PSA Haste does not waste a valuable spell slot

[varusso]

3) I got neg repped

Have a +1 to balance it then.

[baddax]

I've seen a ton of arcanes lately who don't carry Blur, Haste, or Resist Energy.
I hate it, but I deal...

One of my recent pet peeves is Casters, Divine or Arcane who dont carry resist. I find myself frequently asking for resist and then after a few requests a caster will toss a Protect energy as if it is the same thing. To casters FYI protect is not the sane as resist.

[Rumbaar]

I can't take extend now, so my ~2min haste isn't that useful anymore ... but I still have it.

[Ralmeth]

Haste is awesome! How could you not want your party to be more affective? On my Sorcerer I'm always the one calling for the group to gather for haste, and on my Paladins I'm always wanting to run perma-hasted.

[Aashrym]

Even without extend the haste spell is better than the clickies.

Not carrying resist energy is just silly but I have run into players who don`t think they need it if they have protection instead.

[Raithe]

...are there even 5 spells you WANT? let alone need...

Unfortunately, sorcerors only get 4 level 2 spells. I would -really- like to be able to pick up Otto's Resistable Dance with my sorceror, because:

1) It lasts 3 times as long as OID
2) With the new debuffs its easy to get it to DC 40+ without heightening while still being cheaper than OID
3) Its extremely spell point efficient when you don't need a high DC

Currently web, scorching ray, and resist energy are taking up 3 of the 4 slots and I would not consider trading them out. Resist energy is simply a required spell to maintain any degree of damage mitigation in quests, and debuffing occurs too often for guild buffs to make a dent in the need.

[Lycurgus]

Green steel clickies are your friend. Given how utterly necessary haste is, you'd think more players would carry them.

[karnokvolrath]

1st - I couldnt imagine playing ANY arcane without haste, its my favorite part about being an arcane, I HAZ DA POWAH!!!

2nd - Its the highests dps spell in the game and raids only make it stronger.

3rd - Get clickies, there very helpful for when you dont have a caster or have one that hasnt been thinking clearly lately.

[altrocks]

I've seen a ton of arcanes lately who don't carry Blur, Haste, or Resist Energy.
I hate it, but I deal...

One of my recent pet peeves is Casters, Divine or Arcane who dont carry resist. I find myself frequently asking for resist and then after a few requests a caster will toss a Protect energy as if it is the same thing. To casters FYI protect is not the sane as resist.

Let me start off by saying that my sorc never dropped haste, resist enery, blur, displace, rage or any of the truly useful buffs before he TR'd.

But...

I can see why others do. Many sorcs aren't taking extend now, as plenty of people pointed out, because of having to pick up an extra feat for savant. This leaves those spells not as attractive as they once were (except resist). More groups are running with multiple casters and usually buff spells overlap or are covered by at least once other caster, especially in raids. So it's not usually a big deal.

As for resists... I don't really understand it, but I can sorta see the logic behind it. Between ship buff resists and every class with a blue bar having access to resists, some sorcs might not see the reason to carry it. I know in ToD runs, my ranger is usually the one throwing out resists to the party. 20 minutes is more than enough and my 30 points are as good as anyone else's. Paladins help a lot with it, too. Personally, I'd never drop it on an arcane because it's too useful when in small groups, going into a quest/raid shorthanded or when soloing. Same goes for extend and rage and all the others. If your DPS is too low with all the available spells from every other level and you're depending on level 2 spells THAT much... well... you're doing something wrong. Especially on a savant where your most powerful level 1, 2 and 3 spells will be given to you without using a spell slot through your SLAs. Just no excuse for it. At all.

[fluffybunnywilson]

As more guilds get higher level and better airships, I am considering dropping resist energy. I'll give you a ship invite if you really want them.

I swapped out Resist Energy for a day at mid level for some reason (don't remember why). Everything went along just fine until one of the party members died. Then they kept dying because they no longer had any resists.

I put Resist Energy back on at the next shrine.

[soulaeon]

We dont actually need Haste personally, so I can understand if that is their reason.
Any way, levels 1-3 are all buffs for me.

i had a similar issue with a sorc who didnt pick up resist energy. really? you dropped the most damage decreasing spell in the game for a skillful sorc? for a level 2 spell? are there even 5 spells you WANT? let alone need...

Hello. I see you are new to the game. Please, meet Fire Shield, Protection from Elements, and our old friend Stone Skin.

[TheDearLeader]

It's not life or death to have it.

Could you explain this please?

I'm not sure exactly what to do with myself when I don't have [>>] in my buff bar.

Hello. I see you are new to the game. Please, meet Fire Shield, Protection from Elements, and our old friend Stone Skin.

You named 2 level 4 spells, and 1 level 5. I'm not arguing, I'm just not quite understanding how your response is supposed to address what you have quoted.

[Esserbe]

Web, Blur, Resist Energy, Knock are what I carry for lvl 2s on my sorc.

Haste, Rage, Lightning Bolt and Displacement is what I carry for lvl 3 spells.

I could see Lightning Bolt being switched out for something, or Magic Circle, but this is what I'm comfortable with. Having played mostly arcanes, I can't believe why anyone wouldn't take Haste - yeah, it was annoying being seen as a "haste bot" but the solution was simple, don't group with those kinds of people. It's a very useful spell.

[Kovalas]

No haste PUG casters are a waste of a spot, its more annoying at low levels as everyone has shroud haste clickies from 12 up, but still annoying nonetheless to have to stop DPS to activate.

And not taking extend dont mean jack, caster and bards have been keeping groups fully hasted from sec 1 to completion of quests since lvl10.

This might be one of the reasons that melee Shroud LFM leaders only allow 1-2 casters into there groups :P

Kov

[curboUS]

Web, Blur, Resist Energy, Knock are what I carry for lvl 2s on my sorc.

Haste, Rage, Lightning Bolt and Displacement is what I carry for lvl 3 spells.

I could see Lightning Bolt being switched out for something, or Magic Circle, but this is what I'm comfortable with. Having played mostly arcanes, I can't believe why anyone wouldn't take Haste - yeah, it was annoying being seen as a "haste bot" but the solution was simple, don't group with those kinds of people. It's a very useful spell.

As Esserbe said - it is annoying to be seen as a Hastebot/Healbot. Some melees do stooopid zerging and die all the time, some rogues are sneakmode the entire quest and some go afk without telling people etc. But this is a groupgame and there expectations from members of the party you join/create.

If you dont carry Buffs that are expected or have a playstyle that is way different from the norm, imo tell the leader about it in advance. For melee's Haste is addictive and you miss it the second it ends, also it adds enjoyment for most of the Melee crowd since it's more fun to hit stuff faster.

[chodelord]

1. my blue bar is for me to pew pew with, not to increase your kill count
2. they sell haste potions at the vendor so if its that important to you there is no excuse not to have it
3. there are tons of haste clickies in the game that let you buff the whole party, in fact it is more efficient for a melee to be the haster because you are acutely aware of when haste wears out and have a better chance of catching all the hitters together

3.a. a t2 greensteel has 3 charges at level 16 which is about 90 seconds a pop
http://www.iro.umontreal.ca/~delalle...lectric_abs_10

the morning star is the cheapest blank using no horn and only 1 funk

make 2 of those and that is 9 minutes of haste per shrine, no arcane needed

4. all my 6 mans are byoh which also stands for "bring your own haste"

[mobrien316]

Cleric/FVS is expected to heal in a group-environment.
Rogue is expected to do traps.
Bard is expected to have songs/rage/haste.
Barb/fighter/pally are expected to bring DPS and or intim.
Wiz are expected to have rage/haste and a few other buffs, CC, death spells, and some nukes.
Sorc are expected to have rage/haste and a few other buffs, nukes, and possibly situational CCs.
Everyone is expected to have heals/remove curse/remove poison/heavy fort/lots of HP......
This is all standard *in addition* to whatever flavor you are currently working on, on your particular toon.

There are alot of expectations in place for everyone. None of it is rude. Its just how the game is played, particularly once we leave the harbor and market quests behind us. Its like going to a pot-luck dinner party and not bringing a dish.

I think if you post an LFM asking specifically for a healer and a cleric joins, only to later admit he is a "battle cleric" and only has minimal healing skills, that is rude on the part of the cleric.

If you post an LFM "need a trapmonkey" and a rogue joins, only to later admit he is not specced to do anything but the most basic traps, that is rude on the part of the rogue.

However, in my opinion, telling other players that if they play a certain class they "should" do this or that is a bit controlling. Part of the fun of the game is playing characters with whatever flavor build you want. Sometimes you play the "accepted" best version of a class, sometimes you play a version close to that but with a few differences for flavor, and sometimes you play something far removed from the "expected standard" because you find it fun to do so and this is a game. I for one would not want to see DDO turn into a game where you pick a class and are automatically issued weapons, armor, gear, skills, and feats and have no input in building your character. Would anyone have enjoyed PnP if the DM gave them a prerolled character and told them how to play it?

My sorcerer can cast Haste, but I don't consider it his job to do so, and neither should the other members of a PUG. I also carry healing pots and wands, and I consider it my job to look after my health unless a cleric specifically says he or she will be healing the party during a certain battle.

I think if you want to run a guild and demand that all players conform to specific guidelines when making their characters (all clerics must have Empowered Healing and be Radiant Servants, all sorcerers must carry Haste and Rage, all rogues must max Search, Spot, and Disable Device, etc...) that's up to you.

On my melee toons I carry Haste pots. If the party's arcanes can and will cast Haste on me, great, I'll save the Haste pots for another time. If they can't, well, it's not their responsibility to buff me.

I prefer to have other party members at least throw me a "ty" when I Haste/Rage/Resist them with my sorcerer, rather than having them take it for granted because, to them, that's what I am "supposed" to do.

[Mister_Peace]

Cleric/FVS is expected to heal in a group-environment.
Rogue is expected to do traps.
Bard is expected to have songs/rage/haste.
Barb/fighter/pally are expected to bring DPS and or intim.
Wiz are expected to have rage/haste and a few other buffs, CC, death spells, and some nukes.
Sorc are expected to have rage/haste and a few other buffs, nukes, and possibly situational CCs.
Everyone is expected to have heals/remove curse/remove poison/heavy fort/lots of HP......
This is all standard *in addition* to whatever flavor you are currently working on, on your particular toon.

There are alot of expectations in place for everyone. None of it is rude. Its just how the game is played, particularly once we leave the harbor and market quests behind us. Its like going to a pot-luck dinner party and not bringing a dish.

+1, also Rangers are expected to have a bow.

Edit: to address the above post, this is not "you must only do this"
this is "if you join a LFM, people will expect you to be able to do this"

[phillymiket]

1. my blue bar is for me to pew pew with, not to increase your kill count
2. they sell haste potions at the vendor so if its that important to you there is no excuse not to have it
3. there are tons of haste clickies in the game that let you buff the whole party, in fact it is more efficient for a melee to be the haster because you are acutely aware of when haste wears out and have a better chance of catching all the hitters together

3.a. a t2 greensteel has 3 charges at level 16 which is about 90 seconds a pop
http://www.iro.umontreal.ca/~delalle...lectric_abs_10

the morning star is the cheapest blank using no horn and only 1 funk

make 2 of those and that is 9 minutes of haste per shrine, no arcane needed

4. all my 6 mans are byoh which also stands for "bring your own haste"

1. The kills are our kills not my kills, not your kills.
2. Stopping every 30 seconds to chug a pot takes a lot of the advantage of faster melee away.
3. The Haste timer is in the upper right hand corner of the screen. You can see it as a caster quite well.
3.a. Agreed. Haste clickies are good.
4. Hasted 6 mans just finish faster.

Dunno, I like buffing the party on my casters.

The whole of a party working together is far greater then the sum of its parts.

[Vellrad]

3. The Haste timer is in the upper right hand corner of the screen. You can see it as a caster quite well.

Caster usually is not in meele range, together with meeles, so ho can't see when haste runs out. Not to mention, that casters usually got more buffs than meeles, and you can have only 27 1/2 buff displayed.