Feedback - Crafting - Update 10, Patch 1

[Jahmin]

Whooops. We clearly were out of line with several of these ingredients. Including items like Dreamspitter and Chattering Ring is an embarrasing error on our part and was in no way intentional.

Our motivation to add these extra ingredients (which was only made to a subset of recipes that concerned us) was to preserve and not devalue the efforts made by players to obtain many of the existing powerful named items in the game.

We will make changes. Unfortunately, they will not be made in time to alter the upcoming patch. As you know, the system is still in beta and we will effect changes as soon as we can.

Our apologies and thanks for the swift, clear feedback.

I just do not even know what to say to this. Obviously it WAS intentional. Not only does your own post contradict itself, but the fact that you accept it going live is asinine.

You have the chance to fix this – deliberately deciding NOT to clearly indicates you do not get the feedback whatsoever.

Forget feedback after this fiasco, the only thing swift and clear will be the departures.

[Cyr]

All I read in Madfloyd's response is that he didn't realize why these things were out of line, just that people objected.

On the contrary I got the strong impression that named loot and pay to win purified junk is staying and just some huge incredibly horrible mistake recipes will be modified based upon player complaints.

This as is will put a stranglehold on loot passing one of the best parts of the DDO community and that is just from being on Lamaland. When this goes live even the most obtuse player will realize that anyday their second chattering ring or third SoS on a toon could suddenly be used in crafting and it's no longer a stranglehold on loot passing it's the kill shot.

[fatman111386]

Well if this patch comes out as it is now I am done with crafting. The sad thing is I have argued for it over and over again in my play groups, gotten a few to actually join me in the grind with the promise of better things to come. I guess I expected too much from Turbine, this is ridiculous. I do not know how they thought this was a good Idea or how this even got past the team into the update.

This is ridiculous and makes me look like an Idiot for ever believing in them. The recipes themselves are horrendous but the grief and I told you so's I am going to get from the guild and friends I have talked into giving this system a try is making me dread to log in at the moment. so thank you turbine for the waste of time and plat, and thank you for the mockery I am about to endure. Have a nice day

[Renvar]

I'm glad Mad Floyd posted a correction on the named raid loot. Requiring any raid loot or rare named drops (i.e. Blood Stone, Planar Gird, Tome Pages, etc) would only create a situation where newer players and casual players will suffer. The majority of the raid loot I have were not pulled personally but passed, rolled on, etc. I have likewise given away or put up for roll Torc, Madstone Boots, Bracers of Glacier, Dreamspitter, Chattering Ring, SoS and many other items in the last 3 years. If these practices were to discontinue the impact on the player base would be dramatic and negative.

And these practices would discontinue in mass unless there was a firm stance on the current and future inclusion of raid loot/named loot in crafting recipes. I am OK with any of the following:

Collectables (Even rare ones like blue dragon scales)
Unbound ingredients (Small, medium, and even large GS mats)
Consumables from specific sources, even valuable ones (Denith arrows or sliver flame potions or greater mana pots or a firewall scroll for a flaming burst recipe for example)

But I would draw the line at named loot and definitely any loot that is BtC, BtA, or exclusive. Surely by controlling the drop rates on collectables you can control the ease with which high end recipes are accessible. And not destroy the current loot system in the process.

I concur with other sentiments that this cannot go live even for a day without having a long term impact on player behavior.

[Bodic]

I have adjusted the crafting level to where it will be when the patch goes live. Sorry about the delay I was distracted by Mournlands.

Again we dont care about the Crafting level its the items we dont have to craft with that are raid loot items or Favor required items. Forget about this patch and fix it for an UPDATE.

Your New "Shiny" is very dull, and not going to work.

[BruceTheHoon]

I wnder whether there will be another such thread when the accidents are finally fixed.

[Kza]

Is it some april 1 day in USA this day?

[Stanley_Nicholas]

A thought just occurred to me - apologies if it's already been stated but I'm still reading through this thread and it's filling up faster than I can read.

What happens when you attempt to craft a shard and the attempt fails? Some of the ingredients are still consumed. Just imagine losing a dreamspitter, chattering ring, large devil scale, half a dozen purified dragonshards that you got for store-bought astral diamonds, etc, and getting nothing in return.

Add on the fact that almost nothing will ever be put up for roll by anybody anymore, just in case it's ever needed for crafting even if it isn't currently...

This is the single worst concept the devs have ever come up with. Kill it now. The damage will be massive it it ever goes live.

[Zzevel]

While it is nice to get devs responding to stuff like this, this line makes me wonder what the point of Lamannia is. If something which is called out on by hundreds of players on the first day of Lamannia can't be changed for upcoming patches, why bother even having a place to put the changes on before the actual servers. A system where the developers give a preview of upcoming changes but are unable to change the changes after hearing feedback from players seems pointless.

It is there to make you warm and fuzzy, not actually there for your feedback. Tried to +1 you but I have to wait 24 hours, Memnir weaseled by last +1 on the Lucy & Charlie Brown..

[Gkar]

Whooops. We clearly were out of line with several of these ingredients. Including items like Dreamspitter and Chattering Ring is an embarrasing error on our part and was in no way intentional.

Our motivation to add these extra ingredients (which was only made to a subset of recipes that concerned us) was to preserve and not devalue the efforts made by players to obtain many of the existing powerful named items in the game.

We will make changes. Unfortunately, they will not be made in time to alter the upcoming patch. As you know, the system is still in beta and we will effect changes as soon as we can.

Our apologies and thanks for the swift, clear feedback.

Mad...I have a lot of respect for you and your level of interaction with the community, but your statement contridicts itself. You clearly DID do it intentionally because you go on to explain WHY you did it. First rule of an appology is not to first try to claim it was an accident - take full responsiblity. Clearly you just underestimated player reaction.

Thank you however for agreeing to immediately to do the about face. I'll add my voice to those saying patch 1 needs to wait until you fix this.

[Jahmin]

First post ever here (this thread warrants one)... and I really, really do not know which is sadder... The fact that the devs even thought up such an absolute ridiculous idea as the one they put forth for the crafting changes... or the fact that they didn't take a wee lil time out and actually review, look at and THINK about what they were putting out...

My good god.. I am paying money for this...

Thank you for an outstanding first post. I certainly hope you are not paying for this **** any more though. Cheers!

[dkyle]

Whooops. We clearly were out of line with several of these ingredients. Including items like Dreamspitter and Chattering Ring is an embarrasing error on our part and was in no way intentional.

I'm sorry, but this is simply insulting. It wasn't intentional? Was it a joke some Dev played who assumed it would be caught before release?

Own the mistake, make it clear you and the other Devs understand why it is a huge mistake and that Raid loot will never be a crafting component, and fix it. Don't even consider putting it on Live as-is.

[Thalmor]

I must say the Fire Works in here are better then any celebration I seen in recent memory.

I have to agree with eveyone in this thread that this might have been the bigest mistake since Coke tried to change hteir receipe with the New Coke

[Mithis]

And these practices would discontinue in mass unless there was a firm stance on the current and future inclusion of raid loot/named loot in crafting recipes. I am OK with any of the following:

Collectables (Even rare ones like blue dragon scales)
Unbound ingredients (Small, medium, and even large GS mats)
Consumables from specific sources, even valuable ones (Denith arrows or sliver flame potions or greater mana pots or a firewall scroll for a flaming burst recipe for example)

Including any of these items will discourage even more players from using this system.

You cannot attempt to limit hardcore players and expect that the average or casual player will be able to or want to participate. The hardcore player will "beat" the restrictions in 1/3rd the time you expect and the rest of the player base will simply choose not to participate because the system is so onerous.

[Mercureal]

Raid items as ingredients is the new New Coke.

I feel cheap doing this, but a quote from Futurama seems apt:

Slurm Queen: "You'll be submerged in Royal Slurm, which in a matter of minutes will transform you into a Slurm Queen like myself!"
Glurmo: "But your Highness, she's a commoner. Her Slurm will taste foul."
Slurm Queen: "Yes. Which is why we'll market it as New Slurm. Then, when everyone hates it, we'll bring back Slurm Classic and make billions!"

[Cauthey]

Aside from the idiocy that was the material requirements.....the rest sounded pretty **** sweet!

But seriously, just hold it and fix it.

^^THIS. Absolutely THIS.

[dragons1ayer74]

Whooops. We clearly were out of line with several of these ingredients. Including items like Dreamspitter and Chattering Ring is an embarrasing error on our part and was in no way intentional.

Our motivation to add these extra ingredients (which was only made to a subset of recipes that concerned us) was to preserve and not devalue the efforts made by players to obtain many of the existing powerful named items in the game.

We will make changes. Unfortunately, they will not be made in time to alter the upcoming patch. As you know, the system is still in beta and we will effect changes as soon as we can.

Our apologies and thanks for the swift, clear feedback.

Why have a test server and ask for feedback when it is alread too late?

I know in the past when the froums have exploded you have listened, it is not too late to not roll out 10.1 at all and instead get the system right and roll out 10.2 to prevent the least amount of real impact damage to the game.

[TheDearLeader]

Including any of these items will discourage even more players from using this system.

You cannot attempt to limit hardcore players and expect that the average or casual player will be able to or want to participate. The hardcore player will "beat" the restrictions in 1/3rd the time you expect and the rest of the player base will simply choose not to participate.

I have to agree with this.

Actually, I have to state in more clear terms:

Anything that *limits* crafting, hurts crafting.

[GotSomeQuestions]

Couldn't see past 75 this end. still reviewing...

Purified eberron dragonshard fragments?

arcane
tasty ham for animal bane,
spiderspike for vermin bane,
guardkiller for human bane,
giant stalkers for giant bane

divine
medium sulferous for lawful ousider bane,
prysuuls bane for chaotic outsider bane
stormreaver fresco for construct bane
minotaut hair belt for monstrous humanoid bane
rusted shamshir for aberration bane
zulkash's bone necklace for orc bane
blue dragon scales for dragon bane
ring of elemental essences AND spiked mace of the elements for elemental bane
medium chain AND medium devil scales for evil outsider bane
margurites necklace for undead bane
silver flame healing potion for holy burst
dreamspitter for greater lawful outsider bane
razorend for greater magical beast bane
demons blood AND tyrzza's bane for greater chaotic outsider bane

elemental
zaraming's longbow for halfling bane
sword of the giant slavemaster for elf bane
moog's ornament for reptillian bane
daggertooth's belt for gnoll bane
fist of darguul for goblinoid bane
zaraming's longbow for dwarf bane
chattering ring for greater halfling bane
mystical plant for greater plant bane

I'm... going to leave that there, and take a few minutes...

In the mean time, I would ask if you really, truly want an honest response.

More stuff is available:

Greater Ooze Bane: Muckbane
Elec Absorb 33% now level 77: Charged Gauntlets
Fire Absorb 33% also level 77: Scorched Bracers
Greater Vermin Bane: Bracers of Spiderkind
Greater Animal Bane: Rabbit Gloves
Greater Construct Bane: Sovereign Dragontouched Rune of Smiting!!
Greater Dwarf Bane: Golden Greaves
Greater Monstrous Humanoid Bane: Adamantine Sickle (the lordsmarch one)
Greater Elf Bane: Allegiance *and* Coronation
Greater Reptilian Bane: Mantle of the Dragonfriend
Greater Aberration Bane: Nature's Vengeance
Attack Bonus +4: Spectral Gloves. No joke.
Greater Gnoll Bane: Gloves of Gnoll Hide
Greater Orc Bane: Skullsmasher
Greater Goblinoid Bane: Twinblade
Greater Giant Bane: Kelmar's Justice
Greater Human Bane: Bloody Cleaver
Greater Elemental Bane: Theurgic Stave
Greater Undead Bane: Boneshard Flute and Coronation
Greater Evil Outsider Bane: Large Scale and Demon's Blood
Greater Dragon Bane: 1 Flawless Siberys Shard AND *FIVE* Blood of Dragons. Really? Really?
Vampirism: Chaosblade

And all the higher level shards take the new Eberrons.

[ZeroTakenaka]

Then delay, restructure, or cancel the patch.

Delay it if you can take the time to rework this crafting snafu before it hits the Live servers.

Rework the patch to selectively scalpel out this crafting snafu, and allow the rest to go Live.

-or-

Cancel the patch if neither of the above can be done.

But, I think it's time that somebody on the Dev team stands up for the Players and says **** the timetables - this needs to be fixed before it goes Live. Not fixed after.

I would agree with Memnir. This needs to be delayed until this is fixed and NOT go live until these are fixed. Seriously, What are you thinking?