Failed VoD : Healing tips?

[Symerith]

Hey all,

I decided to join a normal VoD group tonight on my Level 17 WF FvS (Sirgog's Soul Survivor Build). This is my first divine.
Before applying, I asked the leader if that was fine, knowing I had never healed a VoD before & that I did not have mass heal yet.
The answer was yes, so I joined the group.
The other healer happened to be another Soul survivor, and just like me, a lvl 17 WF FvS (he is a TR).

I felt pretty much ready for this : I have a blue dragontouched docent, a decent HP/SP, maximize/empower/quicken and all the mass healing spells, along with potency items & clickies to improve my heals. I also had 5 majors pots, 200 heal scrolls, curse removal pots for myself & the spell in case the others wouldn't have it.

Going to the raid entrance wasn't a problem. But we had an epic failure. We didn't even get the boss under 80%.

While I did everything I could, including using scrolls as often as possible, and drinking the 5 majors, I'm not sure that was all I could do... And I feel pretty bad about this failed VoD. Healers often get criticized when I now understand they have the hardest job.

A few didn't have DR breakers, including our initial tanker, I had to remove curse a few times when I feel this isn't my job (when I run VoD with my other toons, I always have my own curse removal pots, including healing potions/scrolls for myself & the others.

When I ran out of the pots I had, I asked the group several times if they had pots I could use... None answered. While I understand those are expensive and people don't want to give them away (because the healer "wasted" all his mana...), I always give the healers back the pots they used after the raid when I make my own VoD.

Besides the fact that we surely weren't ready for this, rare are the groups that fail a norm VoD nowadays...

As I said, I do feel pretty bad about this failure and I was wondering if this is a rather normal situation.
Is there anything more I can do? Any healing tips ?

Thank you for reading this & helping me.

[Bargol]

How many curse removal pots did you start with....cause the main group should be getting there own curses. The "tank" may need help keeping curses cleared if not high AC tank....but you shouldn't have gone through more then ...30 ....40 pots max.

Usually there is one healer on the main party and one on the "tank".

I guess I don't understand what went wrong.....other then maybe everyone was very new.

[pjstechie]

I wouldn't drink a pot before sulu goes up the first time. If I'm out of sp by then it aint happening.

As much as possible dont use the spell to remove curses, use pots or a wand (though swapping to wands can be a pain. Using the spell adds up faster than you think. I also tend not to use both empower and maximize at the same time, it usually seems like both are overkill.

Having said that it sounds like the rest of the group was under prepared and poorly led.

[Levit]

Your group did not get sulu down below 80%? Off the top of my head I'm guessing your group did not have an intim tank for orthons at the beginning.

A typical strategy is for someone to intim all the orthons onto themselves. the rest of the group beats on the back of one orthon at a time. This minimizes damage and allows u to anchor your mass heals on the whole group.

May I further speculate that because several members did not have dr breakers that dps was light? Vod is not a quest you want to drag out.

Did you have a wf tank? If not, then further mana was probably wasted keeping a tank up that occasionally was cursed, thus unhealable.

What I am really saying is that it was not your fault. With 2 level 17 healers you guys should have at least gotten to second wave of orthons. Sometimes this can go upside down if sulu goes down so quick as to also have devils come up at the same time.

Another fail point is the end when bats come out. You will need to maximize a blade barrier around yourself and the party, center heals on yourself and just mass heal away.

I hope this was helpful.

[IBCROOTBEER]

Sounds like you were pleanty prepared, good Sir. Your first mistake however was to offer to heal a group with a tank that did not have DR breakers. That tells me that Sully will probably be swinging wild much of the time because the tank won't generate enough dps to hold him (unless his non-DR breakers were litII's, tehn i retract all of this :P ). Other than that, you probably were doing your juob effectively enough. If you went through 5 SP pots before Sully was under 80%, I'm going to blame the rest of the group for not getting their own curses.

As for tips ...
Tip #1 - Before getting to raid make sure your party and tank is competent and makes sure everyone knows the game plan. Its ok to take first timers for sure, but make sure they are told what will happen and what is expected of them (like getting their own curses).

Tip #2 - Carry the spell Holy Aura. It blinds enemies when you cast it near them. It mayb not be very helpful as a buff, but its great for mitigating damage on teh party. Any time the devils pop up in VoD, toss out holy aura. Blinded devils do 50% less damage than those that can see :P and the blind compounds wiht displace or blur that the party might already have.

Tip #3 - Try to make sure the party stays in a central area. The more spread out they are, the less effective your mass's are. This also helps you hit all the devils with Holy Aura for the blind effect.

Thats about the most vital tips I can think of right now. Good uck, I hope it helps

[Splatterfart]

The key to VoD is beating into people's heads that there is a potion vendor RIGHT outside of the Sub-T entrance in the marketplace. It's each individual's responsibility to keep their curses cleansed (I tend to hold this as a general rule). I also encourage casters/umd people to carry curse removal wands on them to assist other group members that may not notice their debuff in the middle of a chaotic melee.

A warforged tank is very handy in VoD as Suul's curse only prevents DIVINE healing (has no effect on arcane repair/reconstruct spells). This is by no means a requirement, though.

Shintao monks actually work well as a tank here for a number of reasons. First of all they have a remove curse ability that feeds off their Ki reserves that can provide an extra level of protection against curses. Secondly, their enhancements allow them to bypass most any type of damage reduction in the game using something as simple as pure good handwraps (at least, any DR types that would apply here). They can simply pummel on him with their fists of light to supplement their own hps and keep their curses cleansed. Finally, Shintao monks tend to carry a -very- significant amount of healing amp (of which you can NEVER have enough).


Side notes:
Don't worry about not having mass heal. Even with quicken you're going to find that it's uncomfortably slow in raids (though it's unsurpassed in general questing). DPS in raids is simply too much too fast for MOST healers to feel comfortable using mass heal. I HIGHLY recommend going to Amrath once you're level 18+ and getting one of the two cleric prestige belts with Superior Ardor VIII clickables on them (Radiant Servant/Exorcist of the Silver Flame btw). They will make your mass cure spells very potent. This is my own personal preference, but it is in no means THE way to heal--there is no one "best" way to heal.

Based on your preparations, though, it does sound like you were more than ready for the raid (or basically any raid). Just keep your chin up. Sometimes **** just happens.

[Splatterfart]

Note: Holy Smite, a simple level 4th spell, will also have a blinding effect and is -very- cheap to cast. Why healers DON'T use this spell is beyond me. It's basically cleric fireball that adds an extra 50% melee damage reduction to your party.

Another idea: You're a favored soul (and a warforged at that). Shield block between healing to really cut down your healing required. Capped out you're going to have an un-godly amount of personal damage reduction. Stand in the middle of the mess blocking and just toss mass cures as required.

[LordPiglet]

I actually prefer empower healing over empower.

I think my last run on my WF FvS was 2 pots and the 17 clonk uses none thanks to the spell singer and RA bursting.

Get what ever ardor clickies you can, and use your mass cures. If you have too many people cursed, use break enchantment. I personally only run empower healing and quicken and try to conserve spell points with maximize off and ardor going.

If possible, turtle up during trash spawns, a torq and con opp items should help you with mana return. If you don't have a torq, run DQ every 3 days until you get one, period. Solo it on normal if you have to, but run it. At cap, you an turtle her up, DP her to death and run the efreeti's through a couple BB and take almost no damage until war phase.

[IBCROOTBEER]

...

Side notes:
Don't worry about not having mass heal. Even with quicken you're going to find that it's uncomfortably slow in raids (though it's unsurpassed in general questing). DPS in raids is simply too much too fast for MOST healers to feel comfortable using mass heal ...

I don't agree here. On my FvS I use mostly Mass Heal for all my healing. Only occasionally do I use Mass Cures. They just cost too much for the amount they heal. I have no difficulty solo healing shroud and VoD with the use of Mass Heal. If the party has slightly competent people who get their own curses and half more than 300 hp. Mass Heal is enough to keep them up. True, in dicey situations I toss out a Mass Cure, but its not that often. Mass Heal is just way more SP efficient.

[LordPiglet]

I don't agree here. On my FvS I use mostly Mass Heal for all my healing. Only occasionally do I use Mass Cures. They just cost too much for the amount they heal. I have no difficulty solo healing shroud and VoD with the use of Mass Heal. If the party has slightly competent people who get their own curses and half more than 300 hp. Mass Heal is enough to keep them up. True, in dicey situations I toss out a Mass Cure, but its not that often. Mass Heal is just way more SP efficient.

This I agree with. Especially if you're like me and forget to turn empower off, mass cures burn through the spell points. Last night the cleric died in part 1 of ToD (he was on the party, I was on the Jailer tank). I was heal scrolling the tank (who turtled up) winging close enough I could toss a mass heal on the party, then back to the tank. Luckily judge was around 25% when this happened, but know I know how someone else felt when I died on my FvS in part 1 in my 3rd or 4th run.

[wigthemaster]

Hey all,

I decided to join a normal VoD group tonight on my Level 17 WF FvS (Sirgog's Soul Survivor Build). This is my first divine.
Before applying, I asked the leader if that was fine, knowing I had never healed a VoD before & that I did not have mass heal yet.
The answer was yes, so I joined the group.
The other healer happened to be another Soul survivor, and just like me, a lvl 17 WF FvS (he is a TR).never a good sign when neither divine have mass heal

I felt pretty much ready for this : I have a blue dragontouched docent, a decent HP/SP, maximize/empower/quicken and all the mass healing spells, along with potency items & clickies to improve my heals. I also had 5 majors pots, 200 heal scrolls, curse removal pots for myself & the spell in case the others wouldn't have it.Curing their curses isn't your job, especially in a normal Vod or with a non-barb tanking, rule of thumb if the boss isn't under 25% when you have to pot, don't pot.

Going to the raid entrance wasn't a problem. But we had an epic failure. We didn't even get the boss under 80%.

While I did everything I could, including using scrolls as often as possible, and drinking the 5 majors, I'm not sure that was all I could do... And I feel pretty bad about this failed VoD. Healers often get criticized when I now understand they have the hardest job. This would be totally fine if the boss was far lower, heal scrolls should be used whenever possible on the tank to preserve mana, or if the tank is doing really good you could spare heal scroll some people

A few didn't have DR breakers, including our initial tanker, I had to remove curse a few times when I feel this isn't my job(it isn't. Unless they're like a super raging barbarian who can't get curse pots, and then only cure their curse when and if they're tanking (when I run VoD with my other toons, I always have my own curse removal pots, including healing potions/scrolls for myself & the others.No DR breakers? were they using Lit2's or ESoS' if not then this is bad.... Tank atleast should have a DR breaker or have something powerful enough on norm they don't need one.

When I ran out of the pots I had, I asked the group several times if they had pots I could use... None answered. While I understand those are expensive and people don't want to give them away (because the healer "wasted" all his mana...), I always give the healers back the pots they used after the raid when I make my own VoD. Often it's hard to trade in a raid, but this sounded like a bad pug.

Besides the fact that we surely weren't ready for this, rare are the groups that fail a norm VoD nowadays...

As I said, I do feel pretty bad about this failure and I was wondering if this is a rather normal situation.
Is there anything more I can do? Any healing tips ?

Thank you for reading this & helping me.

comments, though when you get mass heal, use heal scroll exclusively on the tank, unless his/her amp is too low to make use of them as their only healing then cast heal, when trash comes mass heal on group(which should be the other healer doing this)

~wig

[Symerith]

How many curse removal pots did you start with....cause the main group should be getting there own curses. The "tank" may need help keeping curses cleared if not high AC tank....but you shouldn't have gone through more then ...30 ....40 pots max.

Usually there is one healer on the main party and one on the "tank".

I guess I don't understand what went wrong.....other then maybe everyone was very new.

I had 100 curse removal pots. I think I just used one, but I had to use the spell a dozen of times. I don't think we had more than 2 new people here. The tank was WF, so arcanes started to recon him, but he lost aggro & we had to change tanks twice.

Your group did not get sulu down below 80%? Off the top of my head I'm guessing your group did not have an intim tank for orthons at the beginning.

A typical strategy is for someone to intim all the orthons onto themselves. the rest of the group beats on the back of one orthon at a time. This minimizes damage and allows u to anchor your mass heals on the whole group.

May I further speculate that because several members did not have dr breakers that dps was light? Vod is not a quest you want to drag out.

Did you have a wf tank? If not, then further mana was probably wasted keeping a tank up that occasionally was cursed, thus unhealable.

What I am really saying is that it was not your fault. With 2 level 17 healers you guys should have at least gotten to second wave of orthons. Sometimes this can go upside down if sulu goes down so quick as to also have devils come up at the same time.

Another fail point is the end when bats come out. You will need to maximize a blade barrier around yourself and the party, center heals on yourself and just mass heal away.

I hope this was helpful.

We actually had an intim. tank, who said he had 42 intimidate. He was the actual tank for suulo. but he lost aggro as soon as the group started to beat on suulo. After the first WF tank, we had 2 fleshie tanks, one being an AA who meleed (pretty solid actually). He admitted using a true law falchion of maiming, which is obviously not a DR breaker. When the tank lost aggro, the whole group took a lot of damage and I lost around 1000 mana in a minute or so.

Sounds like you were pleanty prepared, good Sir. Your first mistake however was to offer to heal a group with a tank that did not have DR breakers. That tells me that Sully will probably be swinging wild much of the time because the tank won't generate enough dps to hold him (unless his non-DR breakers were litII's, tehn i retract all of this :P ). Other than that, you probably were doing your juob effectively enough. If you went through 5 SP pots before Sully was under 80%, I'm going to blame the rest of the group for not getting their own curses.

As for tips ...
Tip #1 - Before getting to raid make sure your party and tank is competent and makes sure everyone knows the game plan. Its ok to take first timers for sure, but make sure they are told what will happen and what is expected of them (like getting their own curses).

Tip #2 - Carry the spell Holy Aura. It blinds enemies when you cast it near them. It mayb not be very helpful as a buff, but its great for mitigating damage on teh party. Any time the devils pop up in VoD, toss out holy aura. Blinded devils do 50% less damage than those that can see :P and the blind compounds wiht displace or blur that the party might already have.

Tip #3 - Try to make sure the party stays in a central area. The more spread out they are, the less effective your mass's are. This also helps you hit all the devils with Holy Aura for the blind effect.

Thats about the most vital tips I can think of right now. Good uck, I hope it helps

Thanks for the tips !

@ #1 - I'll definitely try to join a solid group next time, and make sure the tank knows what to do.
@ #2 - I didn't have it at the time (only 2 slots for the level spell, and I took mass cure critical wounds & death pact). It will definitely be very helpful next time !
@ #3 - When the tank lost aggro, it all went pretty fast : I lost half my mana throwing mass heals, but I always missed a few people and I had to spot heal, which, in the end, is pretty expensive on sp.

The key to VoD is beating into people's heads that there is a potion vendor RIGHT outside of the Sub-T entrance in the marketplace. It's each individual's responsibility to keep their curses cleansed (I tend to hold this as a general rule). I also encourage casters/umd people to carry curse removal wands on them to assist other group members that may not notice their debuff in the middle of a chaotic melee.

A warforged tank is very handy in VoD as Suul's curse only prevents DIVINE healing (has no effect on arcane repair/reconstruct spells). This is by no means a requirement, though.

Shintao monks actually work well as a tank here for a number of reasons. First of all they have a remove curse ability that feeds off their Ki reserves that can provide an extra level of protection against curses. Secondly, their enhancements allow them to bypass most any type of damage reduction in the game using something as simple as pure good handwraps (at least, any DR types that would apply here). They can simply pummel on him with their fists of light to supplement their own hps and keep their curses cleansed. Finally, Shintao monks tend to carry a -very- significant amount of healing amp (of which you can NEVER have enough).


Side notes:
Don't worry about not having mass heal. Even with quicken you're going to find that it's uncomfortably slow in raids (though it's unsurpassed in general questing). DPS in raids is simply too much too fast for MOST healers to feel comfortable using mass heal. I HIGHLY recommend going to Amrath once you're level 18+ and getting one of the two cleric prestige belts with Superior Ardor VIII clickables on them (Radiant Servant/Exorcist of the Silver Flame btw). They will make your mass cure spells very potent. This is my own personal preference, but it is in no means THE way to heal--there is no one "best" way to heal.

Based on your preparations, though, it does sound like you were more than ready for the raid (or basically any raid). Just keep your chin up. Sometimes **** just happens.

My original plan was to get the epic Chainmail Coaf but I heard the drop rate for the shard/seal is very low. If I'm not mistaken, it would be a lot easier to get those superior ardor 8 clickies from Amrath. I'll try to work on that.

Note: Holy Smite, a simple level 4th spell, will also have a blinding effect and is -very- cheap to cast. Why healers DON'T use this spell is beyond me. It's basically cleric fireball that adds an extra 50% melee damage reduction to your party.

Another idea: You're a favored soul (and a warforged at that). Shield block between healing to really cut down your healing required. Capped out you're going to have an un-godly amount of personal damage reduction. Stand in the middle of the mess blocking and just toss mass cures as required.

I did not know either Holy smite was so useful. Thanks for the information !

Shield blocking was my plan, but I do not have a shield that seems to be good enough. I wanted to get either lorrik's shield or levik's, since I'm not planing to get the Lorrik's set, the necklace being occupied by a future torc.

[DaSawks]

Tons of good advise here. I also run a WF FVS LOTB Soul Survivor. I can only add this to the discussion. I state from the beginning that mass cure/heals will be targeted on (Pick a target toon). Anyone else running around with there head cut off is SOL in my book. Having to constantly scan red bars actually takes away from your ability to heal. This will also keep the DPS team together there by killing mobs faster. This will lessen the need for heals in the long run.