Serious PvPness

[Raithe]

You must realize how much of an oxymoron PvP is to DnD.

No, DnD started out in its early beginnings as a game called "Chainmail." It was a strategy miniatures war game between 2 to 10 players.

Correct, people have deep rooted connections to their charactesr because they took all that time to level , equip, and grow their characters. And on that unlucky roll of 1 and you just failed your save and you died, you are crushed as all that work is gone.

Please don't confuse player killing with player vs. player game mechanics. D&D has always used characters of nearly equivalent statistics in its battles and it rarely mattered which player (DM or otherwise) was controlling what. Duels between players were fully allowed and "PvP" in RPG tournements was extremely common. Above all, player interaction was always the most important ingredient to the telling of the story.

Please don't pervert the memory of a mostly-dead art form with your MMO-like contortions of the genre.

[Lissyl]

No, DnD started out in its early beginnings as a game called "Chainmail." It was a strategy miniatures war game between 2 to 10 players.



Please don't confuse player killing with player vs. player game mechanics. D&D has always used characters of nearly equivalent statistics in its battles and it rarely mattered which player (DM or otherwise) was controlling what. Duels between players were fully allowed and "PvP" in RPG tournements was extremely common. Above all, player interaction was always the most important ingredient to the telling of the story.

Please don't pervert the memory of a mostly-dead art form with your MMO-like contortions of the genre.

Wait, what? First off -- while the ideas for DnD do date back to the historical gaming genre-->Chainmail/fantasy wargame simulation, it was because they were becoming BORED of them that the changes Dave and Gary first made were, well, made! Furthermore, in the very earliest books, not one mention is made of players versus players (in fact, it was actively discouraged as it destroyed party cohesion). The 'DM as player' is a product of the third generation mindset -- NEVER in First or Second Edition was this mindset prevalent. Many books even referenced '2-6 Players and a Dungeon Master'. There's the PLAYERS Handbook and the DM's handbook; the DM's handbook makes a pointed reference that PLAYERS should not even be allowed to look inside it.

RPG tournaments, I can't speak for those but the few that I've been to had NOTHING of the sort (and any person suggesting such a thing would find a like-minded group only among those who had such prominent (read: idiotic) characters as half-dragons, half-unicorns, demigods (outside of the Immortals Set) and Dwarven Illusionist/Paladin/Thief/Rogue/Bards with a Natural 25 Strength and so forth). Anyone who expects that a 'balanced' duel between a 14th level Thief and a 14th level Wizard could even ~exist~, let alone be 'supported by the rules' has a badly deluded sense of memory regarding the game.

The game was written so that individual DM's could alter, adjust, and adjudicate as needed for their milieu. So while, no doubt, many DM's may have added such silly things as 'party duels'...at no point can the game be said to have endorsed such play.

[sirdanile]

For tabletop pvp is usually a really bad idea if it was incited by out of game events rather than in-game events, and even then in game events leading to pvp can cause out of game mistrust.

But if the story happens to flow that way, say the paladin winds up realizing the rogue stole from his church... well... yeah.

Bringing it back to ddo, pvp pits are just a fun hobby to pass time away in while waiting for a group, the good people never complain about dieing... or at least joke about it.

It is also very twitch skill dependant, surrounding awareness is stressed because ANYONE can haul off and kill you at any time, dodging ray spells and arrows while ducking around corners healing and returning fire, jumping like a crazy melee monkey to reduce the other monkey's chance of actually physically hitting you...

My point is that if you find pvp fun, go have fun and don't pay attention to the people who ***** in the pit.
If you don't enjoy pvp then avoid the pits and such, you're not missing much anyway!

[heyytoi]

Ok so last couple days I've been bored and entered the lobster for some pvp...this is my first lvl 20 toon so he's not all decked out with insane gear and uber stats. So I see this other level 20 in there, the only other level 20...he's not attacking me, just repeat-killing anyone under lvl 10. Although I find it amusing (and sometimes fun to watch) attacking people who have no chance gets boring after the first 3 to 5 kills.

My toon is just a dungeon crawler, I never really even considered pvp till recently...i mean my guy has 300hp buffed. Dunno how good that is as a lvl 20 PM wizard, but I tend to not die in dungeons and half-soloed harry so I don't complain...

So I go to leave the brawl area after watching for a bit and when i hit the ladder he attacks me while my back is turned, before i can hop off and turn to attack back...i'm dead. While I recover he runs and jumps back on the ledge and waits. When I hop back down and get back in my corner a lvl 14 attacks me, right when i cast the spell that kills him that guy from before hops off the ledge and kills me...now i REALLY don't take any of it personal, i could care less how many times you kill me or call me a noob, hell i'll even wear a shirt that says DDO-NOOB RIGHT HERE! But later when I killed him during a 1 on 1, he got upset and said he's putting a hit out on me and starts bringing his guildies and friends into it...naturally not much I can do so i just shrug and leave the arena.

Next day, while in the brawler area I made a couple friends by killing them...granted it was somewhat a cheap way (irresistable dance followed by a barrage of whatever i could cast before it wore off) but it worked and they laughed and now they don't attack me. So a ranger attacks me and kills me while fighting a cleric (and if you haven't fought a cleric while on a necromancer, that's a pain...). I come back and fight the cleric but the ranger kills me again while I'm fighting the cleric...

Take 3 : I hop down and move to my corner and just toast the lvl 20 ranger in 2 shots. I get a tell saying "your dead" and next thing I know he's got his friends in there attacking me. At this point I'm getting the impression that PvP brawls are less about skill and more about who you know. Now don't get me wrong, I actually ENJOYED playing like this...seriously, taking on 2 or 3 at a time made me feel pretty **** leet.

Now it was fun till the guy got upset that I was killing him and his friends as much as they were killing me...that's when the /tell's started..."you're a noob" and accusing me of ledge hopping while he's surrounded by his friends xD. My response, I popped in a dvd irl and watched a movie while leaving my character on the ledge...I come back 2 hours later and they are STILL sitting there whispering me saying i'm afraid to come down.

At this point i really thought they'd have given up within 30mins...so I had this O.o look on my face when I got back.

As I said earlier, THIS was truly fun and amusing. Anyone else have a similar story? =D

This is the main reason why i PvP.

All these wee kids sending me tells, been addicted to there hate for years now...

PvP is awesome!

[Lyzern]

This is the main reason why i PvP.

All these wee kids sending me tells, been addicted to there hate for years now...

PvP is awesome!

I wonder how much neg rep you'll get for that post lmao

[heyytoi]

I wonder how much neg rep you'll get for that post lmao

Probably a billion neg rep.

[Seikojin]

I have seen that for pvping and non pvping. Unfortunately, people have constraints on how you should play. Fortunately, I have seen a lot less of that.

Personally, if I get pwnd in pvp, I try to learn from it. If I fight someone and they do a good job at fighting back, I thank them. If I pwn them, I still thank them for playing.

Trash talk is generally overlooked, but if I am getting wiped, ask info on their build, and they give me flak, then I just leave em alone. It irritates me, but not enough to stress on it.