game ?

[Forzah]

"That would still keep our crafted loot below the levels of the better epic weapons, but allow us to surpass greensteel (at a much higher cost)"



And how many Epic Weapons with Epic Banes are in the Game ?

Ancient vulkoorim dagger!

[Shade]

How easy does killing evil outsiders and undead need to get? The greater bane weapons with a holy burst suffix when applicable surpass most epics on the bane mob anyhow barring the eSOS.

More like barring:
ESoS
Xuum
Antique Greataxe (well once upgraded)
Hammer of life (vs undeads)
Chaosblade
Pirate Cutlass
Thornlord
Few more..

Sure there needs to be more and stronger epic weapons i agree.
Sure the games too easy I agree.
But I don't see why either of those things need to stop crafting from moving forwards. They all need attention.

And yea far as evil outsider and undead goes - sure, we got em covered (or at least should if the epic antique/hellstroke get nice upgrades). We could eliminate those banes entirely, and lawful outsider.. leave those for upcoming new named items or epic upgrades.

Just have the other dozen+ types for some variety in what weapon is best. Instead of now where its pretty boring what weapon is best:
Giant - lit2
Magic beast - lit2
Vermin - lit2
orc - lit2
human - lit2
goblin - lit2
etc..

[Shade]

Before any hard quest/raid is done, plz stop power inflation. Game not fun anymore since more or less anything just a walz in the park.

If the damage is done, how is stopping now going to fix it?

Thats an entirely seperate issue unrelated to this.

And who told you their workin on any "hard" quest or raid anyways. Pretty sure there sticking with the trivial casual stuff like they have been for the last couple years..

DDO is not a hard game, and thats not a good excuse to keep crafting boring at the very highest levle.

[Aelonwy]

Personally, I don't like it. Cannith crafting, as I understood it, was meant to enable us to gear our alts through the grind that is this crafting sytem to be decently equipped for raids/easier epics until said alt could equip themselves with loot from said raids/easier epics if they so wished to do the raids/epics at all.

As I understood it (meaning I could be far off the mark), Cannith Crafting was never meant to rival raid or epic loot and currently does so in only a very small number of items. Please keep those enchantments for awesome named loot exclusive.

That said I would like for some relaxation of slot restrictions in Cannith Crafting, even for an increased but not insurmountable cost and I was hoping for some recipes at the pinnacle of the bound crafting levels 150 (and not unbound ever) such as paralyzing and smiting.

[Zerkul]

True LitII is almost always a the best choice ... i like the cannith crafting as well ... but i do not want to carry 3 pages of inventory only for greater bane weapons and swap them during the whole quest. I already carry sets of weapons with in offhand hammer, sirocco, destrction weapon other debuffers and greensteel in mainhand ... don't want to do a set for each bane weapon i carry. THF need just one inventory slot per bane, with TWF need two for each set.

[gwenniez]

[abbadon3718]

More like barring:
ESoS
Xuum
Antique Greataxe (well once upgraded)
Hammer of life (vs undeads)
Chaosblade
Pirate Cutlass
Thornlord
Few more..

Sure there needs to be more and stronger epic weapons i agree.
Sure the games too easy I agree.
But I don't see why either of those things need to stop crafting from moving forwards. They all need attention.

And yea far as evil outsider and undead goes - sure, we got em covered (or at least should if the epic antique/hellstroke get nice upgrades). We could eliminate those banes entirely, and lawful outsider.. leave those for upcoming new named items or epic upgrades.

Just have the other dozen+ types for some variety in what weapon is best. Instead of now where its pretty boring what weapon is best:
Giant - lit2
Magic beast - lit2
Vermin - lit2
orc - lit2
human - lit2
goblin - lit2
etc..

I think someone needs to check their math if they think lit2 is better than +5 holy burst greater bane with force ritual. Especially on epic where that +9 to hit more than makes up for the 2% lit strike. Not that any of that matters atm, ddo is all about casters since u9.

[Yaga_Nub]

......

Sure there needs to be more and stronger epic weapons i agree.
Sure the games too easy I agree.

...

Shade, in those two lines, you completely contradicted yourself.

If the game is too easy, the we don't need more and stronger epic weapons. If the game is too hard then the proposed changes to crafting that you're making won't really help at all.

Plus your crafting levels are all off if you're really serious about this suggestion. For instance, if Lesser Lawful Outsider Bane is CL 9, Lawful Outsider Bane is CL 41 and Greater Lawful Outsider Bane is CL 72 the Major Lawful Outsider Bane would need to be in the 105 range not in the 80 to 95 range.

Personally I don't see the need to introduce new craftable prefixes and suffixes that aren't already dropping on random loot but as long as it was balanced with an insane cost I think it would be ok. Although I would like to see they easing slot restrictions before doing anything like this.

[Chai]

Shade, in those two lines, you completely contradicted yourself.

If the game is too easy, the we don't need more and stronger epic weapons. If the game is too hard then the proposed changes to crafting that you're making won't really help at all.

.

Well kind of, but not really.

The issue with epic weapons is there are other items that are easier to get that are better in many cases. From what Ive seen of Shades posts in the past regarding then they should be both harder to get, through running harder content, and EPIC.

In my opinion that the other epics should at least approach the eSOS - not surpass it but approach it, so that they are better than Shroud crafted stuff.

Its also my opinion that the best stuff should drop from the hardest quests. Epic devils assault should have an eSOS like weapon of a much different type. Xuum should be brought more in line with the eSOS. There are more people running around with eSOS than epic Xuum. Why bother with Xuum, just run eVON 3&6 repeatedly.

[Yaga_Nub]

Well kind of, but not really.

The issue with epic weapons is there are other items that are easier to get that are better in many cases. From what Ive seen of Shades posts in the past regarding then they should be both harder to get, through running harder content, and EPIC.

In my opinion that the other epics should at least approach the eSOS - not surpass it but approach it, so that they are better than Shroud crafted stuff.

Its also my opinion that the best stuff should drop from the hardest quests. Epic devils assault should have an eSOS like weapon of a much different type. Xuum should be brought more in line with the eSOS. There are more people running around with eSOS than epic Xuum. Why bother with Xuum, just run eVON 3&6 repeatedly.

Or you could look at it from the other perspective that all non-epic weapons should be reduced in power/have their ML increased. Sure that will never happen but that's what should happen.

It was obvious from day one that DDO wasn't sure if it was going to make it so they only created 10 levels of character classes but 20 levels of loot. We should not be able to wield +3 weapons at level 4. +5 weapons/armor shouldn't be ML 8. Everything is off but the old devs and game designers went Monty Haul on us. Personally, I'd love to see the whole game rebalanced for level 20 instead of level 10 like it is now. For instance, getting your class main attribute enhancements shouldn't happen at 2, 6 and 10, it should happen at 5, 10 and 15. Sure it would screw up some builds but things are too easy as it is now. Racial stat bonuses should be around the 7-8 and 14-15 range instead of 4 and 8. But I digress.

ESoS can't be the benchmark. The loot designer screwed the pooch with that one but the game can't keep being held hostage by that one UTTERLY HORRIBLE SCREW UP. Turbine needs to bite the bullet and reduce ESoS to a respectable epic weapon instead of trying to make every epic weapon make their screw up.

[Shade]

I think someone needs to check their math if they think lit2 is better than +5 holy burst greater bane with force ritual. Especially on epic where that +9 to hit more than makes up for the 2% lit strike. Not that any of that matters atm, ddo is all about casters since u9.

who needs to do the math, can check that in barrage in 1 minute:

hogblob khopsh:
124.65 = 105.225(Weapon) + 19.425(Bonus)
lit2 khopesh:
127.65 = 101.175(Weapon) + 26.475(Bonus

far as AC goes. Lit2 is a trash killing wep, trash has poor AC. You dont use your trash weapons on bosses, thats what the hoglob is for.

I like how every nay sayer about melee upgrades is always
"who cares because casters are best!"

Yea whatever, casters take a back seat to my melee. Play better.

And who here in this thread has their crafting lvls at 100+ anyways?
No one?
And no one plans to either.

Thats why crafting is boring, it needs a reason for us to strive to keep going.

This idea is a great one for that.

Disagreeing because of X without offering an alternative is a utter waste of board space. Suggest an alternate way to make us want to continue, else stop trolling.

[Aelonwy]

Well in that case, Shade, it seems we just missed the point of your original post. It would seem from your reply that putting forth the idea of major/superior banes as a goal in Cannith Crafting is not the question in and of itself that we should be replying to... and so far that is really all we've been addressing. Your most recent post seems to say you want an overarching goal for the Cannith Crafting system outside of what can be found in current random loot.

Thats why crafting is boring, it needs a reason for us to strive to keep going.

Suggest an alternate way to make us want to continue, else stop trolling.

I would have to assert that so far the devs have been indicating that Cannith is mainly for getting that perfect random item you can't get to drop for yourself. If you have all the resources in the game to purchase said perfect random item off the AH, then maybe Cannith Crafting just isn't for you. For many of the rest of us this is an absolutely acceptable goal and purpose for this type of crafting. Many of us already have a reason to keep striving... we are the have nots.

[grodon9999]

These suggestions are ridiculously over-powered for cannith crafted stuff.

[abbadon3718]

who needs to do the math, can check that in barrage in 1 minute:

hogblob khopsh:
124.65 = 105.225(Weapon) + 19.425(Bonus)
lit2 khopesh:
127.65 = 101.175(Weapon) + 26.475(Bonus

far as AC goes. Lit2 is a trash killing wep, trash has poor AC. You dont use your trash weapons on bosses, thats what the hoglob is for.

I like how every nay sayer about melee upgrades is always
"who cares because casters are best!"

Yea whatever, casters take a back seat to my melee. Play better.

And who here in this thread has their crafting lvls at 100+ anyways?
No one?
And no one plans to either.

Thats why crafting is boring, it needs a reason for us to strive to keep going.

This idea is a great one for that.

Disagreeing because of X without offering an alternative is a utter waste of board space. Suggest an alternate way to make us want to continue, else stop trolling.

Every time you are wrong someone is trolling? OK, i'll remember that next time Charlie Sheen. Alternative? Don't need one, I love my crafted weapons. YOU want an alternative. Nobody is lvl 100? I am 95/87/80. Nothing i cant really make. Soon as i hit 90 in dive we can put my +5 metalline handwraps of geob with force ritual and med crystal of seeking against your lit2 handwraps...oh wait, nevermind. Crafting boring? So is waiting on raid timers to run the same **** over and over again to be disappointed with loot drops. I don't get why you think i am "melee nay sayer". I play 1 melee, 1 caster, 1 healer. Cap, get bored, TR. I always try to make the best and most enjoyable toon i can in those 3 categories. Play my melee better? Have you ever done an epic after u9? The mob is dead before i can even run up to it WITH HASTE if the caster is any good. The only reason good casters even mass hold is because they feel bad for the melee getting bored waiting to boss beat. Run an edeeps with my caster or some of my friends that my melee runs with and see what the kill count is at the end. While you're at it, count your misses while beating on trash. Ive run with pure barb epic geared ship buffed TR pros that still say they miss a lot on epic. If i hit on a 2 and you need a 6 with your lit2, you think that effects dps?

[stille_nacht]

These suggestions are ridiculously over-powered for cannith crafted stuff.

this, honestly, getting holy burst, blah blah isnt that hard, if you just let me chuck a dreamspitter in for some sort of major outsider bane... well, thats just getting kind of out of hand :/. I mean, perhaps if they added a weapon "devilbane" with the same chance of dropping as that cursed eSS ring shard...

[Lighti]

If you miss in an epic with a geared barbarain there's something majorly wrong with your toon. My barb runs with full PA line from both Horc and Barb using eAGA (stupid sos shard wont drop for me) and only ever misses on a 1